Forums: Skydiving: Tandem Skydiving:
FAA third class exams

 


lekstrom10k  (D 3001)

Dec 12, 2010, 5:58 AM
Post #1 of 22 (2308 views)
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FAA third class exams Can't Post

Has any T.I. taken there third class physical as "Other " on the form. I always took mine as pilot SEL. I heard rumors its different than pilots , No jumping on one foot twent times etc. I sent this question to USPA naturally nu response.


Para5-0  (D 19054)

Dec 12, 2010, 6:28 AM
Post #2 of 22 (2282 views)
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Re: [lekstrom10k] FAA third class exams [In reply to] Can't Post

The difference, I think if you take it as other is that the reverse side will not give you the pilot sign off. I took it as other and just received a different medical card. Then when I took flight lessons and handed it to the examiner he said I needed to go change the physical to a pilots physical, so he can sign the back, in accordance with the student FAR's.


jonstark  (D 8298)

Dec 12, 2010, 10:07 AM
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Re: [lekstrom10k] FAA third class exams [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
its different than pilots , No jumping on one foot twent times etc.

Wha? Who has to jump on one foot? I've never seen that one.

They just started a hearing test that's pretty funny tho. They asked me to cover one ear then the other as they whispered inanities from across the room.

jon


Para5-0  (D 19054)

Dec 12, 2010, 2:16 PM
Post #4 of 22 (2180 views)
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Re: [jonstark] FAA third class exams [In reply to] Can't Post

years back I had the same thing done. lol no joke. They whispered in my ear and I repeated what they said. hilarious.


lekstrom10k  (D 3001)

Dec 12, 2010, 2:52 PM
Post #5 of 22 (2169 views)
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Re: [Para5-0] FAA third class exams [In reply to] Can't Post

I took my first 3rd class in 1969 . He handed me a cup and said bring mw a sample. If I took the cup my hearing was OK if I found the right door my vision was OK . If I set it down without spilling my depth perception was OK and if I didnt wipe my hands on my pants my aim was OK too. Here was my student card.
Really no hops thats wierd that was normal for heart rate increases after stress. I was put in a chamber with a headset on and told to raise what hand I heard the first noise from in all pitches. As I said it was normal around the Detroit area


Flyinrob  (D 26442)

Dec 12, 2010, 4:42 PM
Post #6 of 22 (2132 views)
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Re: [lekstrom10k] FAA third class exams [In reply to] Can't Post

In your case Larry they probably need to add a carbon dating procedure to your medical..har har!!


AggieDave  (D License)

Dec 12, 2010, 5:03 PM
Post #7 of 22 (2119 views)
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Re: [lekstrom10k] FAA third class exams [In reply to] Can't Post

Quote:
I took my first 3rd class in 1969 . He handed me a cup and said bring mw a sample. If I took the cup my hearing was OK if I found the right door my vision was OK . If I set it down without spilling my depth perception was OK and if I didnt wipe my hands on my pants my aim was OK too. Here was my student card.

That is just about how my 3rd class exams have been in Texas, starting in 2003. In fact, I think my exams were less intense than what is listed above.


NYKid  (C 99999)

Dec 16, 2010, 3:17 PM
Post #8 of 22 (1960 views)
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Re: [lekstrom10k] FAA third class exams [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Has any T.I. taken there third class physical as "Other " on the form. I always took mine as pilot SEL. I heard rumors its different than pilots , No jumping on one foot twent times etc. I sent this question to USPA naturally nu response.

I just talked to the FAA in the eastern region on this matter two days ago. My understanding is the other is for Air traffic controllers. That's the answer the FAA gave me.


Skydivesg  (D 10938)

Dec 17, 2010, 9:17 AM
Post #9 of 22 (1892 views)
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Re: [jonstark] FAA third class exams [In reply to] Can't Post

I've had to do the hopping for elivated heart rate and the hearing test for the past 35 years. That's for a pilot medical, but I think it's the same medical for tandems.

Nothing unusual.


