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RobertMBlevins

Sep 30, 2012, 12:24 PM
Post #36501 of 56495 (44758 views)
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Re: [Farflung] Who Wants To Be A Drama Queen? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Does every Cooper story have to be packed with drama and behaviors which only exist on TV or in the movies? I mean really, who drives to Bonney Lake to change the brand of smokes? It is pure BS.

Excuse me for living...but it is NOT 'pure BS'.

This is what happened over the week that Decoded was filming in Bonney Lake, and how Helen Jones came to be a witness:

1) We shot a segment at the former Borders' books in Southcenter that was never aired. After that, I was off for a few days. The Decoded guys wanted me to drive up to Twisp one last time and see if I could get a sixth interview with Margie Geestman. They loaned me a hi-def video camera suitable for TV use and off I went.

2) I met with Margie at her ranch in Twisp. During my previous visit, I had left her a copy of Blast and she had read it. This time, I pressed her a bit harder and pointed to the evidence against her ex-husband and Kenny Christiansen. Unlike the other interviews, she finally admitted that Kenny 'could' have been involved along with her ex in the hijacking. I recorded her statements on video, and also with a digital voice recorder. (Decoded kept the video, I kept the voice recording. It was not used in the final version of the program, although I think they should have used it. They told me they just couldn't fit it in the 44 minutes of actual programming.)

3) One of the things that Margie told me was that a lady named Helen Jones had also known Christiansen for many years. I called Porteous and he verified that Jones was a known associate of Christiansen, but he didn't know how close they were, or how long they had known each other. He considered her a minor witness at best.

4) After I returned to Auburn, I located Jones. She lived in Sumner, and said she had known Christiansen from about 1967 until his death. She claimed to have pictures from the Geestmans' wedding in '68 showing the Geestmans and Christiansen together. She also mentioned that Geestman had been Best Man at the wedding of her friends Joe and Ann Grimes at near the same time. I didn't think much about this comment. I told her I was doing a bio on Christiansen's life and could she meet me at her house. She said yes, and we set a time for the next day. (A Saturday)

5) The next morning, she called me. "Why exactly do you want to talk to me about Kenny?" she asked. So I had to tell her. He was being investigated for the Cooper case. She 'went off' on me on the phone, telling me I had a lot of nerve insinuating that her friend Kenny could be a criminal. ('It's not nice to speak ill of the dead, you know'.) She was REALLY pissed off at me and I figured it was going to be a zero on the interview. However, she agreed to meet me anyway.

6) Nice ranch home near the White River: I pull up in the driveway and see a yellow Cadillac and a big Chevy pickup. Jones comes to the door and doesn't look happy, but lets me in. I had brought the photo displays mounted on white foam that I used at the Auburn Avenue Theatre. I gave her a copy of Blast. We sat down and talked about Kenny for a while. She finally stops me. "Can you leave me those displays for a while?" she says. "I want to read them." I tell her I can go into town for lunch while she examines them. She's very upset. So I leave for the hamburger joint downtown.

7) After I return, it's a completely different atmosphere. She will answer questions. "No pictures and no recordings," Jones says. I asked why. She was afraid of Bernie Geestman, she replies. "He's a crook, and that's why Margie divorced him." Okay, fine. No recordings. We speak for hours. She doesn't know if Kenny and Bernie were the hijackers. She shows me pictures of the Geestmans' wedding and I ask if I can take them and scan them at my office. She says yes...as long as I leave the photo displays as a sort of collateral. She hadn't read them all yet. I take the pictures and leave. We set another interview for the next morning.

8) Second Day: Jones and I sit at her dining room table all day. This time her daughter is there, who was about 13 or 14 in 1971 and also knew Christiansen. Between the two of them, they fill in what details they can about events over the week of the hijacking. Thanksgiving dinner, etc. and Kenny later admitting he was with Geestman over the time of the hijacking. This is the second witness who has said this about these men, and I already have Mrs Geestman admitting that Kenny and Bernie could have been the hijackers, after months of denials on Kenny. Interesting, since Mrs Geestman and Mrs Jones have not spoken for decades, yet both now give the same story on when the men went missing. But Mrs Jones adds something extra: She says she ran into Kenny six weeks after the hijacking down at the old Sumner Laundromat, and asked him why he missed Thanksgiving dinner at her house. Kenny says he was with Geestman. (Later, on Decoded, Geestman says he thinks Kenny could be the hijacker, which is a very strange thing to say when he was WITH Kenny over the hijacking.)

