Forums: Skydiving: Gear and Rigging:
Full face helmet okay for beginner jumper?

 

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seanhindzinger

Jun 2, 2012, 11:54 AM
Post #1 of 27 (5863 views)
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Full face helmet okay for beginner jumper? Can't Post

Hi

I just did a tandem and am set on continuing with training and doing AFF. I was told that for AFF I am responsible for bringing my own goggles and altimeter. I saw jumpers at the dropzone wearing full face helmets and I think I would like one as well because I wasn't such a fan of the wind hitting my face and ramming up my nose. Are full face helmets okay for new jumpers? I see a lot of concerns about fogging up and so I would make sure and get one with a flip up visor.


excaza  (C License)

Jun 2, 2012, 12:06 PM
Post #2 of 27 (5845 views)
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Re: [seanhindzinger] Full face helmet okay for beginner jumper? [In reply to] Can't Post

You're going to need to use their equipment at least for the first few jumps so you can be on radio for canopy pattern guidance. Not sure about once you're cleared for solos.


(This post was edited by excaza on Jun 2, 2012, 12:14 PM)


obelixtim  (D 84)

Jun 2, 2012, 12:09 PM
Post #3 of 27 (5842 views)
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Re: [seanhindzinger] Full face helmet okay for beginner jumper? [In reply to] Can't Post

No.


Premier skybytch  (D License)

Jun 2, 2012, 12:22 PM
Post #4 of 27 (5831 views)
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Re: [seanhindzinger] Full face helmet okay for beginner jumper? [In reply to] Can't Post

Spend $30 or so on a Protec and $10-20 on goggles. Bet the dz has some for sale. You don't know if you are even going to make it through the student jumps at this point. Don't sink a bunch of money into gear that is way beyond what you need right now.

I don't know any AFFI's that will allow their students to jump a full face helmet.


davelepka  (D 21448)

Jun 2, 2012, 12:43 PM
Post #5 of 27 (5819 views)
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Re: [seanhindzinger] Full face helmet okay for beginner jumper? [In reply to] Can't Post

Quote:
I wasn't such a fan of the wind hitting my face

And you want to take up skydiving?

That aside, please double check with the DZ that you need to provide your own helmet and googles. This is not the 'norm' in the indistry, most of the time the DZ will provide you with everything you need - rig, jumpsuit, helmet, goggles, and altimeter. One reason is that the majority of first time jumpers don't want to invest heavily in gear they won't need if they never jump again, and another reason is that it allows the DZ to control the gear used by the students.

If the rule was you had to bring your own helmet and googles, how would you know if you were bringing skydive appropriate gear or not? What's to stop someone from showing up with ski goggles and a bicycle helemt? Those are two things non-jumpers might have, and if that's what they brought they would be out of luck as neither of those is good for jumping.

In terms of a full face helmet, the prices start in the low $200 range for a skydiving full face and go up from there. That aside, they limit the communication with your instructors, and that's not good for a student.

If you're not a fan of the wind, this is not the sport for you.


virgin-burner

Jun 2, 2012, 10:57 PM
Post #6 of 27 (5720 views)
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Re: [davelepka] Full face helmet okay for beginner jumper? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
If you're not a fan of the wind, this is not the sport for you.

^^this

the wind is one of the best parts! Smile


PiLFy  (A License)

Jun 3, 2012, 6:10 AM
Post #7 of 27 (5656 views)
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Re: [seanhindzinger] Full face helmet okay for beginner jumper? [In reply to] Can't Post

I don't think any instructor will let you jump a full face as a student. They limit your visibility, & the instructor's ability to see your eyes.

Don't like the wind blasting up your nostrils? Nothing wrong w/that. Was it cold where you jumped? You may grow to like the sensation. If not? Lots of people jump w/a full face helmet. If you hated the wind blowing on any part of you. I think you would've said that, & not pursued this sport.

Good Luck in AFF Smile.




