Forums: Skydiving: Gear and Rigging:
Disconnected Skyhook

 

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bianuan  (B 104602)

Jan 19, 2008, 1:10 PM
Post #1 of 72 (2296 views)
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Disconnected Skyhook Can't Post

Does anyone know if jumping a rig installed with a skyhook, but with it not connected it is a bad idea?
(Javelin, pd 143)

Thanks!


(Ive done a search and not yet found a post within the big discussions relating to this - sorry if this is a repost/silly question)


TheSecret  (B License)

Jan 19, 2008, 1:14 PM
Post #2 of 72 (2258 views)
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Re: [bianuan] Disconnected Skyhook [In reply to] Can't Post

I don't have your answer, but I was just wondering why disconnect it?


bianuan  (B 104602)

Jan 19, 2008, 1:42 PM
Post #3 of 72 (2236 views)
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Re: [TheSecret] Disconnected Skyhook [In reply to] Can't Post

yes well, my rigger doesnt seem to like them at all, I love my rigger I really do, and I really respect his opinion, but I would like some more info before going ahead with his recommendations on this one if you know.


Premier PhreeZone  (D License)
Moderator
Jan 19, 2008, 1:48 PM
Post #4 of 72 (2228 views)
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Re: [bianuan] Disconnected Skyhook [In reply to] Can't Post

You can jump with out it hooked up but I'd seriously ask your rigger for more details on why he has that opinion. After you find that out search out and see if there is other information out there at matches his feelings or if he formed those feelings with out have really good footing for those decisions.

You are going to find very few negatives to the Skyhook but there are at least a few out there, the largest one being CRW. Search out the issues he has and then if answers are out there to counter those agruments. You might just find that you disagree with your rigger and choose to jump with it installed and hooked up anyways. Smile


bianuan  (B 104602)

Jan 19, 2008, 1:55 PM
Post #5 of 72 (2221 views)
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Re: [PhreeZone] Disconnected Skyhook [In reply to] Can't Post

Thanks


mark  (D 6108)

Jan 19, 2008, 1:57 PM
Post #6 of 72 (2220 views)
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Re: [bianuan] Disconnected Skyhook [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
yes well, my rigger doesnt seem to like them at all, I love my rigger I really do, and I really respect his opinion, but I would like some more info before going ahead with his recommendations on this one if you know.

Your profile says "Talon." Time to update?

Mark


bigway

Jan 19, 2008, 2:23 PM
Post #7 of 72 (2196 views)
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Re: [bianuan] Disconnected Skyhook [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
yes well, my rigger doesnt seem to like them at all, I love my rigger I really do, and I really respect his opinion, but I would like some more info before going ahead with his recommendations on this one if you know.


Wow, maybe you should point your love elsewhere.

If you have a skyhook dont be a moron and disconnect it.
Imagine fucking yourself up one day and realizing that if only you had your skyhook connected.

Would you jump with your cypres turned off?


Premier DSE  (D 29060)

Jan 19, 2008, 3:11 PM
Post #8 of 72 (2160 views)
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Re: [bigway] Disconnected Skyhook [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Wow, maybe you should point your love elsewhere.

If you have a skyhook dont be a moron and disconnect it.
Imagine fucking yourself up one day and realizing that if only you had your skyhook connected.

Would you jump with your cypres turned off?

You couldn't pay me to jump with a Skyhook, nor an RSL. Yes, I've jumped with my Cypres off, as there are occasional reasons for that, too.


Premier NWFlyer  (D 29960)

Jan 19, 2008, 3:23 PM
Post #9 of 72 (2142 views)
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Re: [bianuan] Disconnected Skyhook [In reply to] Can't Post

Have you thought long and hard about why you would jump with or without a skyhook (or any type of RSL)?

Why did you jump with it? Why are you considering jumping without it? "My rigger doesn't like them" is a pretty stupid reason, in my opinion, because it shows me that you're not thinking for yourself.

Do the research. Get on the UPT web site and read about the Skyhook and understand the technology. Hell, PM the manufacturer himself - he posts here under the screen name billbooth and I bet he'd be glad to answer any questions you have. Do a search on here and read opinions, but realize they're just opinions, and like assholes, everyone's got one.

Learn about your gear.

Then make an informed decision. Don't do it because your rigger said so or because a bunch of yahoos on the internet say you should or shouldn't.


bigway

Jan 19, 2008, 3:26 PM
Post #10 of 72 (2138 views)
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Re: [DSE] Disconnected Skyhook [In reply to] Can't Post

maybe so but you would not buy a skyhook then.
What is the point in having something if you are not going to use it.

I know there are reasons to jump with a cypres turned off but i cant think of any at 200 jumps.


