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Recommendations for new handcam camera

 


matt3sa  (D 29266)

Apr 22, 2011, 2:51 PM
Post #1 of 14 (1064 views)
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Recommendations for new handcam camera Can't Post

I found a post on this from 2008, so I'm looking for more current recommendations. I've had a Sony HC-21 for several years. It's been a good camera, but I'm looking to step it up to HD and would preferably like something smaller for handcams. The GoPro was initially very appealing me due to the compact size, however I found a few things about them that I didn't care for. For one, no view finder. Honestly, the lack of a viewfinder wasn't a deal breaker, but when I found out that each time you press record/stop, a new file is generated... that's a problem. We're still using old school video boards, so 3 separate files without the ability to pause or use slow mo (via a camera remote) becomes an issue.
I'm open to any suggestions. I've considered using a laptop and trying to figure out what video software would be the most efficient, but with a small staff I end up editing a lot of my own videos. Real time stream with on the fly effects (while simultaneously recording) seems to be the fastest way.
Any suggestions for small HD cameras with very wide (stock) field of view and/or ability to use a royal lens would be great. Thanks.


Premier DSE  (D 29060)

Apr 22, 2011, 6:34 PM
Post #2 of 14 (1020 views)
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Re: [matt3sa] Recommendations for new handcam camera [In reply to] Can't Post

A few points:
There is an LCD back for the GP now, but that won't answer your separate files question.

Sony CX series has some small options, CX160 etc, but if you can find a CX 100 or 110...you'll likely be happier due to side load cards vs bottom load cards.

Bear in mind that the slow mo on the camera vs doing with a computer is different than you're used to with DV, it's a tad more jerky.

Adding a Royal, XSeries, or other SD lens to an HD camera is like putting a silver saddle on a donkey.

FWIW, you'll have a faster over all flow with a fast computer vs your linear boards, and you'll have more flexibility for delivery, edit, and storage. That said...make do with whatever you have.


matt3sa  (D 29266)

Apr 22, 2011, 6:41 PM
Post #3 of 14 (1016 views)
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Re: [DSE] Recommendations for new handcam camera [In reply to] Can't Post

What you mentioned about the lens is interesting me. Are you saying that it's a waste of time to go with the lens? It ruins the quality? Or are you saying that your making the camera (donkey) special because he has a silver saddle? After all, wide is very important for handcams (IMO)


freefalle  (D 27777)

Apr 22, 2011, 6:50 PM
Post #4 of 14 (1012 views)
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Re: [matt3sa] Recommendations for new handcam camera [In reply to] Can't Post

"Adding a Royal, XSeries, or other SD lens to an HD camera is like putting a silver saddle on a donkey."


I think what he means is using a SD lens on a camera the is able to shoot HD will not allow the camera to be used to is fullest potential.


matt3sa  (D 29266)

Apr 22, 2011, 6:59 PM
Post #5 of 14 (1008 views)
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Re: [freefalle] Recommendations for new handcam camera [In reply to] Can't Post

In that case, I wonder how many TI's are using hd for handcams and furthermore what the majority of them are using for a setup.


Premier DSE  (D 29060)

Apr 22, 2011, 7:14 PM
Post #6 of 14 (1004 views)
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Re: [matt3sa] Recommendations for new handcam camera [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
What you mentioned about the lens is interesting me. Are you saying that it's a waste of time to go with the lens? It ruins the quality? Or are you saying that your making the camera (donkey) special because he has a silver saddle? After all, wide is very important for handcams (IMO)
Freefalle clarified it; you won't be allowing the camera to perform to it's fullest ability. Unfortunately for handcam, high resolution wides (.4 and .3 are horribly large, heavy, and spendy.


matt3sa  (D 29266)

Apr 22, 2011, 7:43 PM
Post #7 of 14 (994 views)
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Re: [DSE] Recommendations for new handcam camera [In reply to] Can't Post

DSE,

I read up on some of the other responses to lenses for HD cameras. I understand the concept of what you're saying. However, am I incorrect to believe that throwing a "non-hd" rated wide angle on a new hd camera will still look far better than an old school hc-21 on tape? I personally don't care if the HD is top notch. We're just shooting handcams. If we stuck with old school they would still buy it. Either way it seems to be an upgrade for them.


