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High speed Mal

 

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skydivermom  (C 36927)

Oct 16, 2007, 9:01 AM
Post #1 of 71 (2132 views)
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High speed Mal Can't Post

I had my first high speed malfunction this weekend...at my first out of state boogie. Pretty scary. It was a combination hard pull....possible pilot chute hesitation.

I had been pulling higher than normal (4-4500) all weekend, and I'm very glad of that. On this jump, I began deployment around 4500 or so. I had my hand on the pilot chute handle, but it would not come out. I took my hand off of it to regain some stability, and went for it again. At that point it was still in the pouch, so I tried again. When nothing happened, I went straight for the reserve, because I was going so fast. I had the handle out of the velcro when my main inflated. Obviously, I did get it out the second time but it may have been stuck behind my back (So if I had looked over my shoulder I would have seen it).

Anyway, once I got back to the packing area, a very nice guy offered to pack for me because I was shaking so badly, and he found that there was a ring missing from the pulot chute mechanism....so when I got it out on the second attempt, it wasn't cocked. Someone replaced the ring for me, and I did jump again at sunset with no problem.

Anyway, we are going to check my gear out completely at my home dropzone and I'll probably have more info. after that. One of the things I know I should have done was look over my shoulder after my second attempt. And I wonder if going for my reserve is what got the air behind me to extract the main, because I had both hands on my reserve handle. I remember being taught to drop a shoulder if there is a pilot chute hesitation.

Since there is a pending gear analysis, maybe some of you can give me suggestions on what to look for. I was pretty shaken up.Crazy


airtwardo  (D License)

Oct 16, 2007, 9:20 AM
Post #2 of 71 (2105 views)
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Re: [skydivermom] High speed Mal [In reply to] Can't Post

Lets see~

New dropzone so you pulled high: Good

Tried twice then went for silver: Good

Got the gear fixed and went up again: Great



Yup....you're a SKYDIVER! Cool


UDSkyJunkie  (D 25746)

Oct 16, 2007, 9:23 AM
Post #3 of 71 (2101 views)
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Re: [skydivermom] High speed Mal [In reply to] Can't Post

A better idea would be for you to watch the rigger who does your gear inspection, and ask him what he's looking for, and what you should be checking for periodically, as well as what you should be double-checking whenever you have maintenance done that requires disassembly.


skydivermom  (C 36927)

Oct 16, 2007, 9:26 AM
Post #4 of 71 (2096 views)
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Re: [UDSkyJunkie] High speed Mal [In reply to] Can't Post

That is great advice. I know I'll definately be checking the ring on a regular basis for sure.


skydivermom  (C 36927)

Oct 16, 2007, 9:27 AM
Post #5 of 71 (2094 views)
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Re: [airtwardo] High speed Mal [In reply to] Can't Post

Thanks 'Twardo. It did take everything I had to go back up and jump again, but I'm glad I did.


Royd  (B 30968)

Oct 16, 2007, 11:25 AM
Post #6 of 71 (1994 views)
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Re: [skydivermom] High speed Mal [In reply to] Can't Post

I had a similar situation this weekend. I threw out and felt nothing for about 1 1/2 seconds. Long enough to say," What the f--- is this." Then I had a canopy, but I was already on the handles.


bch7773  (C License)

Oct 16, 2007, 11:56 AM
Post #7 of 71 (1968 views)
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Re: [skydivermom] High speed Mal [In reply to] Can't Post

a hesitation is now considered a malfunction?


labrys  (D 29848)

Oct 16, 2007, 12:01 PM
Post #8 of 71 (1962 views)
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Re: [bch7773] High speed Mal [In reply to] Can't Post

Quote:
a hesitation is now considered a malfunction?

