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Contour for "back" filming..

 

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saxboy  (C 41348)

Dec 2, 2011, 7:04 AM
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Contour for "back" filming.. Can't Post

Just finished my "project" to film my back while i am wingsuiting..with my contour..Opinions??
:-))
Attachments: helmet-contour.JPG (196 KB)


horny955  (C License)

Dec 2, 2011, 7:29 AM
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Re: [saxboy] Contour for "back" filming.. [In reply to] Can't Post

good luck Unimpressed


Hellis

Dec 2, 2011, 8:31 AM
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Re: [saxboy] Contour for "back" filming.. [In reply to] Can't Post

I was hoping we would see a picture of a Wingman made for wingsuiting Wink


Premier DSE  (D 29060)
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Dec 2, 2011, 11:15 AM
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Re: [saxboy] Contour for "back" filming.. [In reply to] Can't Post

"good luck" is appropriate. Pilot chutes tend to dance in burbles reasonably often. That's a huge snag point, and it doesn't get better if your reserve needs to deploy. I recommend against using this setup.


jurgencamps  (D License)

Dec 2, 2011, 11:31 AM
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Re: [DSE] Contour for "back" filming.. [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
"good luck" is appropriate. Pilot chutes tend to dance in burbles reasonably often. That's a huge snag point, and it doesn't get better if your reserve needs to deploy. I recommend against using this setup.
+1


beowulf  (C License)

Dec 2, 2011, 11:37 AM
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Re: [saxboy] Contour for "back" filming.. [In reply to] Can't Post

Just my opnion. I have seen worse ideas, but not by much. It looks like a great way to snag your pilot chute at the least it most likely be hit by your risers on deployment, probably lose your camera.


saxboy  (C 41348)

Dec 2, 2011, 12:15 PM
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Re: [beowulf] Contour for "back" filming.. [In reply to] Can't Post

So,until now...I have a huge snag point,I will lose my camera,my reserve is not able to deploy,it will hit by risers...etc..
Any good words out there?
I have seen worst than mine with bigger cameras as well...
They are alive by mistake?
So,there is no "safe" way to film my back while wingsuiting??
All these videos (base and skydive) on you tube?


Premier DSE  (D 29060)
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Dec 2, 2011, 12:30 PM
Post #8 of 30 (1093 views)
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Re: [saxboy] Contour for "back" filming.. [In reply to] Can't Post

I have several dozen shots of my back while flying. None of them required the huge Manfrotto arm and clamp you've put together.
Of course there are safe ways to do it. Just that you've chosen a route that is readily apparent as "not safe."
You can move the arm much farther up the helmet so it's not in the way of your risers nor reserve should you need it. You don't need the arm at all, IMO.

See this image, where I'm jumping 3 cameras, one of them rear-firing to shoot my deployment. If I wanted to film the back as it lies flat, a wedge or Israeli arm are needed, but they don't have to stick up like you've got yours, and they're farther up the helmet to be missed by risers, and far away from any reserve issues.
You _never_ want anything in the way of your reserve.
Attachments: 3Cams comparison.jpg (114 KB)


saxboy  (C 41348)

Dec 2, 2011, 12:59 PM
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Re: [DSE] Contour for "back" filming.. [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
If I wanted to film the back as it lies flat, a wedge or Israeli arm are needed, but they don't have to stick up like you've got yours, and they're farther up the helmet to be missed by risers, and far away from any reserve issues.
You _never_ want anything in the way of your reserve.

Can you please upload a photo?

And I am always turn my head in to my chest while pulling with my cameras (still and camcorder)..
So this thing will go straight up while I am doing this..
Where is the problem?
Also I am "always" looking the ground while I am wingsuiting...I can't find another way to rec my back while I am looking down...during the flight...


(This post was edited by saxboy on Dec 2, 2011, 1:01 PM)


Premier DSE  (D 29060)
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Dec 2, 2011, 1:27 PM
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Re: [saxboy] Contour for "back" filming.. [In reply to] Can't Post

Quote:
Where is the problem?

Why ask, if you're not willing to listen to what several others have told you?Crazy

there are three helmets in the photo I uploaded. All three of them are easily configured for filming the back. If you look at the far helmet (full face), it has the mounts placed to shoot the back with a short billet Israeli arm.


saxboy  (C 41348)

Dec 2, 2011, 1:46 PM
Post #11 of 30 (1069 views)
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Re: [DSE] Contour for "back" filming.. [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Quote:
Where is the problem?

