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Tandem student comfort under canopy

 


jf951  (D License)

Aug 14, 2012, 9:47 PM
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Tandem student comfort under canopy Can't Post

I'd like to hear from some of you other TIs
what are your tips and tricks to maximize student comfort under canopy for both skinny people and larger people.


browny05  (F 752)

Aug 14, 2012, 11:27 PM
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Re: [jf951] Tandem student comfort under canopy [In reply to] Can't Post

UPT harness.
Get them to lift their knees up and slide their bum back in the harness putting the leg straps under their thighs a little more, making it more like a chair,
makes it more comfortable for them, means theyre not hanging therefore better blood flow (fem. arterry) which means less chance of fainting or vomiting. Also makes it easier for them to get their legs up for landing.
For big busted girls loosen the chest strap with their permission.


Premier slotperfect  (D 13014)
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Aug 15, 2012, 2:47 AM
Post #3 of 18 (1518 views)
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Re: [jf951] Tandem student comfort under canopy [In reply to] Can't Post

1) Loosen the side attachment straps - disconnect, loosen, re-attach.
2) Loosen their chest strap. For women, I have already briefed them on the ground that the chest strap moving up and tightening up will be uncomfortable so I loosen it up once we are under canopy. If they know it's coming, any incidental contact is no big deal. For well endowed women, built such that I can't see the chest strap, I ask them to put my hands on it. They usually appreciate the effort and like the more comfortable result. Don't loosen it up to far or it will interfere with their arms.
3) If necessary, I have them stand on my feet and slide the leg pads down under the meaty part of their thighs. I used to do this on every jump with the old Vector II harness; it's not needed that often with the Sigma harness.
4) Put their goggles on their forehead (our students wear frap hats), unless they wear contacts or it's really cold, in which case I leave them on until we're in the landing pattern.
5) Guide them through clearing their ears using the valsalva technique.


riggerrob  (D 14840)

Aug 15, 2012, 11:42 AM
Post #4 of 18 (1442 views)
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Re: [slotperfect] Tandem student comfort under canopy [In reply to] Can't Post

"
In reply to:
... 2) Loosen their chest strap. For women, I have already briefed them on the ground that the chest strap moving up and tightening up will be uncomfortable so I loosen it up once we are under canopy. If they know it's coming, any incidental contact is no big deal. For well endowed women, built such that I can't see the chest strap, I ask them to put my hands on it. They usually appreciate the effort and like the more comfortable result. Don't loosen it up to far or it will interfere with their arms. ...
"

.....................................................................

Talking them through the gear check process helps reduce any accusations of unwanted sexual touching.

For example: after opening I say: "parachute looks good, lines are straight, slider down, etc."

"Now I am going to check your harness. Left shoulder hook good. Right shoulder hook good."

I slide my hands down the MLWs and say: "Chest strap seems a bit tight. Would you like me to loosen it a bit? ....."
etc.


riggerrob  (D 14840)

Aug 15, 2012, 11:49 AM
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Re: [slotperfect] Tandem student comfort under canopy [In reply to] Can't Post

"
In reply to:
... 3) If necessary, I have them stand on my feet and slide the leg pads down under the meaty part of their thighs. I used to do this on every jump with the old Vector II harness; it's not needed that often with the Sigma harness.
...

........................................................................

The Sigma student harness adjustment process eliminates 90 percent of that fumbling under canopy.
If you adjust the harness so that the harness rides on the FRONT of their hips, it reduces pressure on the femoral artery and naturally lifts their feet out in front for landing.

Strong's Dual Hawk manual (2011 version) explains the same method.
The Sigma process also works well with all the older Strong student harnesses.


pchapman  (D 1014)

Aug 15, 2012, 3:54 PM
Post #6 of 18 (1407 views)
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Re: [riggerrob] Tandem student comfort under canopy [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:

If you adjust the harness so that the harness rides on the FRONT of their hips, it reduces pressure on the femoral artery and naturally lifts their feet out in front for landing.

Agreed. But it is tougher with the fatter people, isn't it? Then the hip junctions [edit: on Sigmas] are supposed to be positioned right at the sides, which makes it harder to lift legs, for the very people who are going to have the least strength to weight ratio to begin with...