Ummmm... kind of depends on how long the "hesitation" is and what caused it, I would think. The OP posted about something that sounds like a PCIT that cleared on it's own. That sure sounds like a mal to me. It doesn't sound like the standard "PC in burble" kind of hesitation.


raymond_jones  (D License)

Oct 16, 2007, 12:21 PM
Post #9 of 71 (1947 views)
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Re: [skydivermom] High speed Mal [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
I had my first high speed malfunction this weekend...at my first out of state boogie. Pretty scary. It was a combination hard pull....possible pilot chute hesitation.

I had been pulling higher than normal (4-4500) all weekend, and I'm very glad of that. On this jump, I began deployment around 4500 or so. I had my hand on the pilot chute handle, but it would not come out. I took my hand off of it to regain some stability, and went for it again. At that point it was still in the pouch, so I tried again. When nothing happened, I went straight for the reserve, because I was going so fast. I had the handle out of the velcro when my main inflated. Obviously, I did get it out the second time but it may have been stuck behind my back (So if I had looked over my shoulder I would have seen it).

Anyway, once I got back to the packing area, a very nice guy offered to pack for me because I was shaking so badly, and he found that there was a ring missing from the pulot chute mechanism....so when I got it out on the second attempt, it wasn't cocked. Someone replaced the ring for me, and I did jump again at sunset with no problem.

Anyway, we are going to check my gear out completely at my home dropzone and I'll probably have more info. after that. One of the things I know I should have done was look over my shoulder after my second attempt. And I wonder if going for my reserve is what got the air behind me to extract the main, because I had both hands on my reserve handle. I remember being taught to drop a shoulder if there is a pilot chute hesitation.

Since there is a pending gear analysis, maybe some of you can give me suggestions on what to look for. I was pretty shaken up.Crazy

do you pack your own gear?
- if so do you not inspect it ie. make sure your pilot chute is cocked? if it wasn't cocked in the air theres a good chance it wasn't cocked on the ground.
also maybe you would have notice the missing ring or inquire why it wouldn't cock or stay cocked.
did you think about going through all of your emergency procedures?
- according to your post you had the reserve handle out of the velcro and about to pull it when your main started to inflate. if there was a half second more delay, it is quite possible of having a simaltanious deployment maybe causing a main and reserve intanglement.

id get some remedial classes on packing and gear inspection and emergency procedures when you get back.


(This post was edited by raymond_jones on Oct 16, 2007, 12:25 PM)


skydivermom  (C 36927)

Oct 16, 2007, 2:31 PM
Post #10 of 71 (1889 views)
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Re: [raymond_jones] High speed Mal [In reply to] Can't Post

First off, the pilot chute was absolutely cocked when I packed it, so the ring must have come off inside the plane or on deployment. I always check the pilot chute twice before completing the pack job.

As I stated in the original post, I should have looked over my shoulder, and I also stated that I was very concerned about having two outs. We are definately going over the gear thoroughly next time I'm at my home dz.

So in answer to your question, I absolutely make sure the pilot chute is cocked before I jump it. So I can guarantee the ring was in tact when I packed it. What I believe I need is some more detailed instructions on gear maintenance.

But it certainly couldn't hurt to get some additional packing instructions. There's always room for improvement there.

P.S. No, I had the reserve handle out of the velcro when my main FULLY inflated. I would have pulled the reserve completely out had the main only started to inflate.


(This post was edited by skydivermom on Oct 16, 2007, 2:33 PM)


airtwardo  (D License)

Oct 16, 2007, 2:46 PM
Post #11 of 71 (1881 views)
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Re: [skydivermom] High speed Mal [In reply to] Can't Post

P.S. No, I had the reserve handle out of the velcro when my main FULLY inflated. I would have pulled the reserve completely out had the main only started to inflate.

In reply to:

Ten you would have had at BEST two out...And that would have REALLY been scary! Shocked


ZigZagMarquis  (D License)

Oct 16, 2007, 2:59 PM
Post #12 of 71 (1869 views)
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Re: [airtwardo] High speed Mal [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Lets see~



Tried twice then went for silver: Good



If you don't take your hand away and put it back, its not two tries!