Premier NWFlyer  (D 29960)

Jan 19, 2008, 3:31 PM
Post #11 of 72 (2133 views)
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Re: [bigway] Disconnected Skyhook [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
I know there are reasons to jump with a cypres turned off but i cant think of any at 200 jumps.

It's not operating properly.Wink (Not sure how true it was but I did hear a rumor that the suspected cause of a high Cypres fire at the Eloy boogie this year was that it hadn't been properly calibrating for the jumper. I can't imagine I'd leave that unit powered up if that were the case). But that's about the only reason I can think of at 200 jumps.


Premier DSE  (D 29060)

Jan 19, 2008, 3:54 PM
Post #12 of 72 (2104 views)
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Re: [NWFlyer] Disconnected Skyhook [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:
I know there are reasons to jump with a cypres turned off but i cant think of any at 200 jumps.

It's not operating properly.Wink (Not sure how true it was but I did hear a rumor that the suspected cause of a high Cypres fire at the Eloy boogie this year was that it hadn't been properly calibrating for the jumper. I can't imagine I'd leave that unit powered up if that were the case). But that's about the only reason I can think of at 200 jumps.

The rumor is true. Coincidence that our Cypres' wouldn't calibrate/arm correctly on the same day at the same elevation?

The Skyhook may offer a reduction of risk but to suggest someone is stupid for not using one, or to suggest that someone "bought the wrong rig" as Bigway stated in another thread, is ------.
If the rigger is experienced and trusted, is able to provide reasons why he/she doesn't like the Skyhook, well.... they're standing there vs a non-face on the internet. 200 jumps or not.


bigway

Jan 19, 2008, 4:20 PM
Post #13 of 72 (2091 views)
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Re: [DSE] Disconnected Skyhook [In reply to] Can't Post

what are you talking about 'bought the wrong rig'.

If i said that surely it was a joke, maybe dry humour but a joke..

I think someone who buys a skyhook would have bought it because they had investigated it and made the decision to purchase one.... then to turn around because of one persons opinion and try to stop using it is crazy... all i am saying is how would the OP feel if she/he does dissconnect it and then causes harm to ones self only to later find that they could have avoided that by having the skyhook in place.

Surely if you want to stop using the skyhook you would have it uninstalled.

It is like jumping with a cypres but not having it turned on the one time you need it.

I am giving the person another way to think about it.

Saying that i said someone was stupid because they bought the wrong rig is pathetic. I dont recall saying this and if i did i am sure it would have been in a dry humour way but what has that got to do with this thread?

Sounds like you have heard me say something that you do not agree with and now feel the need to drag it into this forum so that my opinion can be rendered worthless. Not very cool of you.


bigway

Jan 19, 2008, 4:24 PM
Post #14 of 72 (2088 views)
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Re: [DSE] Disconnected Skyhook [In reply to] Can't Post

Where the hell did i suggest that someone was stupid for not using their skyhook?

All i ever offered was my opinion and you come here and try to disscredit me and twist my words.

Last thing i expected from a moderator was to attack other members opinions and twist their words.

P.S. you are also a 'non-face' on the internet so i guess your opinion also means jackshit.

We are in the forums right? we are all non-faces on the internet... does that mean we can not have an opinion? even though it is in the forums the discussion is taking place?

But hey, i guess you are a moderator so what you say must be the only opinion worth listening to.


(This post was edited by bigway on Jan 19, 2008, 4:29 PM)


Premier DSE  (D 29060)

Jan 19, 2008, 4:59 PM
Post #15 of 72 (2052 views)
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Re: [bigway] Disconnected Skyhook [In reply to] Can't Post

Moron=stupid in my book.
http://www.dropzone.com/...post=3088416#3088416
Has nothing to do with being a moderator. If you meant your comment about buying the "wrong rig" in humor, my apologies, I didn't/don't read it that way.
http://www.dropzone.com/...post=3088367#3088367

We're all non-faces on the internet. If the OP's rigger is standing next to him vs you, me, or anyone else over the web, generally the rigger's advice should carry more weight, IMO.
No point in getting your panties in a wad over it, a real, live person beats a virtual person in my book anyday.
As far as my name, if DZ.com had enough characters to allow for my whole name, it would be there.


bigway

Jan 19, 2008, 5:22 PM
Post #16 of 72 (2045 views)
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Re: [DSE] Disconnected Skyhook [In reply to] Can't Post

excuse me, I'm just tired. been up selling gear in the uk and slovenia all night while in australia.
never said aanythinng about ure name.

