Forums: Skydiving: Skydiving History & Trivia:
Z-Hills Flightline

 


piper17  (D 3362)

Dec 22, 2007, 7:55 AM
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Z-Hills Flightline Can't Post

The slide has a Feb 77 date but I'm assuming I took this at the Turkey Meet in 1976. I guess I could check my log books but I have enough of a mess what with thirty-seven years of skydiving slides strewn about!

Round engines galore. Hoop will have to tell you who owned the various aircraft.
Attachments: Z-Hills Flightline 1977.jpg (16.4 KB)


Jim_Hooper  (D 4019)

Dec 22, 2007, 10:19 AM
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Re: [piper17] Z-Hills Flightline [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
The slide has a Feb 77 date but I'm assuming I took this at the Turkey Meet in 1976. I guess I could check my log books but I have enough of a mess what with thirty-seven years of skydiving slides strewn about!

Round engines galore. Hoop will have to tell you who owned the various aircraft.

Damn, Jim, 30 years down the road the only two I can positively identify are 43WT (Bob Sweet's Lodestar, second from left), 40T, and then possibly Harold Lang's Lodestar from Palatka. And yes, that would have been the '76 Turkey Meet with 102 registered 10-man teams, eight DC-3/C-47s and two Lodestars (one of the three in the pic did not fly the meet).
Hoop


howardwhite  (C 3896)

Dec 22, 2007, 10:30 AM
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Re: [Jim_Hooper] Z-Hills Flightline [In reply to] Can't Post

Well, the one on the right appears to be the one of which I posted pictures earlier, here:
http://www.dropzone.com/...ng=lodestar;#2828660
One Lodestar was probably the one flown by Nate Pond,D-69, at Turners Falls, MA, that year.
I was talking with Nate about it a few weeks ago and he recalled flying it at Z-Hills when one of the engines seized up so quickly and firmly that it was actually ripped from the engine mounts and hung on only by hoses and wiring.
Nate, of course, shut everything down in a hurry. His copilot asked why.
"We're going to crash, and we don't want a fire" was the approximate response.
After they got on the ground and sat for 30 seconds or so, a voice came from one of the jumpers in the back of the plane.
"Is it o.k. if we get out now, Mr. Pond?"

HW


(This post was edited by howardwhite on Dec 22, 2007, 4:15 PM)


Niki1  (D 3103)

Dec 22, 2007, 11:02 AM
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Re: [Jim_Hooper] Z-Hills Flightline [In reply to] Can't Post

 

Damn, Jim, 30 years down the road the only two I can positively identify are 43WT (Bob Sweet's Lodestar, second from left), 40T, and then possibly Harold Lang's Lodestar from Palatka. And yes, that would have been the '76 Turkey Meet with 102 registered 10-man teams, eight DC-3/C-47s and two Lodestars (one of the three in the pic did not fly the meet).
Hoop
Jim,
Good to see your name on here. And the Z-Hills Ten Man Patch sure brings back a lot of good mimories.
That Lodestar with the long windows belonged to Harold Stewart who was the DZ owner at Palatka. Even more great memories along with a lump in my throat.
That meet was the culmination of everything that was Skydiving in the '70s. After that, things seemed to sort "platteu off" for a while.


Jim_Hooper  (D 4019)

Dec 22, 2007, 12:45 PM
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In reply to:
I was talking with Nate about it a few weeks ago and he recalled flying it at Z-Hills when one of the engines seized up so quickly and firmly that it was actually ripped from the engine mounts and hung on only by hoses and wiring.

