Forums: Skydiving: General Skydiving Discussions:
Would you still jump with your.....

 

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Poll: Would you still jump with your.....
Yes 157 / 79%
No 42 / 21%
199 total votes
 
napvid  (A License)

Jun 26, 2008, 10:06 AM
Post #1 of 50 (2232 views)
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Would you still jump with your..... Can't Post

Cypress out for maintenance?

Ok so, on my next repack my Cypress is due for it's 8 year. (first time for me)

When talking to my rigger I asked how long will it take and he said it could take a few weeks. With a disappointed look I was like reallyUnsure He then said he would set me back up to jump while we were waiting for the Cypress to come back.This never even crossed my mind. I just figured (no Cypress no jumping)

Along with the poll question, my other question is if you do jump without the cypress is there anything you would do different while jumping.


Thanks for any input,
Nap


DJL  (C License)

Jun 26, 2008, 10:13 AM
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Re: [napvid] Would you still jump with your..... [In reply to] Can't Post

I voted yes but I wouldn't if I were you.


DougH  (D License)

Jun 26, 2008, 10:25 AM
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Re: [DJL] Would you still jump with your..... [In reply to] Can't Post

Yes, I am right now.

I like the extra margin of safety when it is on, but if I ever get to the point that I think I am unsafe without it I will get golf clubs.


councilman24  (D 8631)

Jun 26, 2008, 10:47 AM
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Re: [napvid] Would you still jump with your..... [In reply to] Can't Post

What you may fail to realize is that ten's of thousands of skydivers made hundreds of thousands of jumps without AAD's. (or AOD's as known then.)

AAD's have existed for decades, but were either military devices sometimes used for civilian jumping or geared toward students. While when available a few experienced jumpers choose to use one most did not. They were heavy, prone to inadvertant activation, used other methods for opening the pack, and were visible when wearing the rig.

For lots of reasons, some being 'not cool' factor, most skydivers didn't use one. Even in 1985 when a good friend may have been saved by a helmet, let alone an AAD, not one person on the load with her or on the dropzone started wearing a hard helmet or got an AAD because of her death. It was part of the sport just as swoop deaths are now.

When the Cypres was introduced it took several years for AAD's to become common.

Lots of DZ talk changed from "hell no I won't jump with an AAD" (pre cypres) to "hell no I won't jump without an AAD". It's been an interesting change to watch.

But anybody around more than 15 years likely has a lot of jumps without an AAD. Of course we don't bounce near as many people in freefall as we used to. Now they bounce under an open canopy.Mad

Jumping without an AAD is not strange or unusual. It was part of the sport for a long time. One of the attractions to me was that once you left the airplane you were dead unless you did SOMETHING. That's rare in life.

You have to judge the added risk for yourself and your comfort.


tommythevegan  (C License)

Jun 26, 2008, 10:52 AM
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Re: [napvid] Would you still jump with your..... [In reply to] Can't Post

I recently had a problem with my Argus and had to send it in for maintenance.

I was very disappointed about having to wait for it to be fixed, until my rigger said, "You can still jump, but you'll have to pull your handles."

The obviousness of that statement made me realize how much I never want to depend on my AAD being there, even though it's a nice bit of extra to have.


beowulf  (C License)

Jun 26, 2008, 10:59 AM
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Re: [napvid] Would you still jump with your..... [In reply to] Can't Post

I would have to buy an AAD first before I could jump with it out for maintenance.


I have never owned an AAD and the only jumps that I have with one are the student jumps and the very few where I borrowed or rented a rig. Yet some how I managed to live!Shocked


(This post was edited by beowulf on Jun 26, 2008, 11:05 AM)


shropshire  (C License)

Jun 26, 2008, 11:31 AM
Post #7 of 50 (2039 views)
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Re: [DJL] Would you still jump with your..... [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
I voted yes but I wouldn't if I were you.

+1 (when I started jumping, we didn't have them)

But it depends upon local DZ rules too.


(This post was edited by shropshire on Jun 26, 2008, 11:32 AM)


labrys  (D 29848)

Jun 26, 2008, 11:33 AM
Post #8 of 50 (2036 views)
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Re: [napvid] Would you still jump with your..... [In reply to] Can't Post

Funjump - Yes
With students - No

DZ policy


Premier billvon  (D 16479)
Moderator
Jun 26, 2008, 11:38 AM
Post #9 of 50 (2028 views)
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Re: [napvid] Would you still jump with your..... [In reply to] Can't Post

My first few hundred jumps were without a cypres, so no problem.

