Forums: Skydiving: Tandem Skydiving:
Tandem Student shooting hand-cam ???

 

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Skydive2  (D 24800)

Jul 2, 2012, 2:43 PM
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Tandem Student shooting hand-cam ??? Can't Post

I stummbled onto this website. All the pic's/videos show the student(!) wearing the camera. Anyone ever heard of this?? Seems like the worst idea ever!
http://www.funskydiving.com/video.php


TaylorC  (D 29769)

Jul 2, 2012, 3:45 PM
Post #2 of 57 (5854 views)
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Re: [Skydive2] Tandem Student shooting hand-cam ??? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
I stummbled onto this website. All the pic's/videos show the student(!) wearing the camera. Anyone ever heard of this?? Seems like the worst idea ever!
http://www.funskydiving.com/video.php

Everything is a bad idea. Tandem skydiving is a bad idea yet we still do it anyways. People will probably get a shittier product with this way of doing it instead of normal handcam. Gets rid of a few of the risks of normal handcam though.


chuckakers  (D 10855)

Jul 2, 2012, 4:21 PM
Post #3 of 57 (5838 views)
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Re: [Skydive2] Tandem Student shooting hand-cam ??? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
I stummbled onto this website. All the pic's/videos show the student(!) wearing the camera. Anyone ever heard of this?? Seems like the worst idea ever!
http://www.funskydiving.com/video.php

From the company's website:

PHOTO & VIDEO
iPhoto (click yourself with a mini camera mounted on your wrist (click to view sample) $60
iVideo (video yourself with a mini camera mounted on your wrist (Click to watch sample) $90

*** You will shoot your own video using a High Definition micro digital equipment on a wrist mount. Your personalized DVD production is edited with the latest digital editing software available. We are proud to be the FIRST and still the ONLY dropzone in the U.S. to offer online clips of EVERY video taken at NO EXTRA cost. You won't see this ANYWHERE else!




Can't wait to see the student handcam shots combined with this awesome stuff.... http://www.youtube.com/...ExI&feature=fvst (cue in to 5:15 for the real action!)


(This post was edited by chuckakers on Jul 2, 2012, 4:22 PM)
Attachments: backwards tandem CReW.jpg (219 KB)


Abedy

Jul 2, 2012, 10:55 PM
Post #4 of 57 (5757 views)
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Re: [chuckakers] Tandem Student shooting hand-cam ??? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
cue in to 5:15 for the real action!)

Holy shite! CReW with a tandem? Are these folks nuts? Didn't the TI listen to the "NO CReW with tandems" parts during his course? Unbelievable MadCrazyFrown


chuckakers  (D 10855)

Jul 3, 2012, 5:22 AM
Post #5 of 57 (5683 views)
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Re: [Abedy] Tandem Student shooting hand-cam ??? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:
cue in to 5:15 for the real action!)

Holy shite! CReW with a tandem? Are these folks nuts? Didn't the TI listen to the "NO CReW with tandems" parts during his course? Unbelievable MadCrazyFrown

Not just tandem CReW, backwards tandem CReW with the student picking up the grips! From what I understand though, the TI was also the S&TA so I guess it was ok.


Abedy

Jul 3, 2012, 8:35 AM
Post #6 of 57 (5646 views)
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Re: [chuckakers] Tandem Student shooting hand-cam ??? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Not just tandem CReW, backwards tandem CReW with the student picking up the grips! From what I understand though, the TI was also the S&TA so I guess it was ok.

Oh, are we being sarcastic. Well, yeah, like "IF Sheriff Johnstone drives his car on the piss it must be OK, so heck, down this last pint before you get into your car" PirateShocked


popsjumper  (D 999999999)

Jul 3, 2012, 3:35 PM
Post #7 of 57 (5585 views)
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Re: [chuckakers] Tandem Student shooting hand-cam ??? [In reply to] Can't Post

I give up. I just simply give up across the board.


chuckakers  (D 10855)

Jul 3, 2012, 5:28 PM
Post #8 of 57 (5554 views)
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Re: [popsjumper] Tandem Student shooting hand-cam ??? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
I give up. I just simply give up across the board.

