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Shootout - CX100 vs HC1

 

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Premier billvon  (D 16479)
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Mar 7, 2009, 12:31 PM
Post #1 of 43 (5153 views)
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Shootout - CX100 vs HC1 Can't Post

Tomorrow I'm going to be doing video of some 4-way, and I'll be doing a shootout between the HC1 (my usual HD camera that I love) and the new CX100. I finally got two identical Raynox 5050PRO lenses to make the test fair. I'll try with stabilization on and off to see what that does.

Setup shown below.

(Side note - I have always liked the Goldmember mounts, but I have concluded that they just have too much slop in them to be the only mount method for a video camera. I am always having to prop the cameras up at some other point to keep them from rattling around on the mount.)
Attachments: shootout.jpg (66.6 KB)


tripleflip18  (B License)

Mar 7, 2009, 8:06 PM
Post #2 of 43 (5021 views)
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Re: [billvon] Shootout - CX100 vs HC1 [In reply to] Can't Post

Congrats, can't wait for some great video's and comments


lewmonst  (D 24575)

Mar 7, 2009, 10:41 PM
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Re: [billvon] Shootout - CX100 vs HC1 [In reply to] Can't Post

Were you in Perris? I didn't see you. Can't wait to hear the reviews!


bdazel  (D License)

Mar 8, 2009, 8:08 AM
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Re: [billvon] Shootout - CX100 vs HC1 [In reply to] Can't Post

Nice. Can't wait to hear about it. Can I ask a couple questions about your setup? Is that a laser pointer mounted to the top? is that a UV filter on the cx100?


Premier billvon  (D 16479)
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Mar 8, 2009, 10:02 PM
Post #5 of 43 (4748 views)
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Re: [bdazel] Shootout - CX100 vs HC1 [In reply to] Can't Post

Made 5 jumps with the system.

First jump was with the HQ setting (second to highest quality.) Resolution was decent but artifacting was visible around high motion areas of the shot.

Second was with the FH setting (highest quality) with the steadyshot turned off. On this one artifacting was almost unnoticeable, but the shake was fairly bad compared to the reference video (HC1 with stabilizer turned on.)

Third was with FH and steadyshot turned on. This one looked pretty good. I showed it to several people and asked them to compare it to the HC1. Most thought both cameras looked good, but thought the stability of the HC1's image was slightly better than the CX100's. Some people thought the CX100's colors were better, but some didn't notice much difference there.

The next two I played with the high speed capture. This was a little awkward because the only way to start it was by hitting the Hypoxic record switch about 1/4 second before I wanted the recording to start, and you only get 4 seconds of high speed recording - so I had to hit the start switch at a certain part of the count while I was already on the camera step. The results were a lot of fun. You could see every single thing that happened on the exit in excruciating slow motion, although quality takes a hit, and the camera then spends 10 seconds or so writing everything to the card (during which time it's useless.) So you'd have to have 2 cameras to take advantage of this if you're filming a team, tandem etc.

The test setup was a 720P 37" display fed by an HDMI cable (for the CX100) and via a component cable (for the HC1.) Debrief video was recorded on a Panasonic DVD recorder using composite video out.

A few surprises -

I used two identical Raynox lenses because I've had very good luck with them on the HC1 and HC5's that I've used. However, on the CX100, they seemed to not give as wide an angle - I kept cutting off people's feet, but framing seemed fine on the HC1 footage. This may contribute to the perception that it's less stable than the HC1. (Wider generally equals less visible shake, all other things being equal.)

I also noticed a significant amount of chromatic aberration at the edges of the frame, far more than I notice with the HC1. Not sure why.

On the plus side, the stills I took through the CX100 while videoing were surprisingly good, apart from the aberrations at the edges. It would probably be good enough for tandem work if 1) you got a better lens and 2) the cycle time was just a little faster. It seemed to be able to take 1 picture every 7-8 seconds. I'd get around 6 pictures a dive from exit to breakoff.

Overall the HC1 still wins (barely) on quality for me, but I'd have no problem using the CX100 for most video work (4way, tandem, most bigways etc) I will probably still keep the HC1 around for the 'big deal' jumps (record attempts etc)

Attached are some of the stills. I will try to get the video up on skydivingmovies.com tonight.


(This post was edited by billvon on Mar 8, 2009, 10:07 PM)
Attachments: 4way1.jpg (186 KB)
  runway1.jpg (202 KB)
  on_the_hill.jpg (170 KB)
  exit1.jpg (172 KB)


Premier billvon  (D 16479)
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Mar 8, 2009, 10:07 PM
Post #6 of 43 (4740 views)
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Re: [bdazel] Shootout - CX100 vs HC1 [In reply to] Can't Post

> Is that a laser pointer mounted to the top?