9) Jones says that some things she wondered about a long time ago are beginning to make sense. Like Kenny going from dirt-poor to 'doing quite well' by the next Thanksgiving. He did attend Thanksgiving the following year in '72 and said the airline was paying him very well. I asked her if she knew anything on how Kenny got his house for cash in Bonney Lake. She doesn't know the exact arrangements, but says he bought it from a couple she knew, Joe and Ann Grimes. She knows this because Bernie Geestman was the Best Man at the Grimes' wedding, she says. (Later, we were able to get a copy of the sale document on the adjoining lot to the house. The names match what Jones has claimed, and Porteous and I already knew that Kenny bought the lot and house from the same people, but until then, not their names) I ask her if she knows the brand of cigarettes Kenny smoked. Camels, she thinks. (I was disappointed in this answer, of course, but I said nothing.) I ask her if she could verify that Geestman owned a station wagon and Airstream trailer in 1971. She says yes. In fact, just after Thanksgiving in 1972, the year everyone actually showed up for dinner at her house, they had a fire. The fire was on Christmas Eve, '72. Geestman lent her family the trailer while the house was being rebuilt. Then, she says he sold it as soon as the house repairs were complete. She says it was sold to an out-of-state buyer who took it back to Arizona. (Geestman had the trailer sold the minute the house was finished, she said.) During the interview, she mentions casually that one of the things Kenny did after he first moved into his house was to change out the countertops in the kitchen. (Big deal, I think) I finally ask if she would be willing to appear on Decoded. No. She's afraid of Geestman. I take everything I have, the notes, etc and leave.

10) I'm due to appear at the Bonney Lake library for the final segment the next day. They've already filmed the segment at Kenny's old house with Rattenbury, but I haven't heard anything about how that went. I show up around 11AM at the library and everyone's having lunch. Pete Berg, the associate producer, comes up to me and says: "A lady named Helen Jones was here earlier this morning. She says she knew Kenny and had talked to you. We asked her to appear on the show, but she said she was afraid of Bernie." Okay, I ask, what did she want? "Just wanted to tell you that Christiansen smoked Raleigh cigarettes, not Camels. Do you know what she means?" Berg wasn't real familiar with the case details, so I told him the significance. "Damn," he said, "too bad we can't get her to go on the show." Then Berg tells me about the hiding spot they found in the attic of Christiansen's old house. Covered with a big piece of old Formica countertop. Holy crap, I think. I tell Berg about Jones saying that Kenny changed out the counters after he moved in. This has to be more than coincidence. I had a little time before filming, so I run over to Rattenbury's place and ask him if I can look up in the attic. I borrow his ladder, go up, take pictures...and put the countertop piece into a plastic bag and take it with me. (With permission) I go back to the library and we film the final segment in which I appear. Geestman is due up next, but the crew is afraid he won't talk if he sees me, although they offer to give me a mobile sound unit and let me listen in. I'm tired, so I pass on that and go home.

11) Later: Marisa Kagan tells me that Bernie wasn't very cooperative, and before he appeared on the show he first denied knowing Christiansen ('I thought he was a dishwasher') and that Geestman had called his sister Dawn and told her she should retract everything she said for the Blast book. Kagan got this from Dawn herself, when she called her to possibly appear on the show. Dawn tells Kagan that she was sticking by everything she said, but refuses to appear and testify against her brother. Kagan responds to all of this by sending Bernie Geestman twenty different photos showing he and Kenny Christiansen together. He agrees to appear.

That's pretty much the whole story. I still have the audio recording where Margie Geestman finally admits Kenny and Bernie could have been the hijackers, after five previous interviews where she pointed to her husband, but kept up a denial on Kenny.

