Forums: Skydiving: Safety and Training:
EP's

 

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adventurechick  (C 35899)

Jul 6, 2006, 2:16 PM
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EP's Can't Post

So I was always taught, pull main. Peel and punch cutaway and peel and punch reserve.

Someone needs to add to this ARRCCHH after pulling the reserve (and cutaway if one doesn't have an RSL).

I found out a few years ago that a guy doing his AFF had a malfunction, cutaway and pulled the reserve. When he pulled the reserve, he leaned forward and flipped through the risers and was tangled and died.


kelel01  (A License)

Jul 6, 2006, 2:22 PM
Post #2 of 30 (1565 views)
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Re: [adventurechick] EP's [In reply to] Can't Post

My EP's as taught are "Arch look grab look peel pull pull".

So it already starts with arch. Wink But I agree, it's pretty important.


Zoter

Jul 6, 2006, 2:27 PM
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Re: [kelel01] EP's [In reply to] Can't Post

Do you practise that in a harness......its quite hard to arch AND look at your handles.....
Look , Locate (1 hand on each) ,Peel/Punch red (to Full arm extension),Peel/punch silver , Arch......


AFFI  (D 25538)

Jul 6, 2006, 2:50 PM
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Re: [Zoter] EP's [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Do you practise that in a harness......its quite hard to arch AND look at your handles.....
Look , Locate (1 hand on each) ,Peel/Punch red (to Full arm extension),Peel/punch silver , Arch......

Dont think of arching perse - We are usually vertical when dealing with this stuff and you are right, it can be difficult -

Rather than busting out a hard arch, simply push your hips forward. When the reserve handle is being pushed then go into the "hard arch".


AFFI  (D 25538)

Jul 6, 2006, 2:54 PM
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Re: [adventurechick] EP's [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Peel and punch cutaway and peel and punch reserve.

Ther reason we peel the cutaway pillow is because the velcro can sometimes be difficult to extract without "peeling" as one side of the velcro is mounted to the cutaway pillow. When using a metal reserve handle there is no need to peel as there is no velcro attached to the metal reserve handle. Just push the reserve handle and the metal will go right through the velcro.

At least I think I said this right.


AFFI  (D 25538)

Jul 6, 2006, 2:55 PM
Post #6 of 30 (1529 views)
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Re: [adventurechick] EP's [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
(and cutaway if one doesn't have an RSL).

I do not understand this statement, please clarify.


Andy9o8  (D License)

Jul 6, 2006, 2:56 PM
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Re: [adventurechick] EP's [In reply to] Can't Post

When I returned to the sport a couple years ago and made the transition to modern gear, my instructors taught me to pull my feet back toward my butt at the start of EP's (to help re-establish an arch); and after punching silver, arch.


stratostar  (Student)

Jul 6, 2006, 3:16 PM
Post #8 of 30 (1514 views)
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Re: [Zoter] EP's [In reply to] Can't Post

How about, look at cutaway, place BOTH hands on it, look at silver handle,peel & pull cutway handle to arms extension and throw it away, (eyes never leave silver) reach and pull with both hands, throw away and ARCH.

Never know when you might have a hard pull on both, two handed pull is better, IMHO.

~


psipike02  (B 29211)

Jul 6, 2006, 5:17 PM
Post #9 of 30 (1453 views)
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Re: [stratostar] EP's [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
How about, look at cutaway, place BOTH hands on it, look at silver handle,peel & pull cutway handle to arms extension and throw it away, (eyes never leave silver) reach and pull with both hands, throw away and ARCH.

Never know when you might have a hard pull on both, two handed pull is better, IMHO.

~

Yep...thats how I was taught....


stratostar  (Student)

Jul 6, 2006, 5:35 PM
Post #10 of 30 (1445 views)
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Re: [psipike02] EP's [In reply to] Can't Post

sounds like you had a good teacher and old school too. I still teach this way of doing EP's.

One other thing to think of would be the large amount of jumpers who have never had a cutaway and are jumping some hot canopies today, that can in them selfs can cause a hard pull just from spinning mal's. or spinning mal's with line twists as well.

A hard pull could be "hard" just trying to get your hands to the handles to pull them....not the force needed to pull them or it could be both.
Just something to think about ya all.

~


tbrown  (D 6533)

Jul 6, 2006, 7:02 PM
Post #11 of 30 (1416 views)
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Re: [Andy9o8] EP's [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
When I returned to the sport a couple years ago and made the transition to modern gear, my instructors taught me to pull my feet back toward my butt at the start of EP's (to help re-establish an arch); and after punching silver, arch.

On my recurrency training after a 22 year break, my instructor politely told me to "stick my dick out" and point my toes.


mjosparky  (D 5476)

Jul 7, 2006, 1:02 AM
Post #12 of 30 (1343 views)
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Re: [adventurechick] EP's [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
(and cutaway if one doesn't have an RSL).

