Forums: Skydiving: Safety and Training:
Stall On Jump Run Emergency Procedure?

 


3mpire  (C 39657)

Aug 24, 2011, 4:06 PM
Post #1 of 15 (2195 views)
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Stall On Jump Run Emergency Procedure? Can't Post

I saw this video and was wondering what the general consensus is on a) how the jumpers and pilots in this video handled the situation and b) what are the best procedures to follow if you find yourself in an aircraft on jump run that stalls:

http://www.youtube.com/...er_detailpage#t=151s

I don't know any details about this incident--I don't know when it happened, but from the intro, it appears to have been at angel skydive in south africa. I did a search on dz.com and didn't see anything in the incidents forum, however if I'm search challenged and this already has a thread, feel free to point to it.

I am looking through the SIM for more details about what the emergency procedures for this situation should be, and I see in Category 4 Section A Part D II it basically says to follow the jump master's instructions, but that is geared towards students.

Section 5:1:D which says

Quote:
1. Each skydiving center should establish and review procedures for all possible aircraft emergencies.

2. Every pilot and non-student jumper should thoroughly understand these procedures.

3. All students should take direction from their instructor(s).

Unless I'm missing something, it doesn't seem to get more specific than that, and is up to each DZ.

If it is that non-specific, I'm curious what some of you think. I'm going to talk to our pilots next time I'm at the DZ to learn as much as I can about our aircraft and what they think, so I'll post their responses later if anyone is interested.

Edited to link directly to relevant portion of video.


(This post was edited by 3mpire on Aug 24, 2011, 4:07 PM)


Premier billvon  (D 16479)
Moderator
Aug 24, 2011, 4:22 PM
Post #2 of 15 (2139 views)
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Re: [3mpire] Stall On Jump Run Emergency Procedure? [In reply to] Can't Post

In GENERAL:

If the stall happens before the door is open, then remain seated and try to remain where you are! Shifting loads often make such problems worse.

If the door is open and/or green light is on, then anyone in the door should exit immediately, for two reasons:

1) Often people preparing for exit are out of position and this results in an altered aircraft balance; exiting removes this imbalance. Classic case here is 16 people on the tailgate of a Skyvan.

2) If the plane is unrecoverable then exiting is a very very good idea.

If the exit has not begun or you are not near the door when the stall starts it's a judgment call. If you can communicate with the pilot he always has the final word. If you can't, then you have to make a judgment call as to whether exiting will help things or not, and whether the aircraft is recoverable or not.


3mpire  (C 39657)

Aug 24, 2011, 5:05 PM
Post #3 of 15 (2119 views)
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Re: [billvon] Stall On Jump Run Emergency Procedure? [In reply to] Can't Post

Thanks -- I did see that there is already a thread on this with more activity, so I would direct folks there:

http://www.dropzone.com/...rum.cgi?post=4176825


Squeak  (E 1313)

Aug 24, 2011, 5:38 PM
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Re: [3mpire] Stall On Jump Run Emergency Procedure? [In reply to] Can't Post

http://www.avcom.co.za/....php?f=1&t=83041


DBCOOPER  (D 24112)

Aug 24, 2011, 8:53 PM
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Re: [billvon] Stall On Jump Run Emergency Procedure? [In reply to] Can't Post

My new signature line....


SARLDO  (B 31063)

Aug 25, 2011, 1:47 PM
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Re: [DBCOOPER] Stall On Jump Run Emergency Procedure? [In reply to] Can't Post

Don't forget the all important rule that if the pilot jumps, you may want to also.


virgin-burner

Aug 25, 2011, 3:10 PM
Post #7 of 15 (1795 views)
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Re: [3mpire] Stall On Jump Run Emergency Procedure? [In reply to] Can't Post

SPEEDSTAR!!!

LaughLaughLaugh


wolfriverjoe  (A 50013)

Aug 26, 2011, 10:58 AM
Post #8 of 15 (1653 views)
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Re: [SARLDO] Stall On Jump Run Emergency Procedure? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Don't forget the all important rule that if the pilot jumps, you may want to also.

I've always said (as the pilot) "If I yell 'Everyone out NOW', don't ask 'What?' because there won't be anyone there to answer."


winsor  (D 13715)

Aug 30, 2011, 8:16 AM
Post #9 of 15 (1416 views)
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Re: [SARLDO] Stall On Jump Run Emergency Procedure? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Don't forget the all important rule that if the pilot jumps, you may want to also.

"If I say exit and you say 'what?,' you'll be speaking to yourself."

=> post above beat me to it.


(This post was edited by winsor on Aug 30, 2011, 8:17 AM)


winsor  (D 13715)

Aug 30, 2011, 8:18 AM
Post #10 of 15 (1412 views)
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Re: [virgin-burner] Stall On Jump Run Emergency Procedure? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
SPEEDSTAR!!!

Did that out of a broken Twin Bonanza.


virgin-burner

Aug 30, 2011, 8:29 AM
Post #11 of 15 (1399 views)
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Re: [winsor] Stall On Jump Run Emergency Procedure? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:
SPEEDSTAR!!!

Did that out of a broken Twin Bonanza.

LaughLaughLaugh

well, it's not really funny then, is it!? Unimpressed


jackwallace  (Student)

Aug 30, 2011, 12:49 PM
Post #12 of 15 (1361 views)
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Re: [virgin-burner] Stall On Jump Run Emergency Procedure? [In reply to] Can't Post

To quote Heydorn as they were crawling down the ceiling of the Lodestar: GET OUT, GET OUT, GET OUTTA MY WAY!


Bartskydive  (C License)

Aug 31, 2011, 2:23 PM
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Re: [3mpire] Stall On Jump Run Emergency Procedure? [In reply to] Can't Post

It does look scary! But I have the impression that the guy with the stripes on his shoulder is doing it on purpose!!
If you look at the video, you can see the elevators of the aircraft in a aircraft nose up position. As the aircraft is in a fully developed spin this would NOT be the thing to do if you have any intentions of recovering. In any current general aviation aircraft a incipient spin is easily corrected by opposite rudder and stick back pressure release. If that doesn't help, there would be a major loading problem with a way aft centre of gravity. In which case you would slam the control wheel to the forward stop and gun the engine. But quite honestly, if I look at the video,I think the guy is a freakin' nutcase and doesn't belong in the air other than as a paying passenger. The jumpers still in the aircraft did the right thing; they stayed where they were and asked the pilot and eventually as they approached hard deck exited anyway. I'm sure they sorted they guy out afterwards.


CloudyHead  (A License)

Sep 1, 2011, 5:17 AM
Post #14 of 15 (1242 views)
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Re: [Bartskydive] Stall On Jump Run Emergency Procedure? [In reply to] Can't Post

they seem to be freefalling pretty close to the plane? wouldn't you want to track further away?


CloudyHead  (A License)

Sep 2, 2011, 4:56 AM
Post #15 of 15 (1173 views)
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Re: [CloudyHead] Stall On Jump Run Emergency Procedure? [In reply to] Can't Post

i think this is the perfect video to say...

"perfectly good airplane my ASS"



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