I did not 'lead' people along. I merely asked questions. It is not my fault that Geestman lied, nor my fault that Jones said the things she did, some of which were confirmed by her daughter. Do I know if Kenny and Bernie pulled off the hijacking? Hell, no. Do I think the Seattle FBI should question these people? Hell, yes. Smile

I know this post was sort of difficult to follow, but I tried my best on it. That's all I can say. LOL you think doing this was easy? Cool I've also attached a pic of producer Marisa Kagan, who was pretty good at cutting through BS, especially from a guy like Bernie Geestman. Although I have never met her in person, I'm reasonably sure it's her. You can reach her via Facebook to verify some of the things I posted here.


(This post was edited by RobertMBlevins on Sep 30, 2012, 2:24 PM)
Attachments: generaldisplaypic.gif (250 KB)
  weddingkennylookingon2.gif (172 KB)
  dawnjsalon.jpg (113 KB)
  taxdeedwithtex2.gif (266 KB)
  mkagan.jpg (10.9 KB)


mrshutter45

Sep 30, 2012, 12:34 PM
Post #36502 of 56495 (44751 views)
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Re: [RobertMBlevins] Who Wants To Be A Drama Queen? [In reply to] Can't Post

the guy on the left does not look like kenny IMO
the guy in the center is JFK Cool


(This post was edited by mrshutter45 on Sep 30, 2012, 12:46 PM)
Attachments: weddingkennylookingon2.gif (168 KB)


Farflung

Sep 30, 2012, 1:15 PM
Post #36503 of 56495 (44734 views)
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Proof Kenny Is NOT DB Cooper [In reply to] Can't Post

Good eye Mrshutter45, I believe that those are some smokes in that pocket too. But IF (if here) that picture is of Kenny, then there is final proof positive, that he is NOT DB Cooper.

This has been brought up at least eight (8) times as a reason that Gossett could not be Cooper, so it is certified, verified and validated as iron clad and no excuses or crybabies.

Set your faces to stunned when you see this astonishing development! You have been warned, but at least this long, tragic nightmare is finally over.
Attachments: Proof Positive.gif (162 KB)


mrshutter45

Sep 30, 2012, 1:45 PM
Post #36504 of 56495 (44720 views)
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Re: [Farflung] Two weddings in one day!!! [In reply to] Can't Post

Hmmmmmm
Attachments: wedding.JPG (90.2 KB)


RobertMBlevins

Sep 30, 2012, 2:01 PM
Post #36505 of 56495 (44713 views)
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Re: [mrshutter45] Two weddings in one day!!! [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Hmmmmmm (referring to picture of wedding with name 'Watson' on the photo)

Same wedding, Shutter. Geestman is referred to as 'Mike Watson' in Blast. Margie was called 'Katy Watson'. This was for legal reasons. Later, when Bernie came on Decoded, we started referring to him by his real name. We revealed the true identities of the principles after the show aired, with the exception of Bernie's sister, Dawn.

The reason for not revealing Dawn's true name is for her own safety. She mostly lives alone, although her three grandsons and her daughter take turns spending time with her.

I still like Dawn a lot. She's direct, pragmatic, and wasn't afraid to 'tell it like it is'. The only place she drew the line was to refuse to testify against her brother on television. She wouldn't do that, although she stuck to her testimony even after he tried to get her to take everything back.

She remains the ONLY person to positively associate the tie-tac from the FBI picture with a person: Kenny Christiansen. And she did this BEFORE she was told Kenny was being investigated in the Cooper case.


(This post was edited by RobertMBlevins on Sep 30, 2012, 2:11 PM)


Farflung

Sep 30, 2012, 2:18 PM
Post #36506 of 56495 (44699 views)
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Re: [mrshutter45] Two weddings in one day!!! [In reply to] Can't Post

Good attention to detail Mrshutter45. The nom-de-jour of Geestman a couple years ago was ‘Watson’. What adds to the confusion is the fact that RobertMBlevins states that he never uses aliases even though you will see them constantly used. Why he feels the need to make these absurd statements are beyond me.