I saw the whole thing. 644KP had just rotated when a thin stream of smoke came off one engine and then there was a godawmighty BANG! when the master rod snapped The airplane was back on the ground just past the intersection and stopped just shy of the numbers. A few days later I wandered over to have a look. The prop had been pulled and revealed that the torque of the prop when the engine siezed had twisted the splined, 6-inch diameter end of the crankshaft by about 60 degrees. Impressive.
Hoop


Jim_Hooper  (D 4019)

Dec 22, 2007, 12:54 PM
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Jim,
Good to see your name on here. And the Z-Hills Ten Man Patch sure brings back a lot of good mimories.
That Lodestar with the long windows belonged to Harold Stewart who was the DZ owner at Palatka. Even more great memories along with a lump in my throat.
That meet was the culmination of everything that was Skydiving in the '70s. After that, things seemed to sort "platteu off" for a while.
Well, I'll just be go to hell...Bob Nixon, one of the good guys who helped make Z'hills such a fun place. Mike Wadell sent me a photo recently of your old team. As I just told JS Bird in an email, it was truly the golden age of skydiving. Don't you feel a little sorry for those who never experienced it? What an era.
Remind me which year it was that Harold and his Lodestar disappeared somewhere south of Florida.
Hoop


jonstark  (D 8298)

Dec 22, 2007, 1:56 PM
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Re: [Niki1] Z-Hills Flightline [In reply to] Can't Post

Good to hear from you too Niki. You been lurking or too busy?

I've got my Z-Hills Ten Man patch sitting in my dresser drawer just waiting for an appropriate place. Buoyant memories of good times past.

jon


diablopilot  (D License)

Dec 22, 2007, 7:35 PM
Post #8 of 21 (1964 views)
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Re: [Jim_Hooper] Z-Hills Flightline [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:
The slide has a Feb 77 date but I'm assuming I took this at the Turkey Meet in 1976. I guess I could check my log books but I have enough of a mess what with thirty-seven years of skydiving slides strewn about!

Round engines galore. Hoop will have to tell you who owned the various aircraft.

Damn, Jim, 30 years down the road the only two I can positively identify are 43WT (Bob Sweet's Lodestar, second from left), 40T, and then possibly Harold Lang's Lodestar from Palatka. And yes, that would have been the '76 Turkey Meet with 102 registered 10-man teams, eight DC-3/C-47s and two Lodestars (one of the three in the pic did not fly the meet).
Hoop


Some days I think I was born too late in history.Smile


BillyVance  (D 18895)

Dec 22, 2007, 8:39 PM
Post #9 of 21 (1948 views)
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Re: [diablopilot] Z-Hills Flightline [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:
In reply to:
The slide has a Feb 77 date but I'm assuming I took this at the Turkey Meet in 1976. I guess I could check my log books but I have enough of a mess what with thirty-seven years of skydiving slides strewn about!

Round engines galore. Hoop will have to tell you who owned the various aircraft.

Damn, Jim, 30 years down the road the only two I can positively identify are 43WT (Bob Sweet's Lodestar, second from left), 40T, and then possibly Harold Lang's Lodestar from Palatka. And yes, that would have been the '76 Turkey Meet with 102 registered 10-man teams, eight DC-3/C-47s and two Lodestars (one of the three in the pic did not fly the meet).
Hoop


Some days I think I was born too late in history.Smile

Man you got that right. I'd love to have today's gear and yesterday's flight lines though...


Zing  (D 6343)

Dec 22, 2007, 8:47 PM
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Re: [BillyVance] Z-Hills Flightline [In reply to] Can't Post

That was a gas at ZHills that year, but I'm hoping to live long enough to see a boogie with a fleet of Beseler's DC-3 turbine conversions.
I'd REALLY like to get me some stick time in one of those.


zoobrothertom  (D 9397)

Dec 23, 2007, 2:00 AM
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Re: [Jim_Hooper] Z-Hills Flightline [In reply to] Can't Post

Shocked Holy Shit!! 102 - 10 man teams registered!! That has got to be a record for any skydiving competition. Does anyone know of anything bigger?


Jim_Hooper  (D 4019)

Dec 23, 2007, 3:33 AM
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In reply to:
That was a gas at ZHills that year, but I'm hoping to live long enough to see a boogie with a fleet of Beseler's DC-3 turbine conversions.