Lets pretend that you never even thought this much less posted it. Forget the fact that you even have an RSL. Do your EPs like you are all alone without help from anyone or anything.


kevinwhelan  (A 443)

Jul 7, 2006, 3:05 AM
Post #13 of 30 (1327 views)
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Re: [adventurechick] EP's [In reply to] Can't Post

Quote:
(and cutaway if one doesn't have an RSL).

I hope you are not mistaking about the function of an rsl. This statement makes me think that you believe that the rsl will perform a cutaway for you if you pull the reserve.
Please tell me this is not what you think.


dragon2  (D 101989)

Jul 7, 2006, 3:10 AM
Post #14 of 30 (1323 views)
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Re: [kevinwhelan] EP's [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Quote:
(and cutaway if one doesn't have an RSL).

I hope you are not mistaking about the function of an rsl. This statement makes me think that you believe that the rsl will perform a cutaway for you if you pull the reserve.
Please tell me this is not what you think.

I'm thinking she means 'arch after pulling reserve', and 'if you have an rsl, arch after performing your cutaway' because the reserve will be out before you pulled the reserve yourself thus your arch would be late Wink


(This post was edited by dragon2 on Jul 7, 2006, 6:46 AM)


adventurechick  (C 35899)

Jul 7, 2006, 5:56 AM
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Re: [dragon2] EP's [In reply to] Can't Post

exactly, that's what I meant


kevinwhelan  (A 443)

Jul 7, 2006, 6:44 AM
Post #16 of 30 (1273 views)
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Re: [dragon2] EP's [In reply to] Can't Post

Sorry my mistake
So
(and cutaway if one doesn't have an RSL).
should read
(and cutaway if one has an RSL).


Zoter

Jul 7, 2006, 6:56 AM
Post #17 of 30 (1266 views)
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Re: [stratostar] EP's [In reply to] Can't Post

Quote:
How about, look at cutaway, place BOTH hands on it, look at silver handle,peel & pull cutway handle to arms extension and throw it away, (eyes never leave silver) reach and pull with both hands, throw away and ARCH.

Never know when you might have a hard pull on both, two handed pull is better, IMHO.

Two hands is my 'alternate' plan in the case of a hard cutaway....ie bring left hand over to cutaway pillow whilst looking at reserve handle.
Logic behind a hand on each is in case the harness shifts with the cutaway so the reserve handle position changes.
I have observed a change in the position of the reserve handle on at least a few of cutaways ( mainly malfunctioning mains.....not PC in tows )that I have seen on video....not massive movements but movement all the same...

I have not had a 'live'reserve pull yet....but I maintain my gear and practise my EP's regularly in a hanging harness.
I'm comfortable with my EP procedure, which I think works the best for me.


bch7773  (C License)

Jul 7, 2006, 7:04 AM
Post #18 of 30 (1263 views)
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Re: [adventurechick] EP's [In reply to] Can't Post

if you have an RSL, pretend that you don't. You should do your EPs the exact same way regardless of an RSL.

RSL's have failed to pull the reserve in the past. Never rely on it.


adventurechick  (C 35899)

Jul 7, 2006, 10:51 AM
Post #19 of 30 (1201 views)
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Re: [bch7773] EP's [In reply to] Can't Post

I don't have an RSL... so I don't have to pretend!


AFFI  (D 25538)

Jul 7, 2006, 11:04 AM
Post #20 of 30 (1197 views)
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Re: [adventurechick] EP's [In reply to] Can't Post

2006 SIM Section 5 Page 109 states:

An RSL is recommended for all experienced jumpers.


jumpinfool  (D License)

Jul 7, 2006, 2:49 PM
Post #21 of 30 (1156 views)
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Re: [AFFI] EP's [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
2006 SIM Section 5 Page 109 states:

An RSL is recommended for all experienced jumpers.

So what does USPA say about very low experience jumpers? Wink


ZigZagMarquis  (D License)

Jul 7, 2006, 2:57 PM
Post #22 of 30 (1152 views)
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Re: [adventurechick] EP's [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
I don't have an RSL... so I don't have to pretend!

Good! We don't like girls that "fake-it"... Tongue


AFFI  (D 25538)

Jul 7, 2006, 3:03 PM
Post #23 of 30 (1148 views)
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Re: [jumpinfool] EP's [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:
2006 SIM Section 5 Page 109 states:

An RSL is recommended for all experienced jumpers.

So what does USPA say about very low experience jumpers? Wink

Right?

Guess they are excluded...


ZigZagMarquis  (D License)

Jul 7, 2006, 3:10 PM
Post #24 of 30 (1146 views)
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Re: [AFFI] EP's [In reply to] Can't Post

Frown

DANG! ... and I thought I had successfully deflected the theard away from another DZ.com RSL debate / blood bath...

Frown


fcajump  (D 15598)

Jul 11, 2006, 1:29 PM
Post #25 of 30 (1048 views)
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Re: [AFFI] EP's [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:
In reply to:
2006 SIM Section 5 Page 109 states:

An RSL is recommended for all experienced jumpers.

So what does USPA say about very low experience jumpers? Wink

Very Low Experience jumpers would fall under a section called "students".

See everything is a matter of perspective and where you place the emphisas. Wink

Jim


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