This confusion is multiplied by his ‘revisions’ which make no reference to the changes nor their cause. Like a paragraph about Captain Scott being deleted from the original version because it was fabricated out of whole cloth by the author. Nope, just a deletion. Same with the names so it can be confusing except that he repeats everything so often that you are going to pick his phantom edits up by osmosis.

So you have Kenny at ‘Watson’s’ (not their real name) and Geestman’s (their real name, maybe) wedding on the same day. But the hairy arms certainly eliminate Kenny from the suspect pool now so it is all moot and no longer matters.

Clearly all the ‘testimony’ is coincidence or pure BS since Kenny is NOT Cooper as ironically established by RobertMBlevins. Strange world.


mrshutter45

Sep 30, 2012, 2:29 PM
Post #36507 of 56495 (44694 views)
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Re: [RobertMBlevins] Two weddings in one day!!! [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:
Hmmmmmm (referring to picture of wedding with name 'Watson' on the photo)

Same wedding, Shutter. Geestman is referred to as 'Mike Watson' in Blast. Margie was called 'Katy Watson'. This was for legal reasons. Later, when Bernie came on Decoded, we started referring to him by his real name. We revealed the true identities of the principles after the show aired, with the exception of Bernie's sister, Dawn.

The reason for not revealing Dawn's true name is for her own safety. She mostly lives alone, although her three grandsons and her daughter take turns spending time with her.

I still like Dawn a lot. She's direct, pragmatic, and wasn't afraid to 'tell it like it is'. The only place she drew the line was to refuse to testify against her brother on television. She wouldn't do that, although she stuck to her testimony even after he tried to get her to take everything back.

She remains the ONLY person to positively associate the tie-tac from the FBI picture with a person: Kenny Christiansen. And she did this BEFORE she was told Kenny was being investigated in the Cooper case.

ok, but we still have problems!

no green on the fairway a top of his head Cool
all of the hair went to his arms Cool
creampuff issues
possible Powderpuff issues Cool
zero pics of rug on the fairway Mad
zero proof money was found on property (hearsay)
the "hiding spot in the attic is questionable because the piece could have been put there for matching the counter top later on, piece was jagged as in left over from a project and thrown in the attic then the new insulation came in and covered it!....possible Cool

also appears he has a "under bite" looking at the "Geestman wedding


(This post was edited by mrshutter45 on Sep 30, 2012, 2:44 PM)


RobertMBlevins

Sep 30, 2012, 3:57 PM
Post #36508 of 56495 (44676 views)
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Re: [Farflung] Two weddings in one day!!! [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Good attention to detail Mrshutter45. The nom-de-jour of Geestman a couple years ago was ‘Watson’. What adds to the confusion is the fact that RobertMBlevins states that he never uses aliases even though you will see them constantly used. Why he feels the need to make these absurd statements are beyond me.

This confusion is multiplied by his ‘revisions’ which make no reference to the changes nor their cause. Like a paragraph about Captain Scott being deleted from the original version because it was fabricated out of whole cloth by the author. Nope, just a deletion. Same with the names so it can be confusing except that he repeats everything so often that you are going to pick his phantom edits up by osmosis.

So you have Kenny at ‘Watson’s’ (not their real name) and Geestman’s (their real name, maybe) wedding on the same day. But the hairy arms certainly eliminate Kenny from the suspect pool now so it is all moot and no longer matters.

Clearly all the ‘testimony’ is coincidence or pure BS since Kenny is NOT Cooper as ironically established by RobertMBlevins. Strange world.

You are either 'playing dumb' with some of these statements or...

You are perfectly aware we disguised the names of the Geestmans for the book, and that their true names were revealed in January 2011 after Decoded first aired. You are also aware that prior to the Decoded show, Bruce Smith really got mad when I wouldn't reveal their names.