JohnMitchell  (D 6462)

Dec 20, 2010, 11:21 PM
Post #10 of 22 (1822 views)
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Re: [NYKid] FAA third class exams [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:

I just talked to the FAA in the eastern region on this matter two days ago. My understanding is the other is for Air traffic controllers. That's the answer the FAA gave me.
That's what I check every year. But you don't get the 2nd class physical card unless you ask for it, so every year I tell the doc I need it for skydiving. I've never had any problems with them issuing it. My medical says I need to have reading glasses in my possession. I keep 'em at work, but not when doing tandems. Tongue


Para5-0  (D 19054)

Dec 21, 2010, 6:41 AM
Post #11 of 22 (1808 views)
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Re: [JohnMitchell] FAA third class exams [In reply to] Can't Post

You bring up a great point and one that has come up many times before by Tandem Instructors. When the medical says, "Must possess corrective lenses". It seems like a very grey area. Everyone I have spoken to who has this restriction just says they have them on the ground, or in their jumpsuit. It would be impossible to require it, like the FAA does for pilots. or what would happen if an incident occurred and the TI didnt have his glasses on? Does that one thing open up the liability can of worms?


DiverMike  (C 40024)

Dec 21, 2010, 7:17 AM
Post #12 of 22 (1800 views)
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Re: [Para5-0] FAA third class exams [In reply to] Can't Post

This is a 'grey area' because the FAA does not have any regulations covering Tandem Instructors, not because it is impossible to require it. I have prescription lenses with a bifocal insert in my liquid eyewear that I use to skydive. It is completely possible to have prescription eyewear in skydiving goggles.

The FAA regulations for eyewear are as follows:
Quote:
Nearsighted (myopic) individuals, those who have blurring when viewing distant objects, are required to wear corrective lenses (glasses or contact lenses) at all times during aviation duties. These lenses must correct distant vision to 20/20 in each eye.

Farsighted (hyperopic) individuals or presbyopic individuals (those who require reading glasses as they age), are required to have corrective lenses AVAILABLE during aviation duties. These lenses are usually bifocals, progressive lenses or the half cut reading lenses ("granny glasses").
Since the FAA does not consider Tandem operations 'aviation duties' you could be legally blind without your glasses and still be a TI flying without them and not run afoul of FAA regulations.

If the tandem manufacturer does not require 20/20 corrected vision to act as a TI, you are technically ok. You are still liable as well as the DZO and the manufacturer if you land anywhere other than where you were supposed to, don't have 20/20 vision, and aren't wearing corrective lenses. I wouldn't want to be a TI on the witness stand defending my decision to not have 20/20 corrected vision because I didn't want to buy the prescription lenses for my goggles.

All these liability loopholes are caused by requiring a FAA 3rd class medical when the FAA does not have any regulations regarding tandem instructors or someone acting as 'parachutist in command'. If the FAA considered tandem instruction as an aviation activity you would absolutely be required to have 20/20 corrected vision when acting as a TI.


Para5-0  (D 19054)

Dec 21, 2010, 7:51 AM
Post #13 of 22 (1794 views)
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Re: [DiverMike] FAA third class exams [In reply to] Can't Post

DM,
Very informative, thank you. I see an area that needs some exploration.


DiverMike  (C 40024)

Dec 21, 2010, 8:05 AM
Post #14 of 22 (1790 views)
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Re: [Para5-0] FAA third class exams [In reply to] Can't Post

You don't really want to come under the jurisdiction of the FAA. Someday the regulations may be rewritten to include TI's. That won't be a happy day for TI's.

Until then, if you need corrective lenses wear them or don't put yourself in a position of defending your decision to not wear them (stay off of a witness stand).

Most TI's I know don't have deep pockets and don't have to worry too much about being sued. Tandem manufacturers, DZO's, and their insurers might start requiring corrected vision to avoid liability, but the FAA doesn't give a shit about TI's vision while jumping.


Skydivesg  (D 10938)

Dec 21, 2010, 9:54 AM
Post #15 of 22 (1769 views)
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Re: [DiverMike] FAA third class exams [In reply to] Can't Post

I was recently at an event where two people from the FAA were on site during every jump for 4 days. And when I say on site I don't mean in an office, FBO or terminal, I mean at the gear up area, boarding area and landing area.

