Forums: Skydiving: Wind Tunnels:
When to move on

 


Gators1240  (A 58804)

Feb 16, 2011, 6:23 AM
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When to move on Can't Post

I am somewhat of a perfectionist in a lot of things and when it comes to maximizing tunnel time this is no different. Lately I have found that I start learning something new I spend a ton of time working on it where I would probably be ok to move on to other things. My belly skills are pretty good, my back is decent and recently I started working on belly to back transitions. So far ive spent about 40 minutes working on strictly back/belly frontflips and belly to back backflips. They are pretty smooth but not 00% where I want them to be as far as being perfectly smooth and without thinking before I do them. Am I wasting my time by continuing to work on these now exclusively or should I be working on something else?


NeedToJump  (D 27247)

Feb 16, 2011, 7:46 AM
Post #2 of 16 (1678 views)
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Re: [Gators1240] When to move on [In reply to] Can't Post

My first recommendation is to get with a good coach and explain your goals. The coach will be able to help you better determine how much time to spend on one skill vs moving on.

That being said, without knowing your goals and what you want to "move on" to, I'd say move on. There are plenty of skills you will work on which will help your belly/back transitions.

In reply to:
Am I wasting my time by continuing to work on these now exclusively

As long as you're having fun, it's never a waste of time


oeriksson  (A License)

Feb 16, 2011, 9:34 AM
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Re: [Gators1240] When to move on [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi

You sound about the same as me.. also a perfectionist. I would say try it and then move on. I've got about 12 hours of tunnel time now and I've realized that I learn most when I get to try something, then go home and watch the video (countless times), and then come back to try it again. I can't stress enough how important the video is. But you also need video of other people doing the same exercise, people better than you, so you can watch how they do it.

Coaches are so different. I don't think it really matters if they are super talented, as long as their teaching style fits you, and you never know that in advance. I prefer one that lets me decide what to practice, but at the same time pushes me forward to try new things when I'm ready for it. Sometimes I prefer to really stick to one exercise and do it over and over again until I know it inside out. It helps for some things, but other things that you do in the tunnel you don't really need for the sky, and some things you will do in the tunnel so many times anyway. Back to belly, or more stricly back to sit, is one such. You'll get to do it so many times anyway and it doesn't have to be perfect to move on to more fun things, so I would say let it be now. :)

Have fun!


Muffie  (A License)

Feb 16, 2011, 2:38 PM
Post #4 of 16 (1619 views)
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Re: [Gators1240] When to move on [In reply to] Can't Post

Same advice as NeedToJump - get a good coach. They'll help you set a solid progression that lets you continue to add new skills while solidifying what you already learned. I did two and a half hours with the same coach and he judged my progress and added in things as he thought I was ready for them. I didn't have backfly down 100% when we moved on, but I found when I had to go back to it a little later I was much better at it just because of general progression working in the tunnel.


Gators1240  (A 58804)

Feb 16, 2011, 6:06 PM
Post #5 of 16 (1574 views)
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Re: [Muffie] When to move on [In reply to] Can't Post

All the advice seems to make a lot of sense. It is hard to work with multiple different coaches because of the different teaching styles and I have noticed that they often have different ways to do the same things.


matthewcline  (D 21585)

Feb 16, 2011, 6:51 PM
Post #6 of 16 (1568 views)
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Re: [NeedToJump] When to move on [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
My first recommendation is to get with a good coach and explain your goals. The coach will be able to help you better determine how much time to spend on one skill vs moving on.

That being said, without knowing your goals and what you want to "move on" to, I'd say move on. There are plenty of skills you will work on which will help your belly/back transitions.

In reply to:
Am I wasting my time by continuing to work on these now exclusively

As long as you're having fun, it's never a waste of time

This is some very good and maybe the best advice in here by far.

Matt


adagen

Feb 18, 2011, 2:55 PM
Post #7 of 16 (1485 views)
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Re: [Gators1240] When to move on [In reply to] Can't Post

For me it works to have a few things on the go. There are the things I'm currently learning and I spend most of a tunnel session on them. There are things that I can do OK but they need to be fine tuned so each session I'll do a bit of work on them but not so much. And periodically I go back to basics to avoid getting sloppy with basic techniques. I preplan a tunnel session round a mix of all three so I know what I want to cover.

One thing I have learned from training myself and other people in a number of different sports is the need for a session to be flexible. If you get to the point where something isn't working and isn't getting better no matter how hard you try, switch to doing something else rather than waste expensive tunnel time making no progress.