I have not clicked that link yet but will. I have no right to tell anyone that they bought the wrong rig and as selling gear is my profession it would be out of my character to ever bad mouth any skydiing gear.

yes a riggers opinion should bear more weight as an instructors should just as bill booths should.

a person with under 200 jumps in the uk does not jump camera and a skyhook on a rig does not need to be dissconnected... I am pretty sure that with her amount of jumps that in the uk she would have to have an rsl anyway, also pretty sure that if you have an rsl with that many jumps in the uuk that it must be connected so why dissconnect the skyhook for an rsl?
I could possibly be very wrong about that so sorry if I am, I just remember when I was load master that at my dz in uk I had to ckeck the rsl for b license and below... maybe it was just dzso rule.

I never called the person stupid (moron), I said don't be one who may end up regreting it when they have it there... it was meant in encouragment and not in a mean way... I am not a mean person.


bigway

Jan 19, 2008, 5:34 PM
Post #17 of 72 (2025 views)
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Re: [DSE] Disconnected Skyhook [In reply to] Can't Post

I can't believe you bouught bonfire trash talk to gear and rigging.

I won big at poker.... a guy says that I can buy him a rig then, I say I don't sell talons like he suggested I buy him so he is out of luck as I don't get them cheap so I can't buy him one. he then guesses that I buy him a wings, I said you don't get a second chance.

where on earth did I say he bbought the wrong rig.

that is a couple of guys having a laugh with each other over me coming into some cash and he tells me to buy him a rig.

I think that is really low of you to say you have quoted me ut twisted my words and taken the joke from bonfire to disscredit me in gear and rigging.

I really thought highly of you and have always praised and respected your knowledge and avise and was very happy to see you take on the photography forum but showing people a so called quote of mine "bought the wrong rig" when I said nothing of the sort and you just twisted my words and context to damn my opinion is really sad of you.
please go back and read that thread in the bonfire again as I take that as a personal attack and insult.


TheSecret  (B License)

Jan 19, 2008, 5:48 PM
Post #18 of 72 (2013 views)
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Re: [DSE] Disconnected Skyhook [In reply to] Can't Post

You couldn't pay me to jump with a Skyhook, nor an RSL. Yes, I've jumped with my Cypres off, as there are occasional reasons for that, too.

May I ask what are your personal reasons for disliking any forms of RSL? Is that just for certain types of jumps or all jumps?


bigway

Jan 19, 2008, 5:53 PM
Post #19 of 72 (2007 views)
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Re: [TheSecret] Disconnected Skyhook [In reply to] Can't Post

Not speaking for DSl but you will find that not many camera fliers would ever jump with a skyhook or any form of RSL.
Say their main was cutaway and then got caught on their cameras they would not want their reserve coming out straight away. They would need time to be able to clear their canopy and make it their decision when their reserve comes out.
A RSL would pull their reserve out right as they cut away so if it got snagged they would be in a great deal of trouble.

Just thought i may be able to shed some light as to why some people would not have an rsl on under any circumstance.


airtwardo  (D License)

Jan 19, 2008, 6:14 PM
Post #20 of 72 (1989 views)
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Re: [bigway] Disconnected Skyhook [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Not speaking for DSl but you will find that not many camera fliers would ever jump with a skyhook or any form of RSL.
Say their main was cutaway and then got caught on their cameras they would not want their reserve coming out straight away. They would need time to be able to clear their canopy and make it their decision when their reserve comes out.
A RSL would pull their reserve out right as they cut away so if it got snagged they would be in a great deal of trouble.

Just thought i may be able to shed some light as to why some people would not have an rsl on under any circumstance.

Also as a demonstration jumper that carries a lot of extra gear, I don't use one for the reason you site, as well as wanting the option of falling down and away from the other jumpers and their extra gear...often during demos a jumper needs to be concentrating on deploying flags, banners, smoke etc. and aren't ready to initiate an immediate turn should a reserve suddenly appear right in front of them.

I don't use it on sport jumps because I only want one set of EP's in my hard drive. I use the same rig, rigged the same way for all my jumps.


chutingstar  (D 19956)

Jan 19, 2008, 6:45 PM
Post #21 of 72 (1963 views)
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Re: [bigway] Disconnected Skyhook [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Not speaking for DSl but you will find that not many camera fliers would ever jump with a skyhook or any form of RSL.

I have a Skyhook on my Vector3 and have no issue wearing it when doing camera jumps. I also have one reserve ride that was skyhook deployed from a cutaway during spinning line twists under a Velocity.

And I don't buy the "caught on camera gear" argument for not having RSLs or Skyhooks. It won't matter if you have do or don't have an RSL or Skyhook if you cutaway a canopy that has some part of it partially wrapped around your helmet or camera gear. You've got bigger issues than whether or not the RSL/Skyhook deploys your reserve as you cutaway a main that is snagged on your helmet. You may spend the rest of your life trying to get that snag undone or cut off. It may be better to have as much material above your head when trying to deal with some type of snagged material, line or riser.