Tongue

JUST KIDDING!!!!!
Laugh


skydivermom  (C 36927)

Oct 16, 2007, 3:04 PM
Post #13 of 71 (1863 views)
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Re: [airtwardo] High speed Mal [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
P.S. No, I had the reserve handle out of the velcro when my main FULLY inflated. I would have pulled the reserve completely out had the main only started to inflate.

In reply to:

Ten you would have had at BEST two out...And that would have REALLY been scary! Shocked


EXACTLY!! I think that's the main reason why I was so shook up after landing. I was chastising myself (I still am) for not looking over my shoulder before going for silver. It's actually what could have happened that has me more scared than anything. I saw the reserve handle dangling after the main inflated, and was worried all the way down that the reserve would come out. Definatley frightening.


ZigZagMarquis  (D License)

Oct 16, 2007, 3:04 PM
Post #14 of 71 (1863 views)
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Re: [skydivermom] High speed Mal [In reply to] Can't Post

... anyway

Quote:
...and he found that there was a ring missing from the pulot chute mechanism....so when I got it out on the second attempt, it wasn't cocked. Someone replaced the ring for me, and I did jump again at sunset with no problem...

Sounds like you lost the speed link (french link) that goes on the inside of the bag, without which, you're correct, your pilot chute won't stay cocked. I've found the one on my rigs loose from time to time. I make it a habbit to check it... should probalby check it every pack-job, but in reality, I probably do it once a weekend... its a good excuse to lay on your canopy and rest while fidlin' with your D-bag, birdle, pilot cute, etc. while packing at the end of the day.


Quote:
Since there is a pending gear analysis, maybe some of you can give me suggestions on what to look for.

If you haven't yet... have a rigger or experienced skydiver you trust and who knows how to... show you how to removed and reinstall your D-Bag, Kill-Line Pilot Chute, birdle assembly on your your main sometime when y'all hae it un-packed.


I know the BSRs and some others opinions differ... so take this for what its worth, just one man's opinion... but my "plan" is "I know" my main pilot chute is out, but nothing after that is happening, I'm pulling the cut-away and then the reserve, to avoid the afore mentioned 2-out situation. If I am sure my pilot chute is not out of its pocket yet (i.e. I haven't tried to deploy it) and I opt for Silver, then and only then would I go straight Silver and not cut-away first. Again... just MY plan.


(This post was edited by ZigZagMarquis on Oct 16, 2007, 3:11 PM)


skydivermom  (C 36927)

Oct 16, 2007, 3:08 PM
Post #15 of 71 (1860 views)
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Re: [airtwardo] High speed Mal [In reply to] Can't Post

I think I can see why you are worried. I didn't state that clearly. What I meant was that if the main had only begun it's deployment when I grabbed my reserve handle, I would have pulled it all the way. It seems as though the main had already begun deployment BEFORE I grabbed the handle. I'm glad I didn't end up with a two out.


skydivermom  (C 36927)

Oct 16, 2007, 3:10 PM
Post #16 of 71 (1856 views)
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Re: [ZigZagMarquis] High speed Mal [In reply to] Can't Post

Okay, I'm glad to have a name for it now, thanks. I am disappointed in myself for not becoming more familiar with my gear. I just got a new container last July. I didn't have a callapsable pilot chute before that. And I'm certainly going to be better at knowing my gear from now on.


ZigZagMarquis  (D License)

Oct 16, 2007, 3:15 PM
Post #17 of 71 (1849 views)
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Re: [skydivermom] High speed Mal [In reply to] Can't Post

Quote:
And I wonder if going for my reserve is what got the air behind me to extract the main, because I had both hands on my reserve handle.

Possibly. I'm more of a one hand per handle kinda guy.

Quote:
I remember being taught to drop a shoulder if there is a pilot chute hesitation.