(Here's a shocker for you - if my cypres failed startup, I would still jump and fix it later!)


gearless_chris  (D 29012)

Jun 26, 2008, 11:52 AM
Post #10 of 50 (1992 views)
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Re: [napvid] Would you still jump with your..... [In reply to] Can't Post

My old rig didn't have a Cypress when I bought it, still doesn't. My new rig does, and I would jump without the cypress in it also for maint. checks and the times you don't want an AAD on. I don't have a problem jumping with or without them.


Feeblemind  (D 28621)

Jun 26, 2008, 11:55 AM
Post #11 of 50 (1985 views)
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Re: [napvid] Would you still jump with your..... [In reply to] Can't Post

I only have 4 years in sport with 900 jumps and I would not jump without an AAD. Even though I never intend on it having to save my life, it's a cheap insurance policy IMHO. During my brief tenure in this sport I have had two very significant mid air collisions (one was my fault and the other was someone elses) both made me see stars and damn near rendered me unconscious. I would rather be sitting on the ground wishing I was in the sky than have something happen in the sky that puts me into the ground.


Stay Safe,

Feeble


mnealtx  (B 30496)

Jun 26, 2008, 12:07 PM
Post #12 of 50 (1958 views)
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Re: [napvid] Would you still jump with your..... [In reply to] Can't Post

Yes, I would (and have) jumped without it turned on, and I'll still jump even when it goes in for maintenance.


livendive  (D 21415)

Jun 26, 2008, 12:15 PM
Post #13 of 50 (1940 views)
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Re: [napvid] Would you still jump with your..... [In reply to] Can't Post

Absolutely. The only thing I wouldn't do is a tandem (because they're legally required on tandems). I wouldn't be enthused about doing AFF without one, but I've done it before and would do it again if necessary.

Blues,
Dave


DougH  (D License)

Jun 26, 2008, 12:33 PM
Post #14 of 50 (1916 views)
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Re: [labrys] Would you still jump with your..... [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Funjump - Yes
With students - No

DZ policy

DZ policy at my place as well. It makes sense, we had an AFF instructor chase a student well past his harddeck. He went in with nothing out.

They require it on tandem video jumps as well, I think that is a little much but I respect the fact that their policy was based off the incidents and experinces they have had.


MajorDad  (D 579)

Jun 26, 2008, 12:45 PM
Post #15 of 50 (1899 views)
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Re: [napvid] Would you still jump with your..... [In reply to] Can't Post

My primary rig has an AAD and my backup rig does not.

I have always beaten the AAD and would not hesitate to jump without one.

Blue Ones


Baksteen  (C 708753)

Jun 26, 2008, 12:46 PM
Post #16 of 50 (1895 views)
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Re: [napvid] Would you still jump with your..... [In reply to] Can't Post

I voted no.

The one jump that I'll need an AAD because some joker knocked my lights out in freefall is not going to be the same jump that I wasn't using an AAD.

Besides, I never jumped without an AAD before, so that would mean beer...Tongue


Premier wmw999  (D 6296)

Jun 26, 2008, 12:53 PM
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Re: [tommythevegan] Would you still jump with your..... [In reply to] Can't Post

Quote:
I was very disappointed about having to wait for it to be fixed, until my rigger said, "You can still jump, but you'll have to pull your handles."

The obviousness of that statement made me realize how much I never want to depend on my AAD being there, even though it's a nice bit of extra to have.
Quoted, because it's perfect.

Wendy W.


Thanatos340  (B 27588)

Jun 26, 2008, 12:56 PM
Post #18 of 50 (1877 views)
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Re: [billvon] Would you still jump with your..... [In reply to] Can't Post

Quote:
(Here's a shocker for you - if my cypres failed startup, I would still jump and fix it later!)

I would (and have many times) jump with out a Cypress.

But I do not think I would jump with a Cypress in my rig that was not functioning correctly (ie.. Failed Start up). In that case I would take the rig to a rigger, Have the cypress removed and sent in for service and jump till it came back.

I would be much more concerned about jumping with a Cypress that was not functioning correctly than I would be just not jumping with one at all.


pilotdave  (D License)

Jun 26, 2008, 1:05 PM
Post #19 of 50 (1869 views)
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Re: [napvid] Would you still jump with your..... [In reply to] Can't Post

I would and I have. I much prefer to have a cypres, but not having one isn't going to stop me. But, it is a personal choice and there is NOTHING wrong with choosing not to jump until your cypres is back.

Dave


napvid  (A License)

Jun 26, 2008, 1:48 PM
Post #20 of 50 (1820 views)
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Re: [Feeblemind] Would you still jump with your..... [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
I have had two very significant mid air collisions (one was my fault and the other was someone else's) both made me see stars and damn near rendered me unconscious.

Yes this is exactly what is going on in the back my mind.