Yes

>is that a UV filter on the cx100?

Yes, mainly for scratch protection. I took it off for these jumps.


Premier cpoxon  (D 11665)
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Mar 9, 2009, 3:14 AM
Post #7 of 43 (4675 views)
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Re: [billvon] Shootout - CX100 vs HC1 [In reply to] Can't Post

Bill's videos:

nosteady_hq
steady_hq


mccordia  (D 94775)

Mar 9, 2009, 4:46 AM
Post #8 of 43 (4631 views)
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Re: [cpoxon] Shootout - CX100 vs HC1 [In reply to] Can't Post

Looking incredibly crispy/sharp..
I do notice the small artifacting which happens with panning moves.

Curious how that will work out for bigger moves and stuff with scenery panning by (shots from a car, scenery on basejumps etc)


bdazel  (D License)

Mar 9, 2009, 6:25 AM
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Re: [billvon] Shootout - CX100 vs HC1 [In reply to] Can't Post

Thanks for the comparison! I haven't jumped the cx100 yet, but it's good to know that the cam gets your nod for tandems. :)

Quote:
I used two identical Raynox lenses because I've had very good luck with them on the HC1 and HC5's that I've used. However, on the CX100, they seemed to not give as wide an angle - I kept cutting off people's feet, but framing seemed fine on the HC1 footage. This may contribute to the perception that it's less stable than the HC1. (Wider generally equals less visible shake, all other things being equal.)

I also noticed a significant amount of chromatic aberration at the edges of the frame, far more than I notice with the HC1. Not sure why.

Just a thought: Is it possible that one of the Raynox lenses is a bad copy? With SLR lenses at least, sometimes you get a lemon. Did you try interchanging the lenses? Doesn't it seem odd that a camera would cause an increase in noticeable lens deficiencies? I can understand the different field of view - that could be a function of where the threads are located relative to the sensor and/or front camera lens element, and whether a step down ring is used, but the CA? That seems odd.


mccordia  (D 94775)

Mar 9, 2009, 7:35 AM
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Re: [bdazel] Shootout - CX100 vs HC1 [In reply to] Can't Post

The field of view of a wide-angle lens, depends largely on how it works in combination with the lens on the camera itself and how close it is.

Even just the addition of a step-up ring can totaly change your view-angle (up to the point where you get vignetting)


Icon134  (D 29820)

Mar 9, 2009, 7:48 AM
Post #11 of 43 (4525 views)
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Re: [mccordia] Shootout - CX100 vs HC1 [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
The field of view of a wide-angle lens, depends largely on how it works in combination with the lens on the camera itself and how close it is.

Even just the addition of a step-up ring can totaly change your view-angle (up to the point where you get vignetting)
Not to mention the size of the imager itself...

they all play a part in how the image will look when it reaches the "film plane"


Premier billvon  (D 16479)
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Mar 9, 2009, 9:23 AM
Post #12 of 43 (4457 views)
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Re: [bdazel] Shootout - CX100 vs HC1 [In reply to] Can't Post

> Is it possible that one of the Raynox lenses is a bad copy?

Possible but unlikely. I moved the old lens from the HC1 to the CX100 and put the new lens on the HC1. The HC1 looked like it always does (which is pretty good.) If I get a chance I will try a few more lenses on the CX100 to see if there's one that's a good 'match.'

I'll also try to get the HC1 footage up as a reference.


Skydivesg  (D 10938)

Mar 9, 2009, 9:46 AM
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Re: [cpoxon] Shootout - CX100 vs HC1 [In reply to] Can't Post

I've never had any success trying to watch video from that site.


Premier billvon  (D 16479)
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Mar 9, 2009, 9:46 AM
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Re: [billvon] Shootout - CX100 vs HC1 [In reply to] Can't Post

OK, just uploaded the 'reference' video from the HC1. It's called "test3.wmv." It's the wrong aspect ratio; sorry. I have limited tools here at work.


Premier cpoxon  (D 11665)
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Mar 9, 2009, 10:01 AM
Post #15 of 43 (4414 views)
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Re: [Skydivesg] Shootout - CX100 vs HC1 [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
I've never had any success trying to watch video from that site.

Sandy, pm me or PilotDave and we'll try and sort you out. For reference, I was unable to view the videos using Windows Media Player in the Windows 2008 server OS that I am using, but I did get them to play using VLC media player.