The idea that we pulled the original version of Blast within a short time (and before 50 copies sold) and revised it shows a bit of responsibility on our part. You think getting all the details right between Porteous and I, working strictly through emails and phone calls was EASY? That was my first collaboration, and doing it that way is tough. There were bound to be glitches, and I warned Porteous the book wasn't ready. The Scott-went-to-the-cabin story was one of those. I saw that reference on a webpage that related the story of the hijacking and I assumed it was real. And it wasn't. Tell you the truth, I'm not even certain that's how it got into the book. Maybe Porteous sent it in one of his emails. It doesn't really matter much, since Scott is dead and can't be a witness anyway, nor does it shed any light on whether KC was the guy or not. In any case, we took it out.

The ONLY alias used in public now is the one for Dawn, Bernie's sister, and that isn't much of an alias since any decent researcher could probably find her anyway, since they would know she has a brother, and that we gave the brother's true name.

ALL true names and addresses of these folks were provided to the Seattle FBI.

And if you REALLY believe all the evidence, all the testimony is simply 'coincidence,' there isn't much I can do about that. My main problem with Gossett as the hijacker isn't the fact he has hairy arms, but that Galen Cook hasn't established an alibi for Gossett, and has used old pictures of Gossett to compare to the sketch.

I notice you dance around a lot with issues that really have nothing to do with whether Christiansen was the hijacker or not. But you're afraid to address the REAL issues, such as the testimony of Jones, or Bernie's sister Dawn, or the lies of Bernie Geestman, which are not only many and legend...but all done to distance himself from any possible involvement.

Never said I could prove Kenny was the guy, but that post back there...the LONG one...I stand by that completely.

And by the way...there weren't 'multiple revisions' of the book. Only ONE. And it's been out for close to two years now. You should try to co-author a book with more than 40 pictures with someone you never get to meet, and only communicate via phone or email. Try that sometime. Then maybe you'll appreciate the difficulty of doing it.


(This post was edited by RobertMBlevins on Sep 30, 2012, 4:05 PM)


skyjack71

Sep 30, 2012, 4:19 PM
Post #36509 of 56495 (44665 views)
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Re: [georger] Who said What! [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Kenny's photo was probably f/8 being an old Brownie
620 fixed lens f/5.6-f/8 or Kodak 35mm shot at f/8.

That would explain why the scales in these photos is
roughly the same, except for the differences
Farflung noted.

Comments?

SmileGeorger,

It could have been a polaroid. Some of the photos I have of Duane from that time period were taken with a polaroid - and why the detail is NOT too great on certain photos. The 1970 or 1971 photo I used where I cut the wife out of the photo - was a polaroid shot.

If someone was going to do a picture that would show the subject presenting themselves as a suspect in a major crime, I seriously do NOT think they would have taken it into a local Drug Store to be developed.


skyjack71

Sep 30, 2012, 4:30 PM
Post #36510 of 56495 (44626 views)
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Re: [matthewcline] Who said What! [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Jo, I do not "poke" at you, you just take every question personally.

There are many "Wavy Greenes", but it is not my job to prove Weber is Cooper, it is my job to call into question things I see or think are wrong.

I also see no "revelation" in Duane's fraudulent enlistment to the Army. He got caught before he could do much, so if there is a record, and it survived the fires in the warehouse, it would be pretty thin. But I also think the Navy record, IMO, would be thin, but to you it may be in "great detail".

I hope last night you found the evidence that proves us all wrong, and is the true story.

I never said he couldn't be Cooper, just doubt he was, as I have not seen any direct evidence that makes the logical leap.

Matt

You avoid my question.
Was there a Wavy Greene with any spelling in the ARMY (1941 to 1945) that was only one digit off from Duane's Army serial number? I want to know WHY the FBI lied to me or if they actually made that kind of mistake.

The FBI KNEW the letter gave a month and day in 1943 and was addressed from Camp Siebert, Alabama. I provided the FBI the envelope this letter was mailed in around 2003 or 2004 (I am not certain of the date and I am not going to pull the old FBI receipt for the DNA I provided).

Attention Georger:
This was when the FBI was checking DNA. Wonder if the DNA that was pulled from that envelope had the KPD signals in the DNA. Something interesting to consider - you think?


RobertMBlevins

Sep 30, 2012, 4:44 PM
Post #36511 of 56495 (44622 views)
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Re: [skyjack71] Who said What! [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:
Kenny's photo was probably f/8 being an old Brownie
620 fixed lens f/5.6-f/8 or Kodak 35mm shot at f/8.