In reply to:
I was very disappointed about having to wait for it to be fixed, until my rigger said, "You can still jump, but you'll have to pull your handles."

The obviousness of that statement made me realize how much I never want to depend on my AAD being there, even though it's a nice bit of extra to have.

I definitely do not rely on my AAD or RSL to save me. When it comes that time I better have both my handles in my hand or watching them float away or I need to reevaluate my choice of sports. I have not had a malfunction of any kind in my short career but I'm confident that I will be able to handle it when it eventually happens.(hell I better be or I have no business in the air).

In reply to:
The one jump that I'll need an AAD because some joker knocked my lights out in freefall is not going to be the same jump that I wasn't using an AAD.

Thank you for all the input and I have made the decision not to jump my rig without an AAD. I just don't want to be (That One) when they say if he had an ADD he my have lived.



I hope that 70+% that voted yes will still respect me in the morningWink


Nap


Premier faulknerwn  (D 17441)
Moderator
Jun 26, 2008, 1:55 PM
Post #21 of 50 (1809 views)
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In reply to:
During my brief tenure in this sport I have had two very significant mid air collisions (one was my fault and the other was someone elses) both made me see stars and damn near rendered me unconscious.

This sort of thing makes me wonder - I've got close to 5000 jumps and have never been hit in freefall, never been close to unconscious, nothing even vaguely of the sort.... Never even been dizzy.

Of course the majority of those jumps I never had an AAD. It really makes me think that people are being far more aggressive because they have AAD's than they would be if they didn't.


jsaxton  (D 26818)

Jun 26, 2008, 2:01 PM
Post #22 of 50 (1791 views)
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Re: [napvid] Would you still jump with your..... [In reply to] Can't Post

Quote:
Along with the poll question, my other question is if you do jump without the cypress is there anything you would do different while jumping.

If you chose to do a particular jump because you have a Cypres, then you probably shouldn't be on that jump anyway.


kelpdiver  (B 7)

Jun 26, 2008, 2:10 PM
Post #23 of 50 (1781 views)
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Re: [billvon] Would you still jump with your..... [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
My first few hundred jumps were without a cypres, so no problem.

(Here's a shocker for you - if my cypres failed startup, I would still jump and fix it later!)

But would you (in either scenario) if your DZ required use?

If you have the cypres removed during your reserve repack and it comes back a month later, is it another repack to reinstall it?

I have the 4 year to do one one of the next two cycles, debating having it all done now since I'm on the ground anyway until a Sept 7 race, or in dead of winter.


DrewEckhardt  (D 28461)

Jun 26, 2008, 2:22 PM
Post #24 of 50 (1766 views)
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Re: [napvid] Would you still jump with your..... [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Cypress out for maintenance?

Sure. I took one out of rig #2 for its 8 year due in 2006 and I've become undecided if it's even worth sending it in. Never put one in rig #3 (when you skydive long enough, the gear in your closet breeds). Didn't have one at all on the first rig I bought (not Cypres ready or retrofitable).

In reply to:
Along with the poll question, my other question is if you do jump without the cypress is there anything you would do different while jumping.

I wouldn't do AFF jumps without a Cypres. That's the only Cypres fire I've seen personally that didn't result from its owner being stupid by either not paying attention to their altitude or just deciding it would be better if the Cypres pulled (dislocated arm).

If you're worried about getting kocked out a jump because the other people are muppets, you should be finding other people to jump with. If you're worried because you're in over your head you should be doing simpler or smaller jumps.


(This post was edited by DrewEckhardt on Jun 26, 2008, 2:23 PM)


livendive  (D 21415)

Jun 26, 2008, 2:31 PM
Post #25 of 50 (1758 views)
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Re: [faulknerwn] Would you still jump with your..... [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:
During my brief tenure in this sport I have had two very significant mid air collisions (one was my fault and the other was someone elses) both made me see stars and damn near rendered me unconscious.

This sort of thing makes me wonder - I've got close to 5000 jumps and have never been hit in freefall, never been close to unconscious, nothing even vaguely of the sort.... Never even been dizzy.

I have exactly once, while doing AFF in a frap hat without an AAD (my big-boy student caught me right on the chin while I was trying to evade the FUBARed reserve side guy). He hit me hard enough that I didn't see the PC till the bridle was wrapped under my arm, was shaking off cobwebs while tracking away, and couldn't really chew solid food for nearly two weeks. I ordered a proper helmet with chin protection a couple weeks later and put a CYPRES in my rig not too long after that. It still kind of wierds me out to turn it on for anything other than AFF, but I often times do so despite my reservations.

Blues,
Dave


(This post was edited by livendive on Jun 26, 2008, 2:33 PM)


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