Croc  (D 29552)

Jun 4, 2012, 3:33 PM
Post #9 of 27 (5450 views)
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Re: [davelepka] Full face helmet okay for beginner jumper? [In reply to] Can't Post

If every jumper was a fan of wind hitting his face there would be no market for full-faced helmets. I don't like the wind in my face, and I've owned nine motorcycles, too.

To the OP--hang in there and get a full face helmet when your instructor says it is OK. I can recommend Bonehead's ReVolve.


Creep0321  (B 37935)

Jun 4, 2012, 5:02 PM
Post #10 of 27 (5430 views)
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Re: [Croc] Full face helmet okay for beginner jumper? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
If every jumper was a fan of wind hitting his face there would be no market for full-faced helmets. I don't like the wind in my face, and I've owned nine motorcycles, too.

To the OP--hang in there and get a full face helmet when your instructor says it is OK. I can recommend Bonehead's ReVolve.

I too will recommend the bonehead revolve, once your instructors OK it.


Blong801  (B 39636)

Jun 6, 2012, 7:59 PM
Post #11 of 27 (5287 views)
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Re: [seanhindzinger] Full face helmet okay for beginner jumper? [In reply to] Can't Post

sean,
i was in the same position you are a couple months ago.
i had the money to buy a full face and wanted one, but held off because i really didn't know how far i wanted to go in this sport, its hard to make that decision just after one tandem. also most times you'll need to do a 2nd tandem and they wont let you wear a hard helmet, just the leather ones. (the TI doesn't want to get smacked in the face with a hard helmet)
i would ad least go through the AFF before i bought any gear.
i bought my full faced around 20-25 jumps, the instructors have had no problem with it, i bought it from my local DZ.
i got the phantom X and would recommend it.


skypagan  (D 15493)

Jun 10, 2012, 4:25 PM
Post #12 of 27 (5190 views)
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Re: [seanhindzinger] Full face helmet okay for beginner jumper? [In reply to] Can't Post

Definitely wait until you get past the initial training, full face helmets have an isolating effect and may prevent you from hearing or seeing traffic or issues. Full face helmets also have some distortion in the peripheral part of the lenses. Once you get a bit of a handle on the basics then it can be a great choice especially for cold weather or relative work. As an AFFI , I would not allow a student to jump a full face helmet during training.


rockola  (E 2631)

Jun 13, 2012, 3:07 AM
Post #13 of 27 (5087 views)
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Re: [Croc] Full face helmet okay for beginner jumper? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
If every jumper was a fan of wind hitting his face there would be no market for full-faced helmets.
I don't mind the wind. Getting kicked in the face is another thing. My jaw was sore for a week after eating someone's boot on exit. I bet I would have enjoyed it even less without my Factory Diver.


Ron

Jun 13, 2012, 7:41 AM
Post #14 of 27 (5021 views)
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Re: [seanhindzinger] Full face helmet okay for beginner jumper? [In reply to] Can't Post

Do not buy anything till after AFF except for the gear the instructor tells you to buy.

As for goggles and altimeter.... Never heard of a DZ telling a student they needed to buy an alti, you might want to check that information again. It would be very strange. Goggles, YES... Alti, strange.

And no, I would not let you do AFF with a full face helmet. I would REALLY not let you do AFF with a flip up helmet. I have seen experts forget to close it or not close it correctly and I don't want you fussing around with trying to get it flipped up when you should be flying your canopy.

Last reason, you don't know what you don't know yet. It would be VERY easy to waste money buying crap that you will never use again or find that you like something else much better once you know more. I wasted a bunch of money on a bunch of very stupid things... I would have been better off waiting a bit and buying once.

There is a training program for a reason, follow it.


C7JM  (C 3581)

Jun 26, 2012, 7:10 PM
Post #15 of 27 (4788 views)
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Re: [Ron] Full face helmet okay for beginner jumper? [In reply to] Can't Post

Hey, I'm a fairly new jumper. Started PFF in April and now have my A license and 36 jumps. I'm looking to do more RW work in the future and thinking about getting full face helmet at some point. I've tried some on at my home DZ and found a few that are a good fit for me. Just wondering if you have any advice for a novice jumper such as myself transitioning to a full face helmet?