FlyingLunaTic

Feb 21, 2011, 12:53 PM
Post #8 of 16 (1427 views)
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Re: [Gators1240] When to move on [In reply to] Can't Post

As said above, as long as you're having fun, that's the main thing Smile

That said... I moved through things quite quickly and although I wasn't great at everything by moving on and mixing the new stuff with the old stuff it helped me. I would find my self at a brick wall with a certain maneuver but by doing something else and then coming back to it, it would suddenly make a lot more sense.

Watch your video footage and that of others. You can then see what you're doing in comparison to them and hopefully improve on that the next time.


Gators1240  (A 58804)

Feb 21, 2011, 8:35 PM
Post #9 of 16 (1379 views)
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Re: [FlyingLunaTic] When to move on [In reply to] Can't Post

I have. I'm working on sitflying now and it's completely kicking my ass. Everything else is pretty good (belly, back, transitions) but I can't really think of anything else to work on until I can get my sit down somewhat. Ive done about 45 minutes total just working on my siftly and haven't been able to stay steady off of the net. So that's what I'm doing until I can get it


likearock  (D 24640)

Feb 22, 2011, 5:04 AM
Post #10 of 16 (1355 views)
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Re: [Gators1240] When to move on [In reply to] Can't Post

It's not good to get fixated, whether you're in the tunnel or on final under canopy. Work all the surfaces and alternate when you feel "stuck". There's always something new to practice. Have you mastered the 2-way sideslide drill in both belly and backfly?


emmiwy  (B 33982)

Feb 24, 2011, 2:29 AM
Post #11 of 16 (1275 views)
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Re: [Gators1240] When to move on [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
I have. I'm working on sitflying now and it's completely kicking my ass. Everything else is pretty good (belly, back, transitions) but I can't really think of anything else to work on until I can get my sit down somewhat. Ive done about 45 minutes total just working on my siftly and haven't been able to stay steady off of the net. So that's what I'm doing until I can get it

Here is some perspective. To learn how to freefly, I have flown over 3 hours in the tunnel. It took me close to 2.5 to learn to sitfly [which included a lot of backfly], to just hold it barely off the net. Several coaches have told me their ideal way of teaching sitfly is to coach 3 hours of tunnel before the student even tries to make a jump in the sky. That's how hard it is.

You may think everyone can do it in the sky easily, but translating it into the tunnel is a different ballgame. And the more time you spend in the tunnel, the more you will realize that you are building confidence and strength in your mechanics. Overcoming the boundaries of the tunnel and comfort with flying up and off the ground/net are something you don't have to deal with the sky; the rig on your back does helps with balance too in the sky and that's something you have to learn to fly without in the tunnel.

So I wouldn't be hard on yourself if you can't get the sitfly after 45 minutes. About 90% of my jumps are RW, so I had a lot of difficulty transitioning from my belly flying to freefly positioning; if I can do it I'm sure you can too. I think we all just hope that it doesn't take us hundreds of dollars and hours to just learn how to sit, I completely understand that feeling. But to learn properly means to build good habits, good body mechanics and to practice the basics. Developing a strong backfly will help IMMENSELY towards learning the sitfly; as useless as you may think it is in the sky, it is essentially the sitfly position but oriented in a different axis. Other than that, keep at it and you'll get it :)


Gators1240  (A 58804)

Feb 26, 2011, 6:46 AM
Post #12 of 16 (1196 views)
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Re: [emmiwy] When to move on [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:
I have. I'm working on sitflying now and it's completely kicking my ass. Everything else is pretty good (belly, back, transitions) but I can't really think of anything else to work on until I can get my sit down somewhat. Ive done about 45 minutes total just working on my siftly and haven't been able to stay steady off of the net. So that's what I'm doing until I can get it

Here is some perspective. To learn how to freefly, I have flown over 3 hours in the tunnel. It took me close to 2.5 to learn to sitfly [which included a lot of backfly], to just hold it barely off the net. Several coaches have told me their ideal way of teaching sitfly is to coach 3 hours of tunnel before the student even tries to make a jump in the sky. That's how hard it is.

You may think everyone can do it in the sky easily, but translating it into the tunnel is a different ballgame. And the more time you spend in the tunnel, the more you will realize that you are building confidence and strength in your mechanics. Overcoming the boundaries of the tunnel and comfort with flying up and off the ground/net are something you don't have to deal with the sky; the rig on your back does helps with balance too in the sky and that's something you have to learn to fly without in the tunnel.