Why ask, if you're not willing to listen to what several others have told you?Crazy

there are three helmets in the photo I uploaded. All three of them are easily configured for filming the back. If you look at the far helmet (full face), it has the mounts placed to shoot the back with a short billet Israeli arm.

I am willing to listen someone with more experience than me..But I want to film my back while I am wingsuiting...and lOOKING THE GROUND...
How can I do this with my camera on the top of the helmet???I don't want to film the sky....
I will post a snapshot from a video to see (the helmet)
what I mean..as soon as I found it..


Premier DSE  (D 29060)
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Dec 2, 2011, 2:08 PM
Post #12 of 30 (1058 views)
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Re: [saxboy] Contour for "back" filming.. [In reply to] Can't Post

I understand what you want. You want to shoot your rig and tail wing as you fly. That's quite achievable without having a big arm, clamp, and snag point. The Israeli arm I've attached here is mountable at the crown of the helmet, and can lay the camera lens along the base of the helmet, shooting the back and tail without putting anything high up and snaggable, well away from the reserve. The arm I've attached, the knobs are about the size of a dime, and can be easily covered over to reduce snag, should it need to be in a difficult place.

There are other ways to do this as well, but putting a huge Manfrotto mount isn't one of them, in my opinion.
Attachments: israeli arm_sm.jpg (103 KB)


saxboy  (C 41348)

Dec 2, 2011, 11:30 PM
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Re: [DSE] Contour for "back" filming.. [In reply to] Can't Post

Here is the photo I saw first..:-)
I know that the attach point of the mount is close to the top of the helmet...But my camera is also in the same position..
Only the camera..not the mount..
Attachments: Screen Shot.jpg (95.9 KB)


mccordia  (D 94775)

Dec 3, 2011, 4:32 AM
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Re: [saxboy] Contour for "back" filming.. [In reply to] Can't Post

Quote:
Here is the photo I saw first..:-)

And if you ask them, it's also not the best idea.
I don't see the added vallue of this mount, over simply putting the camera directly on top of your helmet and aiming it back correctly.

Its a setup that has a LOT of safety concerns. If you want to use it. Sure.
But don't complain when you ask 'what do you people think' and they respond with real world threats/dangers to jumping such a setup.


davelepka  (D 21448)

Dec 3, 2011, 4:59 AM
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Re: [saxboy] Contour for "back" filming.. [In reply to] Can't Post

Quote:
Here is the photo I saw first..:-)
I know that the attach point of the mount is close to the top of the helmet...But my camera is also in the same position..
Only the camera..not the mount..

You realize that seeing a photo of something does not make it a good idea. A photo does not indicate how many jumps were put on it, what the outcome of those jumps were, or if the user has since found a problem and done a redesign.

Furthermore, seeing a photo does not make you privy to all of the design elements. You may have an idea of the 'rough' configuration, but you do not know the exact details of the camera placement, method of attachment, and materials used. I know what I build a camera helmet/mount, those things are carefully considered and specifically selected for the given application.

Given the width of lenses these days, stick with mounting your cameras directly to the helmet, and simply slide it fore/aft along the curve of the helmet to get the angle you're looking for. I understand that if you mount the camera on top, like when you're filming forward, that it will be shooting up into the sky if you simply rotate it 180, so rotate it 180, and slide it back a few inches along the curve of the helmet, and eventaully it will be pointing downwards, and you'll have the shot you want.

Much like selecting a canopy, you don't design a camera helmet for the 'best case scenario', you design one that will function (in the case of a camera helmet, one that will 'do no harm') when a couple of things go wrong. Maybe in an ideal main-canopy deployment, your camera mount will not provide any interference. What happens if you blow out a wing or zipper on your jumpsuit? Of if a shoulder pops out of the socket? What sort of airflow and direction of the relative wind can you exspect then? While I admit that your mount looks like it might clear a normal wingsuit deployment, it also looks like a major snag point in a 'comprimised' deployment.