Premier cpoxon  (D 11665)
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Mar 9, 2009, 10:12 AM
Post #16 of 43 (4401 views)
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Re: [cpoxon] Shootout - CX100 vs HC1 [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Bill's videos:

nosteady_hq
steady_hq

Bill's HC1 reference video


PharmerPhil  (D 23899)

Mar 9, 2009, 10:18 AM
Post #17 of 43 (4390 views)
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Re: [Skydivesg] Shootout - CX100 vs HC1 [In reply to] Can't Post

Quote:
I've never had any success trying to watch video from that site.

Ditto. Don't understood why it requires registration, so I never bothered.


Premier billvon  (D 16479)
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Mar 9, 2009, 10:31 AM
Post #18 of 43 (4375 views)
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Re: [billvon] Shootout - CX100 vs HC1 [In reply to] Can't Post

OK, final video I uploaded is slow_exit.wmv. It demonstrates the slow motion capabilities of the CX100.


Premier cpoxon  (D 11665)
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Mar 9, 2009, 10:46 AM
Post #19 of 43 (4359 views)
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Re: [billvon] Shootout - CX100 vs HC1 [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
OK, final video I uploaded is slow_exit.wmv. It demonstrates the slow motion capabilities of the CX100.

and here it is Cool Thanks Bill.


bwilling  (C 13618)

Mar 9, 2009, 11:49 AM
Post #20 of 43 (4313 views)
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Re: [cpoxon] Shootout - CX100 vs HC1 [In reply to] Can't Post

Quote:
For reference, I was unable to view the videos using Windows Media Player in the Windows 2008 server OS that I am using, but I did get them to play using VLC media player.

Windows media player needs codecs. I've found these to be the best, smoothest playing for mpg content.

VLC has them built in, but I've found some larger content (full HD stuff) actually looks better in WMP using the ffdshow codecs.

Edited to add... thanks for the effort Bill, nice work!


(This post was edited by bwilling on Mar 9, 2009, 12:27 PM)


Fast  (D 28237)

Mar 9, 2009, 11:49 AM
Post #21 of 43 (4312 views)
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Re: [PharmerPhil] Shootout - CX100 vs HC1 [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Quote:
I've never had any success trying to watch video from that site.

Ditto. Don't understood why it requires registration, so I never bothered.

It requires registration (at least it was my understanding) because the site was put together on a semi volunteer / donation based system by a skydiver who isn't making money off it and a lot of the bandwidth is donated. Registration helps cut down on the random downloading. The site is meant for skydivers mostly.

Or so that was my understaning.


Bill, the slowmo is neat but I can't imagine it is worth the trouble. I have a CX100 in my camera bag now, have to sort out mounting and will be jumping it soon! Looks like a really nice camera!


pilotdave  (D License)

Mar 9, 2009, 11:56 AM
Post #22 of 43 (4306 views)
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Re: [PharmerPhil] Shootout - CX100 vs HC1 [In reply to] Can't Post

I explained it before. It's so that we can gather email addresses and sell them to spammers. DUH!

Or what Fast said above. That could be it too. The web hosting is donated. It would cost well over $1000/month if we were paying. Registration keeps the load on the server low, so downloads are fast and available for those that care enough to register. I'm not sure what the big deal is... yes, it's annoying. That's the point. 63,000+ registered users don't seem to mind too much though.

Dave


PharmerPhil  (D 23899)

Mar 9, 2009, 12:10 PM
Post #23 of 43 (4287 views)
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Re: [pilotdave] Shootout - CX100 vs HC1 [In reply to] Can't Post

Quote:
... yes, it's annoying

That's all it comes down to for me. There are plenty of free places to post videos that don't require yet another password to simply view them.


bdazel  (D License)

Mar 9, 2009, 12:11 PM
Post #24 of 43 (4286 views)
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Re: [billvon] Shootout - CX100 vs HC1 [In reply to] Can't Post

To me the video looks much better with the steadyshot off. Steady shot makes it obvious that there is some cpu manipulation going on. It just doesn't look right. It looks more real and natural with steadyshot off.

Did you have the wide angle conversion turned on?


(This post was edited by bdazel on Mar 9, 2009, 12:12 PM)


Rockow  (D 28792)

Mar 9, 2009, 1:23 PM
Post #25 of 43 (4245 views)
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Re: [billvon] Shootout - CX100 vs HC1 [In reply to] Can't Post

Were these stills taken with the hc 1 or the cx 100? Also I just got a new cx100 how do you take the stills while in record mode? Is it as simple as adding a bite switch to the input port on the hype eye d pro? Sorry if it sounds like a dumb question...I'm still pretty new to camera flying.


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