They used everything in their power to disrupt the operation.

I was told they ramped checked the planes everyday and actually tried to ramp check them twice in one day.

They did not want the jumper's canopies to be within 1000 feet of a spinning prop which was impossible given the pre-approved parachute landing area unless no airplanes were landing, taking off or taxiing.

I could go on and on with the crap they pulled but my point is:
If they had known or thought of the TI FAA medical and corrective vision requirement they would have used that to slow things down as well.

My medical certificate reads:

Conditions of Issue:

The holder of this certificate must:

*Comply with any statement of functional, operational, and/or limitation issued as a condition of certification.

In the Limitations section it says: Must wear corrective lenses

I don't doubt some feds might let this slide while I'm certain others would do everthing possible to cause disruption.

I defintely would not want to defend my decision to not wear corrective lenses in a court of law.


(This post was edited by Skydivesg on Dec 21, 2010, 9:56 AM)


Para5-0  (D 19054)

Dec 21, 2010, 10:26 AM
Post #16 of 22 (1761 views)
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Re: [DiverMike] FAA third class exams [In reply to] Can't Post

No I do not want them to come under FAA rule at all, trust me I agree.


riggerrob  (D 14840)

Dec 21, 2010, 10:31 AM
Post #17 of 22 (1759 views)
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Re: [DiverMike] FAA third class exams [In reply to] Can't Post

I disagree with wearing bifocal glasses while skydiving.

While they may be convenient for gear checks, they can create more problems than they solve during landing.

For example, a pilot customer used to own two airplanes: a tail-dragger and a nose-dragger and needed four sets of glasses. He wore clear or dark glasses depending upon the time of day or night.

He wore bifocals while flying his nose-wheel airplane, but could not wear bifocals while flying his tail-dragger, because the focus changed just as he was flaring and it confused the %$#@! out of him!

To that end, I wear bifocals most of the time, but switch to single vision prescription lenses - in a Wiley X frame - for skydiving.


DiverMike  (C 40024)

Dec 21, 2010, 10:46 AM
Post #18 of 22 (1757 views)
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Re: [riggerrob] FAA third class exams [In reply to] Can't Post

 
In reply to:
they can create more problems than they solve during landing.

I agree. That is why I inserted a small single bifocal lens in the left eyepiece at the approximate clock position of 7 to 10. (I cut an insert in half I bought off the internet. They sell them for scuba masks). It allows me to view my altimeter in freefall on my left wrist, but doesn't interfere with my downward landing view.


ozzy13  (D 29344)

Dec 22, 2010, 12:54 PM
Post #19 of 22 (1705 views)
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Re: [Skydivesg] FAA third class exams [In reply to] Can't Post

in limitation section on my card it states this:
Holder must possess corrective lenses for near vision while exercising the privileges of his airman certificate.

My understanding that they needed to be on my person for use if need. It does not say I need to be wearing them.

Am I wrong?


DiverMike  (C 40024)

Dec 22, 2010, 1:15 PM
Post #20 of 22 (1695 views)
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Re: [ozzy13] FAA third class exams [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Am I wrong?

Please read post #12 on this thread for clarification. Reading glasses only need to be available, distance glasses worn. In both cases, it only applies 'during aviation duties'. Tandem instruction is not defined to be an aviation duty, so you can cover your eyes in duct tape if you want while being a TI.


ozzy13  (D 29344)

Dec 22, 2010, 1:37 PM
Post #21 of 22 (1692 views)
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Re: [DiverMike] FAA third class exams [In reply to] Can't Post

Lmao I do that already Wink (Covering my eyes) This stuff is scary.


(This post was edited by ozzy13 on Dec 22, 2010, 2:49 PM)


Para5-0  (D 19054)

Dec 22, 2010, 3:07 PM
Post #22 of 22 (1674 views)
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Re: [ozzy13] FAA third class exams [In reply to] Can't Post

try going on the front of you!!! You dont know what scary is>



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