Thanks in advance


Deisel  (D 31661)

Jun 26, 2012, 7:33 PM
Post #16 of 27 (4781 views)
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Re: [C7JM] Full face helmet okay for beginner jumper? [In reply to] Can't Post

Be aware that heavy breathing will cause the visor to fog up! Spinning on your back at 3K is not the time to find this out... Cool


C7JM  (C 3581)

Jun 26, 2012, 7:54 PM
Post #17 of 27 (4772 views)
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Re: [Deisel] Full face helmet okay for beginner jumper? [In reply to] Can't Post

Thanks! Also, does anyone know if there are any CSPA rules regarding the use of full face helmets? Do you have to have a certain number or Jumps, or maybe a B license? Going to ask when I get back up to the DZ this weekend, but thought I'd check here too.


pchapman  (D 1014)

Jun 26, 2012, 10:25 PM
Post #18 of 27 (4756 views)
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Re: [C7JM] Full face helmet okay for beginner jumper? [In reply to] Can't Post

No CSPA restrictions or recommendations that I know of. (in PIM 1 or 2A)


(This post was edited by pchapman on Jun 26, 2012, 10:26 PM)


Joellercoaster  (D 105792)

Jun 26, 2012, 11:57 PM
Post #19 of 27 (4740 views)
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Re: [C7JM] Full face helmet okay for beginner jumper? [In reply to] Can't Post

Maybe no firm rules, but a full-face is a good way of limiting your field of view (even the new fishbowl-y ones like the G3 and Phantom do this to some extent). There is a contraction of awareness and attention that goes with it, a tendency to see only what is straight in front of you.

New jumpers have a lot of new stuff to think about, and the more you can see even out of the corner of your eye, the less you are likely to be distracted by any one thing.

Full faces are great for keeping your pretty face unbruised, especially when you start doing 4-way and tunnel, but there is a tradeoff!

I think the wind in your face, even if you don't like it, is not a good reason to make that tradeoff, especially for the first 50 or even 100 jumps.


Ron

Jun 27, 2012, 6:05 AM
Post #20 of 27 (4720 views)
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Re: [C7JM] Full face helmet okay for beginner jumper? [In reply to] Can't Post

As with everything in skydiving.... Unusual is a leading cause of accidents. So never do more than one new thing at a time. Also anytime you do something new, dial back your skydiving plans.

For example, don't jump a new suit with booties and the full face helmet at the same time. Jump one till you are comfertable with it (could be one jump, could be 10 or more) then add the next new thing. Maybe try a solo or a two way when you get your new helmet, and not join that zoo load 10 way.

Unusual situations are dangerous. So dry run putting on and operating the helmet on the ground. You should be able to put it on and open and close the visor without issue while sitting on your couch watching the TV before you should even attempt it on the plane or under canopy. Each second you fuss with the helmet under canopy is a second you are not paying attention to where you are flying. Messing with the helmet in the plane before exit might distract you from some other important task.... Just read up on all the video guys that have been messing with their camera and forgot to bring a rig to the plane... And yes, people have died due to that.

Be aware that helmets can fog. Breathe in through your nose and out your mouth and in most cases it goes away. But twice I have had to take my helmet off while under canopy to see. This might be too much task loading for a person with a few jumps....

So:
1. Know the helmet. Be able to operate it on the ground quickly before you ever plan on jumping it.

2. Don't change your other routines... Don't allow yourself to be rushed.

3. Start small solo's or two ways.

4. One new thing at a time.

5. Breathe in through your nose out through your mouth.

6. Ask your local instructors, you don't know me. So take my 'advice' and their 'advice' and make your own choices... Personally, I would go with the most restrictive advice given. If they say you can do that zoo load on the first Juno with the helmet... I'd listen to me and do two ways or solos at first.