So I wouldn't be hard on yourself if you can't get the sitfly after 45 minutes. About 90% of my jumps are RW, so I had a lot of difficulty transitioning from my belly flying to freefly positioning; if I can do it I'm sure you can too. I think we all just hope that it doesn't take us hundreds of dollars and hours to just learn how to sit, I completely understand that feeling. But to learn properly means to build good habits, good body mechanics and to practice the basics. Developing a strong backfly will help IMMENSELY towards learning the sitfly; as useless as you may think it is in the sky, it is essentially the sitfly position but oriented in a different axis. Other than that, keep at it and you'll get it :)

I know exactly what you mean about the tunnel. I should clarify that I meant that I have about 45 minutes strictly working on sit. I have around 4 1/2 hours in the tunnel now, 2 of that being back and sit


tistouta

Feb 26, 2011, 12:38 PM
Post #13 of 16 (1181 views)
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Re: [Gators1240] When to move on [In reply to] Can't Post

and when do you roughly start to move on from sit fly to HD?


emmiwy  (B 33982)

Feb 26, 2011, 8:25 PM
Post #14 of 16 (1154 views)
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Re: [Gators1240] When to move on [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:

Here is some perspective. To learn how to freefly, I have flown over 3 hours in the tunnel. It took me close to 2.5 to learn to sitfly [which included a lot of backfly], to just hold it barely off the net. Several coaches have told me their ideal way of teaching sitfly is to coach 3 hours of tunnel before the student even tries to make a jump in the sky. That's how hard it is.

You may think everyone can do it in the sky easily, but translating it into the tunnel is a different ballgame. And the more time you spend in the tunnel, the more you will realize that you are building confidence and strength in your mechanics. Overcoming the boundaries of the tunnel and comfort with flying up and off the ground/net are something you don't have to deal with the sky; the rig on your back does helps with balance too in the sky and that's something you have to learn to fly without in the tunnel.

So I wouldn't be hard on yourself if you can't get the sitfly after 45 minutes. About 90% of my jumps are RW, so I had a lot of difficulty transitioning from my belly flying to freefly positioning; if I can do it I'm sure you can too. I think we all just hope that it doesn't take us hundreds of dollars and hours to just learn how to sit, I completely understand that feeling. But to learn properly means to build good habits, good body mechanics and to practice the basics. Developing a strong backfly will help IMMENSELY towards learning the sitfly; as useless as you may think it is in the sky, it is essentially the sitfly position but oriented in a different axis. Other than that, keep at it and you'll get it :)

I know exactly what you mean about the tunnel. I should clarify that I meant that I have about 45 minutes strictly working on sit. I have around 4 1/2 hours in the tunnel now, 2 of that being back and sit
Yep, that's how I interpreted it. My thoughts still stand. :)

I think that it's good that you're going on your own. Sitfly is the most difficult orientation to learn. I'm not sure what your circumstance is (if you're getting coaching or not) but I would suggest learning with slower air first. If you can learn the sit in slow air and build mechanics that way you will be able to fly it in anything. With faster air if you don't have proper mechanics you'll just bounce off the walls, which is counter-productive, you may get frustrated, and not to mention it's not so safe/more difficult for the instructor/coach to spot you. Yes faster air will give you lift off the net, but your movements will have to be much more precise and controlled. So its better to learn how to fly stable first. It's frustrating, believe me, but you'll get it.

From what my coach has told me, head down you start around the 5 hour mark.


Gators1240  (A 58804)

Feb 26, 2011, 10:17 PM
Post #15 of 16 (1149 views)
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Re: [emmiwy] When to move on [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
From what my coach has told me, head down you start around the 5 hour mark.

Well from that standpoint I am a little behind the curve Laugh

but like I said before I tend to go over things again and again before moving on. I dont really care about getting there in a certain amount of time.

I have been getting coaching BUT its just been from the tunnel instructors which is usually different everytime I am at the tunnel. It has helped quite a bit but bouncing around from instructor to instructor and going through different teaching methods can make it somewhat frustrating at times.


hparrish  (D 25090)

Feb 27, 2011, 6:20 AM
Post #16 of 16 (1133 views)
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Re: [Gators1240] When to move on [In reply to] Can't Post

Whats the rush??? Do you just want boxes cheked off, or do you want to really fly well.

I see so many folks caught up in getting good fast. Do you really think the tunnel instructors just blew through their progressions and mastered tunnel flying.

No they didn't, most of them have hundreds to thousands of hours of flight time.

Slow down and learn how to fly........You don't need to master every position to move on to the next.....But there's also no race to win in the tunnel.........5 Hours to get on your head is BS. It could take you 1 hour it could take you 20 hours.



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