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A learning post

 


Satan666  (D License)

Sep 6, 2002, 8:37 AM
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A learning post Can't Post

ShockedAttched are 3 photos from a near miss. You can analyse and all can make recommendations . The story goes...

After a successful 9 way tube jump the camera guy filmed the deployment of the guy carrying the tube.
The other person watched turned then tracked. He barrelled 180 clear skies(as his footage shows) tehn 180 still on heading just before deployment, then as the photos show had a near miss from the person wo filmed the tube opening.
Who's at fault? I say both
Low person has right of way but should have tracked more.
Person above should have seen this and tracked away from low person.
Lesson: give a good track at the end of your dive, double check with barrel rolls before deployment espcially when doing large group jumps.

Shocked
Attachments: Arch.JPG (57.5 KB)
  Throw.JPG (57.3 KB)
  Reach.JPG (52.6 KB)
  The tube jump.JPG (51.9 KB)


steve1  (D 23640)

Sep 6, 2002, 8:52 AM
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Re: [Satan666] A learning post [In reply to] Can't Post

I was on a load recently where there was also a near collision. We broke off a formation and one guy was tracking directly over the top of another jumper. It sounds like the bottom guy didn't wave off much and tried to open. The top jumper went through the side of the deploying canopy and brushed against the bottom guy. Both were very sore and quit jumping for the day. Since then I have made it a point not to jump with either of these guys. They're both lucky to be alive and I don't want to be taken out by either one of them in future jumps. Steve1


happythoughts  (D License)

Sep 6, 2002, 9:14 AM
Post #3 of 17 (1589 views)
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At WFFC 2001, I planned an alligator dive. The plan: At 4000, everyone tracks and the person on the inflatable rolls over, let's it go, falls to 2500 and dumps. This dufus thought he would hold onto the inflatable. The girl rolls off, falls to 2500, dumps, and misses him by 30ft.Mad The "I do what I want" attitude and no apology didn't make him popular. People like that are dangerous to the point of fatal.


Premier cpoxon  (D 11665)
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Sep 6, 2002, 10:23 AM
Post #4 of 17 (1558 views)
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Re: [Satan666] A learning post [In reply to] Can't Post

Did the unusual head-wear contribute in any way? Mine was more than I bargained for...


Samurai136  (D 26609)

Sep 6, 2002, 12:46 PM
Post #5 of 17 (1505 views)
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Perhaps a bit extreme, but WTF.

Camera should do 5 tracking dives. Lower jumper, in purple, should do 10 tracking dives. Or whatever it takes to remember/ learn how to track like he's wearing a birdman suit.

Ken


barry

Sep 6, 2002, 5:13 PM
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Re: [happythoughts] A learning post [In reply to] Can't Post

The usual...

Plan your dive..... Dive your plan...


freeflir29  (D 10000000)

Sep 6, 2002, 5:37 PM
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Re: [Satan666] A learning post [In reply to] Can't Post

That was AT LEAST a 9 way tube jump. That's a VERY busy skydive and should only be done with people that know what they are doing. Everyone needs to stay in tight and keep level. NO TWO WAYS DURING THE DIVE. It doesn't sound like any of these were factors in this incident but always worth saying. The guy on the bottom should have gotten the hell out of the way. I make it a point when I am filming someones deployment to brief, brief, and rebrief what happens around this time. Mainly the fact that I will be VERY busy filming the deployment and ZOOMING all over the sky because of the differen't body positions I like to use. Basically...I tell everyone to TRACK AWAY because I usually turn head down and then carve underneath the deploying canopy. All my attention is on "Getting the shot" until I roll back over and think about deploying. If people are below me I won't see them until it is likely all too late.


tigra  (C 27417)

Sep 6, 2002, 5:37 PM
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(This post was edited by tigra on Sep 6, 2002, 5:45 PM)


freeflir29  (D 10000000)

Sep 6, 2002, 5:45 PM
Post #9 of 17 (1423 views)
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Quote:
Maybe instead of filming the deployment, he should have gotten out of the way???


Deployment video is really cool and there certainly isn't a problem with someone filming it as long as it is briefed that the camera man has the center of the dive from break off to the ground. Wink


tigra  (C 27417)

Sep 6, 2002, 5:59 PM
Post #10 of 17 (1413 views)
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Re: [freeflir29] A learning post [In reply to] Can't Post

But was he intentionally videoing THIS deployment? And if he was, should he have been right on top of it, closing the distance? Sorry if that sounds like a dumb question.


freeflir29  (D 10000000)

Sep 6, 2002, 6:09 PM
Post #11 of 17 (1411 views)
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Quote:
But was he intentionally videoing THIS deployment?


No No...he was filming the deployment of the jumper with the tube. This happened shortly after with a jumper that IMHO shouldn't have been there.


tigra  (C 27417)

Sep 6, 2002, 6:39 PM
Post #12 of 17 (1400 views)
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Re: [freeflir29] A learning post [In reply to] Can't Post

I'm sure you are right about that, the low man should not have been there. And I'm sure it caught the cameraman by complete surprise, and it all happened very fast. Unfortunately, I've been in a similar situation and those pics brought back some bad memories. (Like these 2, we were also very lucky.)

maura


drenaline  (C License)

Sep 6, 2002, 6:43 PM
Post #13 of 17 (1398 views)
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maybe the low man made a bad track and performed a delta for a long time thinking it was a track. Happened to me until a camera man told me that I should dearch instead of arching (I had no idea until I saw the video and saw myself going down instead of forward)


Premier PhreeZone  (D License)
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Sep 6, 2002, 6:44 PM
Post #14 of 17 (1396 views)
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Re: [freeflir29] A learning post [In reply to] Can't Post

If both tacked from their respective breaks,(one at belly out and one at tube pull) either jumper A (filming tube pulling) can track like a rocket, or Jumper B (Lower jumper) tracks like a rock.

The way I'm reading it is one person was up close for the tube deploy and jumper B just kinda hung out there watching then took off trakcing. Jumper A filpped over from filming and took off tracking, it just happened to be the same way. If thats the case Jumper B needs smacked for not getting the hell out of there at break. Also it was implied that jumper B did a roll to check for people, but yet Jumper A managed to be there. If thats the case, then the whole rapid rolling over thing to look up is pretty much useless. I've seen it on video and its such a rapid roll that unless the person above would be within about 15-25 feet it would be way to easy to miss them.

One thing to possibly do on filing delployments its to film them, track for a short peroid then pull. This will give horiontial sep in case of a cutaway, but then you don't have to worry about tracking to the out side people. I've done this method a few times while doing multi camera RW bigway's. I'll film low someone else high. At break upper jumper pulls in the center, I fly to the now empty center take a delay, track for a count of 2 then pull. Anyone see anything wrong with this theory?


Premier PhreeZone  (D License)
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Sep 6, 2002, 6:46 PM
Post #15 of 17 (1393 views)
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Re: [drenaline] A learning post [In reply to] Can't Post

If your getting invited on 10 way vertical dives you sould'nt have any issues with tracking. Your skill level should be way more then enough to do a fast, flat track.


Groumph

Sep 10, 2002, 12:06 AM
Post #16 of 17 (1266 views)
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Re: [drenaline] A learning post [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
maybe the low man made a bad track and performed a delta for a long time thinking it was a track

You don't go on a 9 way if you ain't sure you're track is alright.
That's suicide man !


3fLiEr

Sep 11, 2002, 5:38 AM
Post #17 of 17 (1163 views)
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Re: [Satan666] A learning post [In reply to] Can't Post

but great visuals though!!!! SlySlySlyWinkWinkWinkSlySlySly



Cya

Michael



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