Dokeman  (D License)

Apr 28, 2011, 6:34 PM
Post #8 of 14 (853 views)
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Re: [matt3sa] Recommendations for new handcam camera [In reply to] Can't Post

but an SD lens on a HD camera still looks NOTICEABLE better than a SD lens on a SD camera


Premier DSE  (D 29060)

Apr 28, 2011, 9:11 PM
Post #9 of 14 (848 views)
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Re: [matt3sa] Recommendations for new handcam camera [In reply to] Can't Post

Matt, even if you shoot SD on a newer cam, it'll look better/tighter than the old HC21.
Putting an SD lens on an HD cam gives a softer edge to edge, but as mentioned, it'll still look better than an SD lens on an SD cam.

If you're not delivering HD, and you're still using linear SD boards, you'll get a better image from an HD cam shooting SD than you're getting with your HC21.
Unfortunately, a lot of people think it's all about the pixels when it's about glass, resolution, compression, and the end format.

In short...you'll be happy you went to a newer cam capable of shooting HD, even if you're delivering SD. Tongue


Catwatch

Apr 29, 2011, 2:01 AM
Post #10 of 14 (832 views)
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Re: [matt3sa] Recommendations for new handcam camera [In reply to] Can't Post

As for the editing problem. I have found a solution to that.

I use a external media player (mine is called "poppstar") to playback the files one after the other. I put the sd card into the mediaplayer use the output of the mediaplayer just like it would come directly from a camera and can therefore use my normal "old school" video editing board as before.
The media player creates a small pause between 2 files, however thats not a real problem to me. With the media player I can even slow mo the parts of the files I want to...
And everything is done in linear time without rendering or anything just like it did before with my tape camera.

works for me...my problem with the gopro is more related to the shake in freefall which I was not yet able to get rid off..but thats not the topic here...


jtiflyer  (D 27430)

Apr 29, 2011, 8:02 AM
Post #11 of 14 (808 views)
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Re: [DSE] Recommendations for new handcam camera [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Sony CX series has some small options, CX160 etc, but if you can find a CX 100 or 110...you'll likely be happier due to side load cards vs bottom load cards.

Before you purchase a CX series camera, there is an error in the above statement. The CX110 is a BOTTOM loading camera. However it will take both SD and Sony sticks. The CX100 is side loading but ONLY takes the Sony Memory sticks.


Premier DSE  (D 29060)

Apr 29, 2011, 8:57 AM
Post #12 of 14 (800 views)
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Re: [jtiflyer] Recommendations for new handcam camera [In reply to] Can't Post

Argh. Thanks for the catch. Combining two thoughts into one sentence made it come off wrong.
The CX100 is my preference because it's side load.
CX110 is a great cam in that it takes both cards and has a slightly better compression system...but the bottomload is a PITA (for me).


jtiflyer  (D 27430)

Apr 29, 2011, 12:05 PM
Post #13 of 14 (787 views)
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Re: [DSE] Recommendations for new handcam camera [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Argh. Thanks for the catch. Combining two thoughts into one sentence made it come off wrong.
The CX100 is my preference because it's side load.
CX110 is a great cam in that it takes both cards and has a slightly better compression system...but the bottomload is a PITA (for me).

agreed. As I only have cx110s' I had to cut a hole in both the cage and the top plate of the vapor pro to get to the card "easily".

If only Sony had the side feed with OIS, skydivers' would have a good camera. Until then its just a matter of preference.


trunk  (D 28511)

Apr 29, 2011, 1:05 PM
Post #14 of 14 (783 views)
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Re: [jtiflyer] Recommendations for new handcam camera [In reply to] Can't Post

Of course, it would not be difficult to cut a hole in the bottom of the glove to retrieve the card, unlike helmets where you have a mount in the way. Of course, from what it sounds he's going to use linear editing boards anyway so the easier to find CX110/CX150 will work.



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