(This post was edited by pchapman on Aug 15, 2012, 3:55 PM)


stayhigh  (F 111)

Aug 15, 2012, 4:19 PM
Post #7 of 18 (1397 views)
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Re: [jf951] Tandem student comfort under canopy [In reply to] Can't Post

why don't they make sigma harness with little bit more padding on the leg strap???

shit is not comfortable. Been up there 5 times so far and it sucks every single time.

and I'm not fat either.


riggerrob  (D 14840)

Aug 15, 2012, 4:51 PM
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Re: [pchapman] Tandem student comfort under canopy [In reply to] Can't Post

At some point, you have to refuse to haul fat people.

Pitt Meadows draws the line at 200 pounds for women and 230 pounds for men. Above that, it is a personal decision by the TI.
Hint: PM refuses to charge a "fat tax."


camamel  (D 333)

Aug 15, 2012, 7:21 PM
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Re: [jf951] Tandem student comfort under canopy [In reply to] Can't Post

Well nothing complicated here.

If you jump a Sigma rig, just follow UPT guide lines.
If you jump a different rig and your passengers are not comfortable then buy or ask your DZO to try Sigma's .

Richard


TiaDanger  (A 56121)

Aug 15, 2012, 10:01 PM
Post #10 of 18 (1345 views)
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Re: [riggerrob] Tandem student comfort under canopy [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:

Pitt Meadows draws the line at 200 pounds for women and 230 pounds for men. Above that, it is a personal decision by the TI.

Out of curiosity, why are men allowed the 30 extra pounds? I've heard this weight allowance difference at other DZs as well, but I've often wondered why. Is it because women tend to be shorter, thus a larger weight concentration in a smaller area?


(This post was edited by TiaDanger on Aug 15, 2012, 10:02 PM)


DougH  (D License)

Aug 16, 2012, 4:11 AM
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Re: [TiaDanger] Tandem student comfort under canopy [In reply to] Can't Post

Because on average women should be lower in weight, unless they are tall. A 220 pound woman is going to be both overweight and out of shape unless tall. The body shape is also a problem pear shaped women ooze out of the harness more than beer bellied men.


(This post was edited by DougH on Aug 16, 2012, 4:12 AM)


skydived19006  (D 19006)

Aug 16, 2012, 8:13 AM
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Re: [DougH] Tandem student comfort under canopy [In reply to] Can't Post

Here's a fairly Conservative DZ. This is not my policy. We go to 230 lbs, but do encourage "H/W proportionate."

What is the weight limit?
200lbs for males and 165lbs for females. Participants should be in good physical condition. Sorry, but we have to draw the line somewhere. By setting this standard we are able to provide the best landings and dramatically reduce the chance of injury.


riggerrob  (D 14840)

Aug 16, 2012, 10:42 AM
Post #13 of 18 (1278 views)
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Re: [TiaDanger] Tandem student comfort under canopy [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:

Pitt Meadows draws the line at 200 pounds for women and 230 pounds for men. Above that, it is a personal decision by the TI.

Out of curiosity, why are men allowed the 30 extra pounds? I've heard this weight allowance difference at other DZs as well, but I've often wondered why.

.....................................................................

That is because I have met few physically fit men over 230 pounds and few fit women over 200 pounds.
The more fit they are, the less likely they are to break a leg on landing.

For comparison, I am 6 feet tall and weigh 195 pounds.


theonlyski  (D License)

Aug 17, 2012, 1:43 PM
Post #14 of 18 (1159 views)
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Re: [riggerrob] Tandem student comfort under canopy [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
I slide my hands down the MLWs and say: "Chest strap seems a bit tight. Would you like me to loosen it a bit? ....."
etc.

As they're choking and saying "No, its *cough* fine..." Laugh

I typically have them stand on my feet while I fix the laterals and just about every time I've loosened the chest strap. Perhaps I'm putting it too tightly on them during gear up?


Had a TI with 13000+ jumps meeting the plane today, so I geared his student up in a Strong harness (I'm a SIGMA guy). Had the S&TA (Strong TI) check out the fit because it is a different harness and he said it looked good.