That would explain why the scales in these photos is
roughly the same, except for the differences
Farflung noted.

Comments?

SmileGeorger,

It could have been a polaroid. Some of the photos I have of Duane from that time period were taken with a polaroid - and why the detail is NOT too great on certain photos. The 1970 or 1971 photo I used where I cut the wife out of the photo - was a polaroid shot.

If someone was going to do a picture that would show the subject presenting themselves as a suspect in a major crime, I seriously do NOT think they would have taken it into a local Drug Store to be developed.

Wasn't a Polaroid. I have the original. Just a standard print with the date printed on the front by the developer. Says 'Feb 72'. Christmas wreath says it was probably taken the previous December. And why would the picture be so damning? Just a guy walking into an apartment holding a briefcase and a white paper bag...


skyjack71

Sep 30, 2012, 4:51 PM
Post #36512 of 56495 (44620 views)
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Re: [mrshutter45] Facial Expressions [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
the guy on the left does not look like kenny IMO
the guy in the center is JFK Cool

Yea, that is Kenny and he not only has a receding hair line - he is bald on top and into the back.

Note his lower lip - when he smiles or even if he frowned that lower lip and chin goes forward. To much so to be Cooper. Since I happen to know about an expression Cooper made during the skyjacking (told to the composite artist) and might not be in the official records. This artist talked to the witness and tried to make them comfortable and engaged them in conversation. One of the witnesses was very adamant about an expression Cooper made. Before Doug Pasternack could tell me what it was -I STOPPED him and told him what the expression or motion was.

This was ONE of those moments when I knew something about Cooper that had NOT been MADE public. Doug NOR I will EVER forget that phone call. This action was one Duane used when ever he wanted to drive his point home. The expression is NOT one commonly used in the same manner as Cooper used it...Weber had a little quirk about this expression which made it a little different than someone else making the same jester or expression of displeasure or irritation.

NOW WATCH Blevins and others USE this regarding their subjects..

P.S. I compose my posts on line and do not read below the post I am addressing. When I posted the above statements I then read the post Mrsshutter had written. I will assure all of you from what the artist stated there was no bite problem with Cooper, but he was expressive with a part of his anatomy.


(This post was edited by skyjack71 on Sep 30, 2012, 5:12 PM)


skyjack71

Sep 30, 2012, 4:56 PM
Post #36513 of 56495 (44619 views)
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Re: [RobertMBlevins] Stepping BACK on your own TOES. [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
She remains the ONLY person to positively associate the tie-tac from the FBI picture with a person: Kenny Christiansen. And she did this BEFORE she was told Kenny was being investigated in the Cooper case.

Excuse me - your own post prove that is an incorrect statement. If she didn't know why you were there and you left the pictures with her so she could make up her mind. THEN when you get back she is talking and then the next day....gimme a break! This is from what you have posted on this thread - I have NOT read your book.


(This post was edited by skyjack71 on Sep 30, 2012, 4:57 PM)


Robert99

Sep 30, 2012, 5:46 PM
Post #36514 of 56495 (44596 views)
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Re: [RobertMBlevins] Who said What! [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Just a guy walking into an apartment holding a briefcase and a white paper bag...

Blevins, Have you noticed that is a rather big "briefcase" and that it appears to have a "destination label" on it?

Would you consider it possible that it is actually a small "suitcase" and that KC is just returning from a working trip for NWA? Maybe he dropped his purser's uniform off at a dry cleaners between SEA and his apartment.

Robert99


mrshutter45

Sep 30, 2012, 5:51 PM
Post #36515 of 56495 (44592 views)
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Re: [Robert99] Who said What! [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:
Just a guy walking into an apartment holding a briefcase and a white paper bag...

Blevins, Have you noticed that is a rather big "briefcase" and that it appears to have a "destination label" on it?

Would you consider it possible that it is actually a small "suitcase" and that KC is just returning from a working trip for NWA? Maybe he dropped his purser's uniform off at a dry cleaners between SEA and his apartment.