Zing - for time-to-climb and reliability, yeah, there's something to be said for it, but to lose that come-on-baby starter motor whine, the rattle-rattle, cough-cough, BANG, grumble-rumble-rumble, roar and clouds of exhaust smoke from 20 big radials...it just wouldn't be the same. The mid-70s Turkey Meet flightlines on a crisp, dewy morning with that deep-throated, ground-shaking, soul-satisfying sound and teams lined up to board will forever be an enduring image of Z'hills: it still speaks to the hearts of those who shared those amazing times.
Hoop


HimHim  (D 5218)

Dec 23, 2007, 7:20 AM
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Re: [Jim_Hooper] Z-Hills Flightline [In reply to] Can't Post

Hoop, that's gotta be the best description of a radial startup I've ever read! Don't forget Dick Giarusso's voice over the P.A. reminding us to pick up our trash and keep the DZ clean (a la Woodstock) and Scotty warning everyone not to trust the brown acid. (I think he wanted it all for himself).


Jim_Hooper  (D 4019)

Dec 23, 2007, 7:34 AM
Post #14 of 21 (1881 views)
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Re: [HimHim] Z-Hills Flightline [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Hoop, that's gotta be the best description of a radial startup I've ever read! Don't forget Dick Giarusso's voice over the P.A. reminding us to pick up our trash and keep the DZ clean (a la Woodstock) and Scotty warning everyone not to trust the brown acid. (I think he wanted it all for himself).

Coming from someone who saw hundreds - maybe thousands - of them, that's a helluva compliment, Mark. Many thanks. PM me and let me know what you've been doing since we last crossed paths.
Hoop


(This post was edited by Jim_Hooper on Dec 23, 2007, 7:46 AM)


Niki1  (D 3103)

Dec 24, 2007, 9:02 AM
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Re: [Jim_Hooper] Z-Hills Flightline [In reply to] Can't Post

   I think that it was late Feb. of '78. Kivi (John Kivipelto) and Harold went down South. A lot of stories, mostly speculation, about that.

We called that Lodestar the "Foxy Lady". John and I put carpet on the floor and walls up to the windows. (Thank God it wasn't shag carpet. We would've had an extra 200 pounds of sand in about a month). I think it was one of the nicer Lodestars flying jumpers but since it was from my home DZ, I'm probably not objective.
Quote:


(This post was edited by Niki1 on Dec 24, 2007, 9:17 AM)


Niki1  (D 3103)

Dec 24, 2007, 9:12 AM
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Re: [jonstark] Z-Hills Flightline [In reply to] Can't Post

Jon,
I lurk here most of the time. Believe it or not I've learned to keep my mouth shut unless I've got someting to say. Well, most of the time, anyway.

I gave my Z-Hills 10 Man patch to Fred Cruess a bunch of years ago. He bought us each one in the spring of '72 and tossed me one. Then some one else pointed out that mine had only 9 stars on it. A mistake at the embrodery company, I guess. Fred was good natured about it (sort of) and I gave it back about '91 when we had a Palatka reunion.


jonstark  (D 8298)

Dec 26, 2007, 9:09 AM
Post #17 of 21 (1692 views)
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Re: [Jim_Hooper] Z-Hills Flightline [In reply to] Can't Post

To all those who flew behind round engines:

A turbine is too simple minded, it has no mystery.
The air travels through it in a straight line and doesn't pick up any of the pungent fragrance of engine oil or pilot sweat.
Anybody can start a turbine. You just need to move a
switch from 'OFF' to 'START' and then remember to move it back to 'ON' after a while. My PC is harder to start.
Cranking a round engine requires skill, finesse and style.
You have to seduce it into starting. It's like waking up a horny mistress. On some planes, the pilots aren't even allowed to do it...
Turbines start by whining for a while, then give a lady-like poof and start whining a little louder.

Round engines give a satisfying rattle-rattle, click-click, BANG, more rattles, another BANG, a big macho FART or two, more clicks, a lot more smoke and finally a serious low pitched roar.
We like that. It's a GUY thing...