Mike


kenneth21441  (B License)

Jan 19, 2008, 6:49 PM
Post #22 of 72 (1959 views)
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Re: [bianuan] Disconnected Skyhook [In reply to] Can't Post

Personnally having a skyhook installed is a great ideal. But also it has to be used. Its like having seat belts in your car. They dont work if you dont use them.

after all my research and rigging I feel that you may never know what situation you will be faced with in this sport and having another area to use may just save ones life.

The question that I must ask is if a skyhook is installed on a rig then does this not make the skyhook part of the TSO/ packing manual?? Meaning that this must be hooked up when the rig is packed. This means that the rigger is the only one whom can hook / unhook it from the system (the red lanyard onto the actual hook etc...

Lets look at this that way.!!!

Just my two cents here.....
ThanksWink


airtwardo  (D License)

Jan 19, 2008, 6:59 PM
Post #23 of 72 (1947 views)
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Re: [chutingstar] Disconnected Skyhook [In reply to] Can't Post

It may be better to have as much material above your head when trying to deal with some type of snagged material, line or riser.

In reply to:

"MAY" being the correct choice of word.

I would never tell someone NOT to have an RSL or Skyhook installed and operational.

The choice not to use one is a personal one that each jumper should weigh in regard to their own needs and experience.


jheadley  (D 28710)

Jan 19, 2008, 7:04 PM
Post #24 of 72 (1931 views)
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Re: [chutingstar] Disconnected Skyhook [In reply to] Can't Post

I've always worried that if a main did get snagged on a camera helmet, it may break your neck as you cut away.

Are there any camera flyers out there who have stories to share about their main snagging on their helmet, and how they dealt with it? You hear about the possibility all the time but it doesn't seem to happen too often in real life.


bigway

Jan 19, 2008, 7:17 PM
Post #25 of 72 (1924 views)
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Re: [chutingstar] Disconnected Skyhook [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:
Not speaking for DSl but you will find that not many camera fliers would ever jump with a skyhook or any form of RSL.

I have a Skyhook on my Vector3 and have no issue wearing it when doing camera jumps. I also have one reserve ride that was skyhook deployed from a cutaway during spinning line twists under a Velocity.

And I don't buy the "caught on camera gear" argument for not having RSLs or Skyhooks. It won't matter if you have do or don't have an RSL or Skyhook if you cutaway a canopy that has some part of it partially wrapped around your helmet or camera gear. You've got bigger issues than whether or not the RSL/Skyhook deploys your reserve as you cutaway a main that is snagged on your helmet. You may spend the rest of your life trying to get that snag undone or cut off. It may be better to have as much material above your head when trying to deal with some type of snagged material, line or riser.

Mike

Even though i stated about it snagging, i also agree that their are certain times that where you would want as much material above your head as possible but to me that scenario is the last and final resort.

However, I do agree with you about your fair points about how in the shit you are when you have a canopy around you. I personally have been caught on a door of a cessna and hanging from it. Once the door handle broke i had lines wrapped around my arm. Thank god i had something like 10,000 feet to get that sorted out though. Different story if it was at pulltime.


The thing is, there are so many different scenarios fo what can go wrong. Alot of people will call me a fool but i dont jump with an RSL or a cypres. I think i may buy a cypres shortly however after much deliberation. Why dont i jump with a cypres? Well i have had an experience where i am glad i did not have a cypres but that is another thread.

However, I would feel like a fucking muppet/moron/idiot if i had a skyhook or a cypres and had it unhooked or turned the one time i needed it.


That is all i am saying. At just over 100 jumps and maybe this person has never experienced a cutaway that maybe it is a good idea she has all the help she needs?
She would have been trained with the knowledge of having an rsl their to pull the reserve out so maybe it is a good thing she keeps it on..... maybe it is not.

I don't know if it means anything to anyone else but it discourages me that her rigger has said that he does not like them and that she has had to come here and ask a bunch of people she does not know what we think.... in her writing it sounds like she wants to keep it hooked up and that she is looking for reasons as to why she should keep it hooked up so she has reasons to stand up to her rigger.

Something else that sits in my mind about this thread is how the vigil is banned at dropzones in the uk, i dont know why that bugs me with this thread but it does.

It would be interesting to hear who the rigger is as it sounds like my rigger and if it is, i say that he only says it because he can't afford one himself and the sneaky bastard will try and buy it off you at a cheap price.

However if it is the rigger down in Netherhavon, well i would want to hear what his reasons are as i found him to be a good rigger.


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