TI came back and asked if it was my SIGMA harness cause it 'fits nicer' than the Strong ones. LaughLaughLaugh


livendive  (D 21415)

Aug 22, 2012, 2:50 PM
Post #15 of 18 (1004 views)
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Re: [slotperfect] Tandem student comfort under canopy [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
1) Loosen the side attachment straps - disconnect, loosen, re-attach.
2) Loosen their chest strap. For women, I have already briefed them on the ground that the chest strap moving up and tightening up will be uncomfortable so I loosen it up once we are under canopy. If they know it's coming, any incidental contact is no big deal. For well endowed women, built such that I can't see the chest strap, I ask them to put my hands on it. They usually appreciate the effort and like the more comfortable result. Don't loosen it up to far or it will interfere with their arms.
3) If necessary, I have them stand on my feet and slide the leg pads down under the meaty part of their thighs. I used to do this on every jump with the old Vector II harness; it's not needed that often with the Sigma harness.
4) Put their goggles on their forehead (our students wear frap hats), unless they wear contacts or it's really cold, in which case I leave them on until we're in the landing pattern.
5) Guide them through clearing their ears using the valsalva technique.

All of this except for the goggles. If they ask me if they can put their goggles up, I say yes, but that's uncommon. Moving the leg straps is only necessary on a small percentage of students. Most of the time, loosening the laterals and chest strap make them right as rain.

Blues,
Dave


livendive  (D 21415)

Aug 22, 2012, 3:05 PM
Post #16 of 18 (1002 views)
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Re: [TiaDanger] Tandem student comfort under canopy [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:

Pitt Meadows draws the line at 200 pounds for women and 230 pounds for men. Above that, it is a personal decision by the TI.

Out of curiosity, why are men allowed the 30 extra pounds? I've heard this weight allowance difference at other DZs as well, but I've often wondered why. Is it because women tend to be shorter, thus a larger weight concentration in a smaller area?

Assuming you're within weight limits on the gear, the only real problem with heavy students (besides being mroe work) is the fat. I affectionatly refer to my heavier females as "flowers", cuz that fat flows everywhere after opening. It just squishes out below the straps and limits her ability to move. I don't have a hard limit for females, but I'm not a fan past 190. It's pretty rare that I'll take one over 200, and then only if she's taller than average. I've taken one woman at 220, but she was 6' of "able to kick MY ass". Men, I've taken plenty in the 220 to 230 range that weren't particularly fat, and one tall somewhat pudgy guy at 245. The key is the guys can lift their legs, whereas the flowers can't.

Our scheduler usually tries to text me before scheduling one outside of norms. Last week, I got a "male, 5'7", 217 lbs?" text, which could theoretically be ok by me if his build is of the short runningback variety (thick but muscular). What I wrote her back was "Age?" and got back a "67". I promptly declined, because by that age many men are going through some "feminization" body changes, i.e. testosterone is fading and taking muscle mass with it. I'm pretty sure that guy was 217 lbs of mostly fat, a male "flower" so to speak.

Blues,
Dave


JohnMitchell  (D 6462)

Aug 23, 2012, 9:15 PM
Post #17 of 18 (952 views)
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Re: [livendive] Tandem student comfort under canopy [In reply to] Can't Post

Remember me standing up that guy that weighed 260? I made $100 on that one skydive. Cool

Thanks for charging the fat fee. Smile


(This post was edited by JohnMitchell on Aug 23, 2012, 9:16 PM)


livendive  (D 21415)

Aug 23, 2012, 9:24 PM
Post #18 of 18 (947 views)
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Re: [JohnMitchell] Tandem student comfort under canopy [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Remember me standing up that guy that weighed 260? I made $100 on that one skydive. Cool

Thanks for charging the fat fee. Smile

Ha ha, actually yes, I do remember that! You earned every penny of it. Best I ever did was that 245 guy. I didn't stand him up, but it was on a 330, in August...such is life lol. I was working at a DZ where they only paid $25 per tandem, but a $2/lb fat fee over 200. So I made $25 for the tandem and another $90 on fat fee. Then he tipped me $50, for a total of $165 on the jump. He was gay, and had grabbed my ass under canopy, but I told him and his partner to bring back every tall fit-but-heavyset guy they could find. lol Laugh

Blues,
Dave



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