Forums: Skydiving: Wind Tunnels:
Using Tunnel to test wingsuit

 

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Trae  (Student)

Jan 13, 2012, 2:17 AM
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Using Tunnel to test wingsuit Can't Post

Hi there,

Do you think it is possible to test a wingsuit design in a vertical tunnel ?
I'm thinking it would have to be secured to the floor somehow .
What other obstacles would have to be overcome?

The wingsuit design is semi-rigid with retractable wings.

Any input appreciated.
Attachments: angell.JPG (41.7 KB)


likearock  (D 24640)

Jan 13, 2012, 5:24 AM
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Re: [Trae] Using Tunnel to test wingsuit [In reply to] Can't Post

You have some serious problems with that. Think of a wingsuit as mini-parachute, that's how its designed. As I'm sure you know, an open parachute in wind tunnel is a huge problem.

As far as securing it to the floor, even if that could be done, how would that even be useful in learning to operate the wingsuit? You need to be able to react to the wind and see how the wing responds.

Maybe, instead of a vertical wind tunnel, you had more of a horizontal one? Wink


piisfish

Jan 13, 2012, 6:00 AM
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Re: [Trae] Using Tunnel to test wingsuit [In reply to] Can't Post

think outside of the box (or tunnel)
got a car ? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4kQIOB1Lk7U


JohnRich  (D License)

Jan 13, 2012, 7:46 AM
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Re: [piisfish] Using Tunnel to test wingsuit [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
think outside of the box (or tunnel)
got a car ? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4kQIOB1Lk7U

There you go. Reminds me of a company that made high-quality tents for serious mountain climbers. In order to prove that their tents would withstand 60-mph winds, they built a platform on top of a pickup truck, erected and anchored a tent on top of the platform, then drove down a country road with the contraption. Voila! Instand wind tunnel test.


jumpsalot-2  (D 33093)

Jan 13, 2012, 1:08 PM
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Re: [JohnRich] Using Tunnel to test wingsuit [In reply to] Can't Post

That.......( see video )......is how you test a wingsuit. That guy is a genious.


Trae  (Student)

Jan 13, 2012, 2:39 PM
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Re: [likearock] Using Tunnel to test wingsuit [In reply to] Can't Post

Thanks for the replies.

I've been testing it on top of two different vehicles.
and have reached a limit with what I can learn there .
Time in a horizontal research tunnel is expensive.

in reply to "As far as securing it to the floor, even if that could be done, how would that even be useful in learning to operate the wingsuit? You need to be able to react to the wind and see how the wing responds. "

If it was secured in front of the WS's CG and CL (say at the shoulders) then it would end up head down in the tunnel but head on to the relative wind. In this position I'm hoping it will give me an idea how it flies in a relatively safe environment.

other option at the moment is to skydive a mini wing version to minimise potential dramas

Thanks for your thoughts.


Andy9o8  (D License)

Jan 13, 2012, 8:12 PM
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Re: [jumpsalot-2] Using Tunnel to test wingsuit [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
That.......( see video )......is how you test a wingsuit. That guy is a genious.

Yeah, but the pilot's demeanor seemed kind of wooden.


BrokenR1  (Student)

Jan 14, 2012, 8:11 AM
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Re: [Trae] Using Tunnel to test wingsuit [In reply to] Can't Post

Instead of securing it to the floor I think a better way would be to secure it on a bar that runs up and down along the wall. Tie it from your waist to a sliding ring that lets it move up and down. Put one of those big fish scales in the middle somewhere and you can measure the pull force as well.

Then you would have to start the tunnel off very slow and gradually increase it to find out what the minimum speed is that gives you lift. You also don't want to shoot through the roof. A larger tunnel would be better so you don't create as much of a bottleneck which I would think would throw off the true wind speed.

I'd guess that doing it would be expensive with all the risk the tunnel would have and preparation it would take.

But as an idea does that make sense?


Trae  (Student)

Jan 14, 2012, 4:10 PM
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Re: [BrokenR1] Using Tunnel to test wingsuit [In reply to] Can't Post

Sure does.

I was thinking soemthing like a bungee tripod, with bungee/rope limiters. nice and cheap.

Start off standing gradually up the speed until tail lifts off and take it from there until fully flying in the relative wind, within the limits of the ropes /bungee.

But yes a horizontal tunnel may start being more cost effective the more gadgets required for the vertical tunnel.

Skydiving it is poss with the smaller wings but who's gunna let me take this out of a plane until its proven???


tunnelfly

Jan 14, 2012, 4:55 PM
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Re: [Trae] Using Tunnel to test wingsuit [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
...but who's gunna let me take this out of a plane until its proven??