None of that is mentioning the reserve system, which is in VERY close proximity to that mount, and by it's very defeinition, a reserve deployment is never 'normal'. You're only dumping your reserve because something has gone wrong. What that something will be, and how it will effect the airflow or deplyoment, is anyone's guess, and you mount is not designed with that in mind.


(This post was edited by davelepka on Dec 3, 2011, 5:00 AM)


mccordia  (D 94775)

Dec 3, 2011, 5:06 AM
Post #16 of 30 (977 views)
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Re: [davelepka] Contour for "back" filming.. [In reply to] Can't Post

The setup on the photo referenced is also different (though for sure not less prone to line snatching parts). The attachment=point is the center/top of the helmet. Not the lower base of the neck.

The setup posted here actually puts the camera over the reserve.


saxboy  (C 41348)

Dec 3, 2011, 5:40 AM
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Re: [davelepka] Contour for "back" filming.. [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Given the width of lenses these days, stick with mounting your cameras directly to the helmet, and simply slide it fore/aft along the curve of the helmet to get the angle you're looking for. I understand that if you mount the camera on top, like when you're filming forward, that it will be shooting up into the sky if you simply rotate it 180, so rotate it 180, and slide it back a few inches along the curve of the helmet, and eventaully it will be pointing downwards, and you'll have the shot you want.

My first thought was exactly this thing...
But I can't mount the camera directly to helmet...because I am shooting my rig...It must be away from the helmet...See the picture...
Also check one more setup...
And you are telling me that my setup is over the reserve....?
Mine is closer to the helmet..


(This post was edited by saxboy on Dec 3, 2011, 6:05 AM)
Attachments: helmetcam.jpg (200 KB)
  goproback.jpg (62.5 KB)


davelepka  (D 21448)

Dec 3, 2011, 6:18 AM
Post #18 of 30 (959 views)
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Re: [saxboy] Contour for "back" filming.. [In reply to] Can't Post

 
That's a good start. Now take a 1/4" wedge, and put it under the tail end of the camera. Now it's pointing further down and toward your back.

Just because you 'want' something doesn't mean it's safe, or that there is a safe way to do it, or you are equipped if there is a safe way.

At the end of the day, you're trying to film your back. Not that exciting, nothing close to new, and not worth the risk you're tyring to add to your skydive. I could see if there was something back there; another jumper, a mountain, or a Porter chasing you, but just for your own back on a solo, not so much.


Premier DSE  (D 29060)
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Dec 3, 2011, 8:55 AM
Post #19 of 30 (942 views)
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Re: [saxboy] Contour for "back" filming.. [In reply to] Can't Post

you do realize that in addition to posting photos of Robi Pecnik, one of the most experienced BASE wingsuiters in the world, that you're also posting images of BASE rigs.
No reserve.
Again, if you move the mount farther up the helmet, it will out of the way of risers. Having a gimbal/arm to get it up there isn't the problem. It's the location and size of the gimbal/arm that you've chosen.

You've got a collective of over 20,000 skydives telling you it's not a good idea. You might want to reconsider.


Skydivesg  (D 10938)

Dec 3, 2011, 11:40 AM
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Re: [saxboy] Contour for "back" filming.. [In reply to] Can't Post

That looks scary to me.

quote:
***************************************
you're trying to film your back. Not that exciting, nothing close to new, and not worth the risk you're tyring to add to your skydive. I could see if there was something back there; another jumper, a mountain, or a Porter chasing you, but just for your own back on a solo, not so much.
*************************************

At the very least, please mount a Gopro that is aimed at the Contour so we can see what it looks like during your deployments. And now there might be something worth viewing.


PharmerPhil  (D 23899)

Dec 3, 2011, 7:46 PM
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Re: [DSE] Contour for "back" filming.. [In reply to] Can't Post

Quote:
You've got a collective of over 20,000 skydives telling you it's not a good idea. You might want to reconsider.

Kinda simplify things doesn't it? I mean, did you come to this forum for comments? Or to show off what you already decided was "cool?" I don't do wing suit jumps, or have a camera on the back of my head like this. But people here who do those things are saying it isn't safe (and with apparently good cause and reasoning). You can listen or keep your head in the sand.


AndyMan  (D 25698)

Dec 4, 2011, 9:43 AM
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Re: [saxboy] Contour for "back" filming.. [In reply to] Can't Post

Wow that's a big hook.