That will work. I was taught something similar / look over your shoulder. However, with some of the newer / higher performance canopies, looking over your shoulder on deployment can cause asymetric line stretch which can cause some real interesting openings... but it beats hitting the ground with nothing out. Crazy


(This post was edited by ZigZagMarquis on Oct 16, 2007, 3:18 PM)


ZigZagMarquis  (D License)

Oct 16, 2007, 3:17 PM
Post #18 of 71 (1844 views)
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Re: [skydivermom] High speed Mal [In reply to] Can't Post

Last, but not least...


Quote:
I had my first high speed malfunction this weekend...at my first out of state boogie.


That's 2 Cases of Beer!!!!


skydivermom  (C 36927)

Oct 16, 2007, 3:18 PM
Post #19 of 71 (1841 views)
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Re: [Royd] High speed Mal [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
I had a similar situation this weekend. I threw out and felt nothing for about 1 1/2 seconds. Long enough to say," What the f--- is this." Then I had a canopy, but I was already on the handles.

So I guess you had a hesitation. How did you fix it, or did it just fix itself?


skydivermom  (C 36927)

Oct 16, 2007, 3:20 PM
Post #20 of 71 (1838 views)
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Re: [ZigZagMarquis] High speed Mal [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Last, but not least...


Quote:
I had my first high speed malfunction this weekend...at my first out of state boogie.


That's 2 Cases of Beer!!!!

Oh, come on. That's not fair!MadSmile


ZigZagMarquis  (D License)

Oct 16, 2007, 3:23 PM
Post #21 of 71 (1835 views)
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Re: [skydivermom] High speed Mal [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:
I had a similar situation this weekend. I threw out and felt nothing for about 1 1/2 seconds. Long enough to say," What the f--- is this." Then I had a canopy, but I was already on the handles.

So I guess you had a hesitation. How did you fix it, or did it just fix itself?


Well, ya can look over your shoulder to break the burble and deal with the asymetric line stretch as the pilot chute takes off. However, the "better plan" is to always positvely throw your pilot chute... a lazy throw can result in a pilot chute hesitation... I've had pilot chutes flop in my burble, smack me in the back of the head and then take off... that will wake you up! Shocked


(This post was edited by ZigZagMarquis on Oct 16, 2007, 3:25 PM)


ZigZagMarquis  (D License)

Oct 16, 2007, 3:24 PM
Post #22 of 71 (1833 views)
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Re: [skydivermom] High speed Mal [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:
Last, but not least...


Quote:
I had my first high speed malfunction this weekend...at my first out of state boogie.


That's 2 Cases of Beer!!!!

Oh, come on. That's not fair!MadSmile


Ummm... since when does "fair" enter into Beer Rules?

Laugh


skydivermom  (C 36927)

Oct 16, 2007, 3:30 PM
Post #23 of 71 (1827 views)
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Re: [ZigZagMarquis] High speed Mal [In reply to] Can't Post

Yeah, I guess that was the wrong thing for me to say to a group of skydivers.Unsure I owe more than beer. Everyone there was so good to me. I think I'll be sending a lot of goodies the way of Skydive Elsinore in the very near future.


quadit  (C 37339)

Oct 16, 2007, 5:26 PM
Post #24 of 71 (1774 views)
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Re: [skydivermom] High speed Mal [In reply to] Can't Post

 racer's have a bad pilot chute hesitation if you don't use the velcro by the pin i had several bad hesitations until i was told what it was for - most of the other containers have velcro on the container that the bridle runs over and sticks to but most racer containers you have to pinch the bridle together very important with this design on the racer - ask your rigger about it


skydivermom  (C 36927)

Oct 16, 2007, 5:36 PM
Post #25 of 71 (1770 views)
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Re: [quadit] High speed Mal [In reply to] Can't Post

That's interesting. I'll keep an eye out in the future. I know now that my pilot chute was not cocked and that's why it wasn't doing the job like it usually does. I think I have velcro on this particular container.

Thanks again.


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