Robert99

I have always thought it was a pilots briefcase!!


(This post was edited by mrshutter45 on Sep 30, 2012, 5:57 PM)
Attachments: _black_pilot_case.jpg (24.4 KB)
  case.JPG (155 KB)


Robert99

Sep 30, 2012, 5:56 PM
Post #36516 of 56495 (44589 views)
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Re: [mrshutter45] Who said What! [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:
In reply to:
Just a guy walking into an apartment holding a briefcase and a white paper bag...

Blevins, Have you noticed that is a rather big "briefcase" and that it appears to have a "destination label" on it?

Would you consider it possible that it is actually a small "suitcase" and that KC is just returning from a working trip for NWA? Maybe he dropped his purser's uniform off at a dry cleaners between SEA and his apartment.

Robert99

I have always thought it was a pilots briefcase!!

I think it's too big to be a pilot's case.

Robert99


mrshutter45

Sep 30, 2012, 5:59 PM
Post #36517 of 56495 (44587 views)
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Re: [Robert99] Who said What! [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:
In reply to:
In reply to:
Just a guy walking into an apartment holding a briefcase and a white paper bag...

Blevins, Have you noticed that is a rather big "briefcase" and that it appears to have a "destination label" on it?

Would you consider it possible that it is actually a small "suitcase" and that KC is just returning from a working trip for NWA? Maybe he dropped his purser's uniform off at a dry cleaners between SEA and his apartment.

Robert99

I have always thought it was a pilots briefcase!!

I think it's too big to be a pilot's case.

Robert99

keep in mind that it is old school, I posted a pic


mrshutter45

Sep 30, 2012, 6:06 PM
Post #36518 of 56495 (44579 views)
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Re: [mrshutter45] Who said What! [In reply to] Can't Post

same type case..just a different color

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VgaahBvqj-8


RobertMBlevins

Sep 30, 2012, 6:25 PM
Post #36519 of 56495 (44571 views)
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Re: [Robert99] Who said What! [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:
Just a guy walking into an apartment holding a briefcase and a white paper bag...

Blevins, Have you noticed that is a rather big "briefcase" and that it appears to have a "destination label" on it?

Would you consider it possible that it is actually a small "suitcase" and that KC is just returning from a working trip for NWA? Maybe he dropped his purser's uniform off at a dry cleaners between SEA and his apartment.

Robert99

I don't presume to know the meaning of the picture, or where the heck Kenny was before it was taken. We certainly don't think the bag and the briefcase were the ones used in the hijacking. (I get asked that a lot, LOL) This is all we really know for sure on it:

It was taken before Feb 72 in the doorway of apartment J-3, at the Rainier View Apartments in Sumner, WA.

Date stamp on the pic says 'Feb 72,' but there is a Christmas wreath on the door.

Rental record on Christiansen for this place is incomplete, but we know two things. He wasn't there before June of 1970 and not there after July of 1972. The other is that he lived there alone.

Since these apartments are single-level, and J-3 is only two doors down from the manager's apartment, we don't think Kenny sneaked in a roommate. Also, the office area in the manager's apartment extends out a bit from the main building and there are windows. This means the manager could just look out his windows and see anyone coming and going from J-3 easily.

Unless he used a timer, the picture was taken by someone else.

The print is 'square' with a white border, not rectangular. Most versions I published are cropped at the side. In the chair on Kenny's left, there is a newspaper. (Less-cropped version attached below. For the completely uncropped, I will have to re-scan the image. Only thing not showing is more of the blinds on both sides. There is a window on both sides of the door.)

He isn't smiling in the picture, except for a little 'Mona Lisa' smile. In any event, if it isn't a self-portrait, then I think he knew the person taking it.

It looks like he might be wearing TWO shirts, as well as the coat. Look at his left wrist and notice the tan-colored sleeve. But the coat looks unbuttoned, with a darker shirt beneath.

The white bag has what looks like two red, or dark-colored lines across it near the bottom.

He isn't holding a set of keys that can be seen, although the way he's holding the bag, the keys could be in his right hand. (Kenny was left-handed)

The picture was found several years after Kenny's death behind another picture in one of his old photo albums.