When you start a round engine, your mind is engaged
and you can concentrate on the flight ahead.
Starting a turbine is like flicking on a ceiling fan:
Useful, but, hardly exciting. When you have started his round engine successfully your crew chief looks up at you like he'd let you kiss his girl too!
Turbines don't break or catch fire often enough, leading to aircrew boredom, complacency and inattention.
A round engine at speed looks and sounds like it's going to blow any minute. This helps concentrate the mind !

Turbines don't have enough control levers or gauges to
keep a pilot's attention. There's nothing to fiddle with during long flights.

Turbines smell like a Boy Scout camp full of Coleman
Lamps.
Round engines smell like God intended machines to smell.


fastphil  (D 5801)

Dec 26, 2007, 11:53 AM
Post #18 of 21 (1658 views)
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Re: [zoobrothertom] Z-Hills Flightline [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Shocked Holy Shit!! 102 - 10 man teams registered!! That has got to be a record for any skydiving competition. Does anyone know of anything bigger?




"Holy Shit!!" is right, Tom. That was my first time to Z-Hills Turkeymeet; a nonstop 24 hour a day don't blink or you'll miss it parachute meet. Four teams on each plane and jump runs at about 30 second intervals for hours on end is what I remember. You could see 3 teams in freefall at once; one exiting, one at break off and one in between.

I was on the DC-3 that lost an engine right after take off. I was by the door and the pilot yelled to move forward, that he was going around and landing. I hadn't noticed a problem yet and looked out the door and decided it was too low to leave, then looked at the right side to see what I thought was a normal amount of smoke coming off the engine, then finally looked to the left side to see the prop not moving at all. I got moving forward then and we became one real friendly, tight bunch of skydivers...


flajumper  (D 9437)

Dec 26, 2007, 1:00 PM
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Re: [fastphil] Z-Hills Flightline [In reply to] Can't Post

Wow, talk about a small world. I've been lurking this board for about a year now, keeping mostly quiet, but this thread hits so close to home. I was on the same DC-3 that lost the engine on takeoff. I was with one of, as I recall, two of the 10 man teams from Palatka that year. I remember Harold's Lodestar, Kivi, Niki, and a bunch of other folks from that era as well. Lot's of good times.
I remember while turning downwind in the DC-3, one of my teamates (I think Gary Jenkins) looked out the window and said "I've always wanted to see what a feathered engine looks like, and now I hope I never do again".
Good to see some of you are still alive, kicking, and hopefully doing well.
Bob


itllclear  (D 6366)

Dec 29, 2007, 7:15 AM
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Re: [jonstark] Z-Hills Flightline [In reply to] Can't Post

That is great!

BSBD


Steephen

Dec 31, 2007, 1:52 PM
Post #21 of 21 (1402 views)
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Re: [Jim_Hooper] Z-Hills Flightline [In reply to] Can't Post

Hey Hoop,
Yeah anyone can start a modern sissy engine. One of my fav memories was watching you hand start an airplane, was it our Cessna 195 ?. We watched with fascination to see if you would be ground to a pulp. Damn those were the good old day. Sly

Stephen Menhennett
First jump 5-21-76
HONDA #3

my old log book has names like

Mark Janchek
Ernie King
Chuck Hendeson
Cheryl Morgan (hot1)
Jim Hooper
Bill Foster
Anibal
Frank Cater
Link Salvador
Stan Bussey
Ed Moore
Alfred Berg
Ski
Tom Phillips
Rick Hogan
Dave Hancock
Stickman
BJ Hall
Crusty
Paul Juet
Debbie Harding
Vic Herrick
Andes Sonolon
Chuck Leonard
Robert Powey
Robert C. Powers
Julie McBren
Peter Ness
Art Moorhead
Donna
Charlene Moore
John Conway
Pat Conway
Stephen Anderson
Chris Duggart
Kirt Johnson
Bernice Oberhaus
Lisa Olsen
WT Dykan
Dick Giarrusso
Roberta Klemmar
Peter Ness
Denise Varro
Guy Holdem



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