Me too, brother.


Andy9o8  (D License)

Jul 4, 2012, 2:35 AM
Post #9 of 57 (5484 views)
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Re: [chuckakers] Tandem Student shooting hand-cam ??? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:
I give up. I just simply give up across the board.

Me too, brother.

It's ok, because, as he says, it's his first skydive ever. What could possibly go wrong?

Countdown til the clip becomes "unavailable". 3, 2, 1...


Premier DSE  (D 29060)
Moderator
Jul 4, 2012, 9:52 AM
Post #10 of 57 (5447 views)
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Re: [Andy9o8] Tandem Student shooting hand-cam ??? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:
In reply to:
I give up. I just simply give up across the board.

Me too, brother.

It's ok, because, as he says, it's his first skydive ever. What could possibly go wrong?

Countdown til the clip becomes "unavailable". 3, 2, 1...

IIRC, the USPA did take punitive action regarding this jump. I recall it being discussed in a BOD meeting, everyone asked to leave for closed session, and was later told it was discussed. I don't know the outcome, however.


matthewcline  (D 21585)

Jul 4, 2012, 10:47 AM
Post #11 of 57 (5429 views)
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Re: [popsjumper] Tandem Student shooting hand-cam ??? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
I give up. I just simply give up across the board.

And some wonder why I didn't renew? I know this is an old video.

But those types of jumps still happen, the T-I's just don't allow the video to be made (for a while, then they sneak out again).

Night Tandems still happen, CRW, <200 jump wonders filming Tandem Students etc etc.

The other thread about the FAA's landing size discussion is only the beginning.

Upside, the FAA will be hiring and I am getting the good old "lay off" slip!

Matt


phoenixlpr  (D 3049)

Jul 4, 2012, 11:53 AM
Post #12 of 57 (5408 views)
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Re: [Skydive2] Tandem Student shooting hand-cam ??? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
I stummbled onto this website. All the pic's/videos show the student(!) wearing the camera. Anyone ever heard of this?? Seems like the worst idea ever!
http://www.funskydiving.com/video.php

How come? An altimeter on the student's wrist does it cause distraction?
I don't think that a tandem student's video would worth anything.
He/She can loose the camera too.


BMFin

Jul 4, 2012, 1:09 PM
Post #13 of 57 (5385 views)
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Re: [phoenixlpr] Tandem Student shooting hand-cam ??? [In reply to] Can't Post

I also came across this a few weeks ago. Heres a samplehttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NsizrFV9s2w

However I cannot come up with any reasons what would make this dangerous. Other than poor framing which makes the video worse than it is when shot by the TI, it actually seems safer since the TI isnt distracted by the camera.


skyjumpenfool  (Student)

Jul 4, 2012, 1:40 PM
Post #14 of 57 (5377 views)
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Re: [BMFin] Tandem Student shooting hand-cam ??? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
However I cannot come up with any reasons what would make this dangerous. Other than poor framing which makes the video worse than it is when shot by the TI, it actually seems safer since the TI isnt distracted by the camera.

USPA recommends 200 jumps to carry a camera. Stricter recommendations for Tandems. That recommendation should include the Tandem Student.

Hopefully, USPA will consider this trend when they turn this recommendation into a BSR. The sooner the better!Unsure


tdog  (D 28800)

Jul 4, 2012, 3:45 PM
Post #15 of 57 (5351 views)
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Re: [skyjumpenfool] Tandem Student shooting hand-cam ??? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
USPA recommends 200 jumps to carry a camera. Stricter recommendations for Tandems. That recommendation should include the Tandem Student.