Chopper? Ives does that all the time... (the Porter doors around here are too small anyway)


5.samadhi

Jan 15, 2012, 4:56 AM
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Re: [Trae] Using Tunnel to test wingsuit [In reply to] Can't Post

looks like a conquistador Tongue

*thumbs up*


Trae  (Student)

Jan 15, 2012, 1:51 PM
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Re: [5.samadhi] Using Tunnel to test wingsuit [In reply to] Can't Post

Laugh

yep , sticks and stones just bounce off

Sly


5.samadhi

Jan 15, 2012, 6:53 PM
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Re: [Trae] Using Tunnel to test wingsuit [In reply to] Can't Post

that was meant as an honest compliment the internet is retarded for getting tone across Cool


(This post was edited by 5.samadhi on Jan 15, 2012, 6:55 PM)


HighJB  (C License)

Jan 16, 2012, 4:48 AM
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Re: [Trae] Using Tunnel to test wingsuit [In reply to] Can't Post

It has been done by Patrick de Gayardon at the wind tunnel of Onera
http://cassoudesalle.pagesperso-orange.fr/PDG/index.htm

by looking for links (Google is my Friend)
http://paramag.nuxit.net/...article/article.html
It appears that Jean Pierre Knaff did it as well (among tons of other testing Wink) in a horizontal WT as well. Jean Pierre is an Instructor @ Mimizan Dropzone in France.


tunnelfly

Jan 16, 2012, 2:00 PM
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Re: [HighJB] Using Tunnel to test wingsuit [In reply to] Can't Post

I know it's been done before, I've seen it with my own eyes (way back in the days).
But I still believe the gain of results is minimal at the angle in a VWT.
Horizontal tunnel testing is better, but not cheap and harder to access.
Besides, I don't think he'll find a vertical tunnel owner who let him test a semi-rigid wing unless he has good connections.

Then again, I hope he will find a way and bring his design to success.


Trae  (Student)

Jan 18, 2012, 1:02 AM
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Re: [HighJB] Using Tunnel to test wingsuit [In reply to] Can't Post

Thanks for the pointers.

A REALLY windy slope and it would kite I reckon.

Cheers


Premier SkymonkeyONE  (D 12501)

Jan 22, 2012, 7:17 AM
Post #17 of 30 (2609 views)
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Re: [Trae] Using Tunnel to test wingsuit [In reply to] Can't Post

Scott Campos flew one of his suits in the Eloy tunnel


Premier DSE  (D 29060)

Jan 22, 2012, 1:53 PM
Post #18 of 30 (2577 views)
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Re: [Andy9o8] Using Tunnel to test wingsuit [In reply to] Can't Post

secure it to the door and ankles. Already been done. It works. Just be sure to have safety people in there with you.


Trae  (Student)

Jan 22, 2012, 2:01 PM
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Re: [DSE] Using Tunnel to test wingsuit [In reply to] Can't Post

in reply to "secure it to the door and ankles."
...........................................

Do the safety people have to keep it aligned when done like this ? or do they just help stop it blowing up and over.
If it was secured at the ankles and blown from the head to the ankles, wouldn't that tend to blow the suit head over heels into backwards flying ?

It would be possible to secure the suit by the shoulders .
Do you think that would be better than the ankles ? as then it could rotate about the shoulders rather than the ankles.


mortcj  (D 30992)

Jan 22, 2012, 6:37 PM
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Re: [Trae] Using Tunnel to test wingsuit [In reply to] Can't Post

Skip the tunnel, just jump it


(This post was edited by mortcj on Jan 22, 2012, 6:38 PM)


Trae  (Student)

Jan 22, 2012, 10:09 PM
Post #21 of 30 (2533 views)
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Re: [mortcj] Using Tunnel to test wingsuit [In reply to] Can't Post

SlySlySly

shhhh ..... the internal mechanism fits in an ordinary wingsuit....Laugh


Premier DSE  (D 29060)

Jan 23, 2012, 12:23 AM
Post #22 of 30 (2524 views)
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Re: [Trae] Using Tunnel to test wingsuit [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
in reply to "secure it to the door and ankles."
...........................................

Do the safety people have to keep it aligned when done like this ? or do they just help stop it blowing up and over.
If it was secured at the ankles and blown from the head to the ankles, wouldn't that tend to blow the suit head over heels into backwards flying ?

It would be possible to secure the suit by the shoulders .
Do you think that would be better than the ankles ? as then it could rotate about the shoulders rather than the ankles.

You lost me with "blown from head to the ankles."
you're talking about a vertical wind tunnel. The wind only comes from beneath/belly (in a normal position.

Thing is (I think) that if you're looking to test the plastic wing you've posted photos of...I'd be surprised if anyone would allow you to put that in a tunnel. A hard surface as seen in your pix...even just a screw coming off could do damage to the fans.


piisfish

Jan 23, 2012, 1:23 AM
Post #23 of 30 (2521 views)
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Re: [Trae] Using Tunnel to test wingsuit [In reply to] Can't Post

any chance of getting a ride in some university (or similar) tunnel ?


Trae  (Student)

Jan 23, 2012, 4:49 PM
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Re: [piisfish] Using Tunnel to test wingsuit [In reply to] Can't Post

there's always a chance , the accessible university tunnels are too small to test anything but a model and that's already tested .
(I've tested the full size version but only on fixed on top of a speeding vehichle)
The most accessible tunnel is a vertical one and I want to be fully prepared if I make an approach to them.
All I've heard so far in the real world is ......NO !

Good feedback here though Cool


Trae  (Student)

Jan 23, 2012, 4:52 PM
Post #25 of 30 (2461 views)
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Re: [DSE] Using Tunnel to test wingsuit [In reply to] Can't Post

in reply to "You lost me with "blown from head to the ankles."
......................................

If it was secured at the ankles and then blown in a vertical tunnel wouldn't it just blow over,? leaving it flying backwards.

You've got me thinking if it could even fly like that so thank you.


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