Skydivesg  (D 10938)

Jun 27, 2012, 7:08 AM
Post #21 of 27 (4704 views)
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Re: [C7JM] Full face helmet okay for beginner jumper? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Hey, I'm a fairly new jumper. Started PFF in April and now have my A license and 36 jumps. I'm looking to do more RW work in the future and thinking about getting full face helmet at some point. I've tried some on at my home DZ and found a few that are a good fit for me. Just wondering if you have any advice for a novice jumper such as myself transitioning to a full face helmet?

Thanks in advance

There is a lot of good information on your request for advice already but here is my $.02.

I've been jumping full face helmets since they first came out. I definitely like them but I will only wear one with a flip up visor now.

There is no doubt (to me) that the G3 is the best choice out there (obviously others will disagree).

There is no loss of peripheral vision and with the new lens they started using recently the fogging issue is mostly gone.

I still use an anti fog wipe from Fogtech which has completely illiminated the fogging.

I jump in the Midwest of the US and I don't think anyone get's a worse combination of temps and humidity than we.

One Fogtech wipe usually lasts me about 25-30 jumps.

As stated up thread - add new distractions incrimentally and spend lots of time on the ground becoming totally familiar with the new piece of gear to the point you can operate it with out thought.

Be safe out there.


Be the canopy pilot you want that other guy to be.


Premier Remster  (C License)

Jun 27, 2012, 8:18 AM
Post #22 of 27 (4684 views)
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Re: [Joellercoaster] Full face helmet okay for beginner jumper? [In reply to] Can't Post

Quote:
but a full-face is a good way of limiting your field of view

This is the N'th time someone has posted this...

THIS DEPENDS ON YOUR FACE SHAPE, THE HELMET DESIGN AND IT'S SIZE for god freaking sakes!

I've tested my Z1 and it does not limit my field of vision in any direction! And I'm not the only one who reported something similar with other helmets.

I really wish people would stop posting false generalizations.

This being said, to the new OP on this, try the helmets, and pick the one that fits best and limits your vision the less/not at all.


Premier billvon  (D 16479)
Moderator
Jun 27, 2012, 9:12 AM
Post #23 of 27 (4672 views)
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Re: [C7JM] Full face helmet okay for beginner jumper? [In reply to] Can't Post

>Just wondering if you have any advice for a novice jumper such as myself transitioning
>to a full face helmet?

Wait until you are very comfortable with your current system. When you do try helmets on find one that has an easy to open faceplate; you don't want to be fumbling with the faceplate on final at 50 feet when it fogs over. Had a former student break a femur that way once. Don't get one with a camera mount; will add snag hazards. Make sure you can still see your handles when you look down (some have a thick chin area.)


Skydivesg  (D 10938)

Jun 27, 2012, 10:00 AM
Post #24 of 27 (4657 views)
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Re: [billvon] Full face helmet okay for beginner jumper? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
When you do try helmets on find one that has an easy to open faceplate; you don't want to be fumbling with the faceplate on final at 50 feet when it fogs over.

Or you can get in the habit of opening your visor at a higher altitude.

Some visors are easier to open than others. Personally I have found that the ones which are easier to open are more likely to open up when you dont want them to. I don't want my visor to open up before I'm ready so I prefer something that may a bit tougher to open under canopy (two hands instead of one) but is much less likely to open prematurely.

Because I use the Fogtech wipes my visor does not fog up so I do not have to be in a hurry to open my visor. Instead I clear my airspace of other canopies before I do my house cleaning; open visor, collapse and stow my slider, expand my chest strap etc.

I use a flip up visor because I do not like to have anything in front of my eyes while flying my canopy including goggles and sun glasses. Most goggles distort your vision to some degree.

Most people who use a flip up visor will open it fairly soon after canopy opening and certainly not wait until in they are in the pattern. Otherwise what's the point of a flip up?


Joellercoaster  (D 105792)

Jun 27, 2012, 2:05 PM
Post #25 of 27 (4627 views)
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Re: [Remster] Full face helmet okay for beginner jumper? [In reply to] Can't Post

[edit: removed a bunch of Arguing On The Internet]


(This post was edited by Joellercoaster on Jun 27, 2012, 2:13 PM)


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