Sep 21, 2012, 5:19 AM
Post #1 of 15
i have a sabre1 150 loaded at 1.4........ i like it, its quite docile and i flare and land it great, but i definitely find that front riser turns build up IMMENSE pressure and i can only make it through a complete 360 degree front riser turn before i have to let off the fronts.......
will a sabre2 at the same size have lighter front riser pressure because its semi elliptical? how bout a spectre in the same size?
Pretty much every canopy I've owned will max out on front risers after the first 360degrees. If you want to keep the turn going past that you will need to start adding harness input as you come up to the 270degree point. My usually turn on a velocity 84 is a 630, the risers are rock solid after the first 270, it's all harness after that point. Worth noting that harness imput is very effective on highly loaded wings, your sabre will probably need quite a bit of physical effort to keep the rotation going past 360 degrees, a sabre 2 will probaly be very slightly easier due to being tapered rather than rectangle.
thanks for the heads up.......what ive been doing is starting the turn with harness input as well as riser input at the same time.............next jump i will crank my riser and then try to bury all my hip weight into the turn and see if i can keep going...........
Instead of starting a new thread, I just found this one, so I will ask my question here. I just downsized from sabre 2 170 (1.35) to sabre 2 150 (1.5), which was approved by the DZ s&ta. I have been doing double front approaches on the 170, and have been able to dive the canopy for about 5 seconds before the pressure builds where I have to release to enter the landing phase. With the 150, I was expecting the pressure to be less and I could dive the canopy longer. Turns out it is the opposite. I can barely Double front dive the canopy for 3 seconds before they are ripped from my hands. Naturally, the recovery of the 150 is a bit longer than the 170, but I could dive the 170 for longer so the end resulting "swoop" or surf of the 2 is about the same. When I went from my 190 s2 to 170 Sabre 2 the riser pressure was less, so why not now with the 150? This is kind of a curve ball to me in my journey to learn HP canopy landings.
When I went from my 190 s2 to 170 Sabre 2 the riser pressure was less, so why not now with the 150?
Increased wing load f/ the 170 to the 150. I previewed your profile and judging by your jump numbers you shouldn't be flying such a high wing load just yet. Is you DZO & S&TA gonna help you out when something happens. (Hope it doesn't, but this is a dangerous sport.) Just sayin'
This is kind of a curve ball to me in my journey to learn HP canopy landings.
your curve ball is that you downsized to such a high wingloading before learning this stuff. If you are having double front issues now just wait till you incorporate turns for your landings or even worse planning out on rears. the thing about high performance landings is its like starting out all over again and you are going to make mistakes.
to answer your question, it sounds like your canopy is trying to recover. chances are with the downsize you are able to pull the risers down faster and further than with your 170. the faster you start a dive the faster it will recover. pulling the fronts down further is giving you more speed=lift. between the two your canopy is trying to recover to full flight sooner than you want. try unloading your canopy by cycling and as your canopy starts tipping back forward pull the fronts, it will make it easier to pull down and wont try to rip out you hands. it will start trying to gain lift again after a while so you only need about 4 seconds on double fronts, and start releasing your risers smooth for the recovery.
also all this info may be wrong and get you hurt or killed. i suggest you take some canopy courses. beginner and intermediate. they are worth it! good luck! you will need luck on your side!
(This post was edited by ridebmxbikes on Dec 2, 2013, 4:35 PM)
Upsize bro!!' Learn your 170 then downsize. Like I always tell guys downsizing... Don't downsize until YOU can do everything with your current canopy... I think IMO you just want to tell people you're flying a small canopy.
I cant pull the risers down faster or further with the 150. Its harder to pull them even from 1/4 brakes and cant hold them as long. Since it is higher wingload, I guess that is why. It was the opposite on my previous downsize though. I've got about 150 double front approaches on the 170. Half of those are landing or planing out on rears, then transitioning to brakes. On the upside harness turns are easier, which makes sense.
Yes, this was the first thing I did when I jumped the canopy for the first time, like I learned in the flight 1 course. Luckily, they were quite long. Pulled on the brakes while looking up to see when it started moving the tail. Its a good 6 -7 inches. Pulling on the fronts while looking up, there is no tail deflection. I'm actually getting my brakes lines shortened a bit b/c the sweet spot in the flare is lower than I was used to.
with smaller highly loaded canopies you dont pull your risers, its all harness input. It also keeps your wing from deforming while picking up alot of speed. therefore not bleeding off the speed your generated.
(This post was edited by swoopfly on Dec 4, 2013, 6:18 AM)