_Am


Premier billvon  (D 16479)
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Dec 4, 2011, 8:01 PM
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Re: [saxboy] Contour for "back" filming.. [In reply to] Can't Post

>Where is the problem?

You pull. You have a spinner. You look up, say "OH SHIT! FUCK FUCK FUCK!" as your main spins up above your head. You've been well trained so your hands automatically find your cutaway and reserve handles and you pull both.

As you fall away from your main you are feet into the relative wind. Your reserve PC launches and manages to clear that hook. The reserve freebag gets caught under the hook, since it's being lifted straight up off your back, and you are (naturally) looking at your malfunctioning main.

As the reserve PC tries to pull the freebag past your helmet, your head is forced into your chest so you can't see what's going on. The lines begin to pay out from the pocket on your freebag, streaming past the freebag in the relative wind. Finally you accelerate to a fast enough speed, the reserve PC shears the camera mount off, and the reserve freebag and the camera are pulled through the reserve lines into clear air.

You open with a lineover on your reserve. The camera (still running) gets an excellent view of the lineover as you spin into the parking lot. It gets 700,000 views on Youtube when the guy who buys your gear realizes it's still on the camera.

>Any good words out there?

Oh - sorry. It will be fine. Don't worry about anything.


Premier DSE  (D 29060)
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Dec 4, 2011, 8:14 PM
Post #24 of 30 (757 views)
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Re: [billvon] Contour for "back" filming.. [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
>Where is the problem?

You pull. You have a spinner. You look up, say "OH SHIT! FUCK FUCK FUCK!" as your main spins up above your head. You've been well trained so your hands automatically find your cutaway and reserve handles and you pull both.

As you fall away from your main you are feet into the relative wind. Your reserve PC launches and manages to clear that hook. The reserve freebag gets caught under the hook, since it's being lifted straight up off your back, and you are (naturally) looking at your malfunctioning main.

As the reserve PC tries to pull the freebag past your helmet, your head is forced into your chest so you can't see what's going on. The lines begin to pay out from the pocket on your freebag, streaming past the freebag in the relative wind. Finally you accelerate to a fast enough speed, the reserve PC shears the camera mount off, and the reserve freebag and the camera are pulled through the reserve lines into clear air.

You open with a lineover on your reserve. The camera (still running) gets an excellent view of the lineover as you spin into the parking lot. It gets 700,000 views on Youtube when the guy who buys your gear realizes it's still on the camera.

>Any good words out there?

Oh - sorry. It will be fine. Don't worry about anything.


This HAS to be the best response to an "I want opinions (I just don't want yours)" post I've ever seen. PM's didn't explain it well enough, I guess...Unsure
I really hope we don't see Saxboy end up in the Small Format Incidents thread.


davelepka  (D 21448)

Dec 5, 2011, 5:06 AM
Post #25 of 30 (727 views)
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Re: [DSE] Contour for "back" filming.. [In reply to] Can't Post

Quote:
You've got a collective of over 20,000 skydives telling you it's not a good idea

Not only that, I gave him instructions for an alternate mounting (as did you).

True story about a related idea. About 5 or 6 years ago one of our local wingsuiters wanted to try a rodeo, and recruited another jumper to be a rider. He also convinced the rider to deploy right off his back, just hucking the PC at the given time and seeing what happens.

So a half-dozen poeple sign up to chase this, and most of them have cameras, so we figure we'll get the footage. About halfway to altitude, the wingsuiter looks at his helmet (Bonehead Mindwarp w/ a side mount Sony PC) and realizes that if he puts the helmet on backwards, he'll have close-up POV video of the rider and his eventual deployment.

So he puts his helmet on backwards, and get some of the best video of all time. The look on the riders face after he throws the PC but before the deployment was priceless (the PC danced around in the burble for a few seconds). The point is that the OP is claiming the only way to get video of your own back is via the giant hook on the back of his helmet, while another jumper simply put his helmet on backwards to the shot and it worked like a charm. No special mounts, no special lenses, no lining up the shot, just a 2 second desicion to put the thing on backwards.

Disclaimer - don't follow any part of this example. The wingsuiter in quesiton is one of the most talented jumpers I know, and the rider is a really nice guy who makes some 'questionable' choices from time to time.


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