Hopefully, USPA will consider this trend when they turn this recommendation into a BSR. The sooner the better!Unsure

I am curious... Why? A tandem student can't do much on a skydive other than enjoy the ride... What danger do they pose by having the camera on their hand? I have a few thoughts, but I am curious to yours.


matthewcline  (D 21585)

Jul 4, 2012, 4:07 PM
Post #16 of 57 (5345 views)
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Re: [tdog] Tandem Student shooting hand-cam ??? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:
USPA recommends 200 jumps to carry a camera. Stricter recommendations for Tandems. That recommendation should include the Tandem Student.

Hopefully, USPA will consider this trend when they turn this recommendation into a BSR. The sooner the better!Unsure

I am curious... Why? A tandem student can't do much on a skydive other than enjoy the ride... What danger do they pose by having the camera on their hand? I have a few thoughts, but I am curious to yours.

If they are treated and trained as a Student, they will be plenty busy.

Matt


skyjumpenfool  (Student)

Jul 4, 2012, 4:09 PM
Post #17 of 57 (5345 views)
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Re: [tdog] Tandem Student shooting hand-cam ??? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
I am curious... Why? A tandem student can't do much on a skydive other than enjoy the ride... What danger do they pose by having the camera on their hand? I have a few thoughts, but I am curious to yours.

First of all, if you want good video, hire a pro!

I think most TI's would want the student paying attention when they give them the signal to bring their arms in for deployment and not busy taking mediocre video? That's just one that comes to mind....

However, all this aside, Tandem students should be learning basic skydiving skills like altitude awareness, plane etiquette, arching, ect. Skydiving videography is not a basic skill. Small steps Grasshopper. Smile


(This post was edited by skyjumpenfool on Jul 4, 2012, 4:13 PM)


BMFin

Jul 4, 2012, 5:54 PM
Post #18 of 57 (5318 views)
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Re: [skyjumpenfool] Tandem Student shooting hand-cam ??? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
First of all, if you want good video, hire a pro!

Obviously everyone here can agree a pro can shoot better video. However thats another topic. Lets just focus on the safety question here.

In reply to:
I think most TI's would want the student paying attention when they give them the signal to bring their arms in for deployment and not busy taking mediocre video? That's just one that comes to mind....

However, all this aside, Tandem students should be learning basic skydiving skills like altitude awareness, plane etiquette, arching, ect. Skydiving videography is not a basic skill. Small steps Grasshopper. Smile

Personally I fail to see the tandem customer as a student. On the contrary, I see it as a possibility to experience freefall without needing to go on the skydiving student status.

Hell, we can even take blind person with us on a tandem skydive after 5 minutes of instructions. Would be much different if he/she was a real student.

I still stand behind my point. I see students shooting themselves less dangerous than TIs shooting the student.


skyjumpenfool  (Student)

Jul 5, 2012, 3:56 PM
Post #19 of 57 (5214 views)
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Re: [BMFin] Tandem Student shooting hand-cam ??? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Personally I fail to see the tandem customer as a student. On the contrary, I see it as a possibility to experience freefall without needing to go on the skydiving student status.
Hell, we can even take blind person with us on a tandem skydive after 5 minutes of instructions. Would be much different if he/she was a real student.

Then why are we discussing this in the instructor section?

In reply to:
I still stand behind my point. I see students shooting themselves less dangerous than TIs shooting the student.

I might agree to the point that instructors shooting hand cam is dangerous. Of course it is, that's why we only allow very experienced instructors to do so. However, anyone who has played with cameras during a skydive (any experienced jumper that is) will tell you it's not as easy as it would appear. It's certainly not something for the inexperienced student (or "dead weight" by your definition).

As for sticking to the the safety considerations, I gave you one saftey issue in my post above, that alone should be reason enough. Smile


nigel99  (D 1)

Jul 5, 2012, 5:43 PM
Post #20 of 57 (5184 views)
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Re: [skyjumpenfool] Tandem Student shooting hand-cam ??? [In reply to] Can't Post

It's an interesting topic. I've got zero knowledge of tandem so can't comment either way with any authority.

Personal opinion is that it opens the door to problems. Putting a camera on a tandem passenger, gives them the motivation to capture a shot of the plane they are about to go in, increasing the potential for a prop strike to occur. It increases the snag potential simply by being there.