(This post was edited by RobertMBlevins on Sep 30, 2012, 6:52 PM)
Attachments: kennybriefcaseskipp.gif (243 KB)


Farflung

Sep 30, 2012, 8:06 PM
Post #36520 of 56495 (44576 views)
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Re: [mrshutter45] Who said What! [In reply to] Can't Post

I think Mrshutte45 is correct about the ‘Flight Bag’. It has been identified in the past on this quality thread, as a standard cosmetics sample bag (as if) to an ordinary brief case. You can always count on the DBC thread to supply accuracy and sane input. Then silence on the subject.

We always carried at least one or two of such ‘bags’ (each) on every flight. Think about all the SIDs and approach plates for the US along with the low and high instrument charts. Yep, they were packed in their like sardines too. Not like the virtually empty example with Clint.

Those bags also contained the operating manuals for the aircraft which were in volumes in those funky binders that had a pull pin that kept them bound. When we would be waiting on the ramp for transportation, they would become seats also.

The briefcase used by DB Cooper was described as nothing like this type of case. But you must remember that identifying briefcases are more difficult in an aircraft then they are out in the open. Unless the person has hairy arms, then he isn’t DB Cooper. Ever.


georger

Sep 30, 2012, 8:24 PM
Post #36521 of 56495 (44572 views)
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Re: [RobertMBlevin - Kenny photos [In reply to] Can't Post

 
Wasn't a Polaroid. I have the original. Just a standard print with the date printed on the front by the developer. Says 'Feb 72'. Christmas wreath says it was probably taken the previous December. And why would the picture be so damning? Just a guy walking into an apartment holding a briefcase and a white paper bag...
Just curious - any markings on the paper back -
Kodak?


mrshutter45

Sep 30, 2012, 8:40 PM
Post #36522 of 56495 (44564 views)
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Re: [Farflung] Who said What! [In reply to] Can't Post

I think the picture was some sort of gag between him and some guys, it's possible he used this case while walking through the airport so he could be taken as a pilot? who knows.

if you watched the Clint Eastwood pilot clip it appears to be about the same case, when asked what was in it, he replied charts and flight plans Cool


georger

Sep 30, 2012, 8:51 PM
Post #36523 of 56495 (44561 views)
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Re: [mrshutter45] Who said What! [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
I think the picture was some sort of gag between him and some guys, it's possible he used this case while walking through the airport so he could be taken as a pilot? who knows.

if you watched the Clint Eastwood pilot clip it appears to be about the same case, when asked what was in it, he replied charts and flight plans Cool

Its never hit me as a gag as much as an ordinary
photo of the guy walking through a door arriving
home, maybe homecoming? Birthday party arrival?
Looks a little surprised - likehe's saying something
or about to ?


mrshutter45

Sep 30, 2012, 8:58 PM
Post #36524 of 56495 (44559 views)
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Re: [georger] Who said What! [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:
I think the picture was some sort of gag between him and some guys, it's possible he used this case while walking through the airport so he could be taken as a pilot? who knows.

if you watched the Clint Eastwood pilot clip it appears to be about the same case, when asked what was in it, he replied charts and flight plans Cool

Its never hit me as a gag as much as an ordinary
photo of the guy walking through a door arriving
home, maybe homecoming? Birthday party arrival?
Looks a little surprised - likehe's saying something
or about to ?

hard to say, the door seems to have aready been open, he would have had to put something down or juggle things and this would have been caught as he came thru the door if it was closed and as Robert said he has no keys? he is just crossing the threshold when the pic was snapped Cool

remember this just happened if the date is correct so I'm sure this was the subject of discussion for some time, room for a joke or two.....


(This post was edited by mrshutter45 on Sep 30, 2012, 9:09 PM)


mrshutter45

Sep 30, 2012, 9:22 PM
Post #36525 of 56495 (44542 views)
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Re: [mrshutter45] Who said What! [In reply to] Can't Post

did he play the accordion??????????
Attachments: accord.JPG (42.1 KB)


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