Commercially it seems to undercut the dzs own income stream. It seems hard to justify charging much, when the client is doing the work. Pretty sure most people who shoot their own video don't care about paying to have it edited. From a business point of view seems it would be better to offer a quality product.


deadwood  (D 9930)

Jul 14, 2012, 5:14 PM
Post #21 of 57 (4893 views)
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Re: [Skydive2] Tandem Student shooting hand-cam ??? [In reply to] Can't Post

When I used to do tandems I had a GOPO mounted facing upwards on an altimeter pillow that I would sometimes put on the tandem passengers belly band. In freefall it gave a nice shot of the passengers face and the cameraman in front of us. After opening it was a good shot of their face and the canopy. I would just turn it on in the plane and forget about it. The passenger hardly ever remembered it was there. It was good to edit in some of that video with the outside video for a complete video of the freefall and canopy ride. I never felt there was any extra risk in that (but Im sure someone here will).


Premier SkymonkeyONE  (D 12501)

Jul 14, 2012, 7:06 PM
Post #22 of 57 (4877 views)
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Re: [Skydive2] Tandem Student shooting hand-cam ??? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
I stummbled onto this website. All the pic's/videos show the student(!) wearing the camera. Anyone ever heard of this?? Seems like the worst idea ever!
http://www.funskydiving.com/video.php

I totally disagree. I would MUCH rather them take their own damn handycam video so I can fly my body. My contour Roam has a 170 degree frame of view and they cannot fuck it up. Seriously.

Chuck, D-12501


stayhigh  (F 111)

Jul 14, 2012, 7:13 PM
Post #23 of 57 (4875 views)
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Re: [Skydive2] Tandem Student shooting hand-cam ??? [In reply to] Can't Post

That should be the handy cam standard.

Put that shit on student's hand and let them film whatever they want.


airbigdaddy  (D 21277)

Jul 18, 2012, 1:21 PM
Post #24 of 57 (4779 views)
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Re: [stayhigh] Tandem Student shooting hand-cam ??? [In reply to] Can't Post

A: Shit video, but if they're willing to pay for it, that's their decision.

B: At least when the sidespin happens because the student is too busy de-arching, head tilted down and hands out so he can get a "great" exit shot, the GoPro will act as a black box to let investigators know what caused the sidespin in the first place.

As I posted in a similar thread a bit back:

"Two quick points: Take them for what they're worth. (To play fair, I've only got about 1,000 tandems under my belt, and I have since retired from doing tandems about a year and a half ago.)

1. To those who mentioned having the student wear a camera as an option: As a T.I., I personally would not want my student bringing along a camera. While it would probably USUALLY end up OK, the last thing I want is my student trying to be Steven-fucking-Spielberg when he or she should be arching and/or keeping their hands on their harness for exit, etc. I've done enough tandems and filmed more than enough of them to know they do stupid shit even when their only job is to arch and keep their hands in until tapped, etc. Do I want some aspiring Tarantino trying to catch a great shot on exit when he should be helping me prevent a sidespin? No thanks."


DougH  (D License)

Jul 18, 2012, 3:13 PM
Post #25 of 57 (4746 views)
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Re: [airbigdaddy] Tandem Student shooting hand-cam ??? [In reply to] Can't Post

You instruct regular students to hold the harness on exit in a safety position, arch, and fly a box man of sorts when taped on the shoulders. You tell them chin up, head back, eyes on the horizon, arch from the hips.

Some do a great job, some do a so so job, and some are so wonked out of their gords that they do a terrible job.

If you were to put the camera on the students hand you would instruct them exactly the same way, and the would perform almost identically to the control group of students above.

The biggest difference is that tandem instructor isn't multitasking between shooting the exit and flying the exit out the door, they aren't having to take the camera out of frame to do a full handle check that includes reserve handle and RSL.


(This post was edited by DougH on Jul 18, 2012, 3:16 PM)


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