Forums: Skydiving Disciplines: Swooping and Canopy Control:
Crossfire 2 or Katana?

 

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tetra316  (D 26945)

Oct 14, 2005, 11:29 AM
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Crossfire 2 or Katana? Can't Post

I've been reading as many posts as I can find comparing the two and they are pretty much evenly divided. My take from reading these is that the canopies are very similar but the Katana dives more aggressively and the crossfire has a better glide. Or at least that's what most people are saying, correct me if I'm misinterpeting this. I've put about 8 jumps on a Katana but haven't yet jumped the crossfire 2, planning on getting a demo if I can't find one to borrow. So what canopy would you recommend with the goal of swooping being the main reason for buying?


Edited cuz I'm typing to fast


(This post was edited by tetra316 on Oct 14, 2005, 11:31 AM)


sdctlc  (D 16437)

Oct 14, 2005, 2:29 PM
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Re: [tetra316] Crossfire 2 or Katana? [In reply to] Can't Post

Dont forget to look at the Samurai.. Another very good canopy in teh class that competes very well with the other two noted.... Try and get a demo of that as well.

Scott C.


cheneyneel  (D 26207)

Oct 14, 2005, 3:26 PM
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Re: [tetra316] Crossfire 2 or Katana? [In reply to] Can't Post

man i have a number of jumps on both... I could not decide between two without 3 or 4 hundred jumps on them,thats how well both fly. I love both canopies..


which ever one you can get the best deal on used would be the one you want to buy... let fate be the choosing factor...you will get an ass load of perforemance out of both..


(This post was edited by cheneyneel on Oct 14, 2005, 3:28 PM)


Widgeon  (D License)

Oct 14, 2005, 3:36 PM
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Re: [tetra316] Crossfire 2 or Katana? [In reply to] Can't Post

What size/wingloading are you planning on?


tetra316  (D 26945)

Oct 14, 2005, 3:38 PM
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Re: [Widgeon] Crossfire 2 or Katana? [In reply to] Can't Post

119/120 at a 1.4 wingloading.


Spizzzarko

Oct 14, 2005, 3:57 PM
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Re: [tetra316] Crossfire 2 or Katana? [In reply to] Can't Post

Katana


tetra316  (D 26945)

Oct 14, 2005, 5:44 PM
Post #7 of 32 (5192 views)
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Re: [Spizzzarko] Crossfire 2 or Katana? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Katana

Why do you say Katana?


CanuckInUSA  (D 26396)

Oct 14, 2005, 9:16 PM
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Re: [tetra316] Crossfire 2 or Katana? [In reply to] Can't Post

I've never jumped a Katana and I've got about 400 jumps on a Crossfire2. I was really happy with the Crossfire2, but it's my understanding that the Katana will dive more. So depending upon where you want to take your canopy flying (do you want to jump a cross-braced canopy in the future), the Katana may be the better option as it's newer technology. But if a good deal exists on a Crossfire2, don't ignore it. It is a great canopy to jump.


(This post was edited by CanuckInUSA on Oct 14, 2005, 9:16 PM)


Vectracide  (D License)

Oct 14, 2005, 11:55 PM
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Re: [tetra316] Crossfire 2 or Katana? [In reply to] Can't Post

My Xfire2 119 is for sale so I can buy a Katana 107. Interested?Laugh


piisfish

Oct 15, 2005, 7:12 AM
Post #10 of 32 (5105 views)
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Re: [tetra316] Crossfire 2 or Katana? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
119/120 at a 1.4 wingloading.
my question is :
is there a real "use" in getting such canopies at the "low wingloading end" recommended on them ?? Why not get a slightly similar WL on a "less radical" canopy which will get you to a "higher relative loading" compared to what the canopy can handle ?? Thinking Sabre2, Safire2 etc...


tetra316  (D 26945)

Oct 15, 2005, 9:22 AM
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Re: [piisfish] Crossfire 2 or Katana? [In reply to] Can't Post

Because I have a sabre2 now that I've put about 600 jumps on and I'm bored. I've put several jumps on a sabre2 120 and it really doesn't feel that much different to me. That's why I want to go elliptical. And it's not like I need optimal performance with a higher wingloading anyway. I'm certainly not competing in anything.


piisfish

Oct 15, 2005, 9:41 AM
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Re: [tetra316] Crossfire 2 or Katana? [In reply to] Can't Post

how bored ??
what's the need of elliptical ??
what do you do under your Sabre2 ? What are you going to do under an elliptical ?? How will it help you be less bored ??
I'm definitely not bored with my Safire2 139 (loaded 1.48 approx) and am far from being bored with my Crossfire2 119.
another nice elliptical is the Nitro/Nitron


tetra316  (D 26945)

Oct 15, 2005, 10:10 AM
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Re: [piisfish] Crossfire 2 or Katana? [In reply to] Can't Post

I'm bored because it feels slower and slower to me. Even doing 90 and 180 in little wind. My goal is swooping and even if I'm not I would like a little faster of a canopy. Landing straight in in windy conditions sometimes I don't have any forward penetration. Keep in mind my wl now is about 1.1. I want and elliptical because of responsiveness and more speed. 1.4 at 900 jumps is actually a lot less than all the wingloading charts out there recommend for progression. Not that you have to follow that but just to compare.


CanuckInUSA  (D 26396)

Oct 15, 2005, 11:28 AM
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Re: [tetra316] Crossfire 2 or Katana? [In reply to] Can't Post

It may not be the optimal wingloading for an xfire2, but there's nothing wrong with loading it a 1.4:1 ... the canopy is still going to be fun and fast. I'm no expert, but my first xFire2 a 139 was loaded at about 1.4:1 and I had a lot of fun and success with it.


thepollster  (D 12122)

Oct 15, 2005, 1:24 PM
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Re: [tetra316] Crossfire 2 or Katana? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
I want and elliptical because of responsiveness and more speed.

The fact that the canopy is elliptical won't give it more speed, the speed will come from the smaller size. Just the smaller size alone will add to responsiveness.

Any canopy can become boring as you get acclimated to the speed. I've been bored loaded 1.8:1, until I started to challenge myself with what I had (downwinders, PRO-rating, etc.)


CanuckInUSA  (D 26396)

Oct 15, 2005, 5:36 PM
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Re: [thepollster] Crossfire 2 or Katana? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
the speed will come from the smaller size

as well as your technique for inducing extra speed. Of course make sure you practice up high before you bring it low to the ground.


(This post was edited by CanuckInUSA on Oct 15, 2005, 5:36 PM)


dploi

Oct 15, 2005, 9:25 PM
Post #17 of 32 (5007 views)
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Re: [tetra316] Crossfire 2 or Katana? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
I've been reading as many posts as I can find comparing the two and they are pretty much evenly divided. My take from reading these is that the canopies are very similar but the Katana dives more aggressively and the crossfire has a better glide. Or at least that's what most people are saying, correct me if I'm misinterpeting this. I've put about 8 jumps on a Katana but haven't yet jumped the crossfire 2, planning on getting a demo if I can't find one to borrow. So what canopy would you recommend with the goal of swooping being the main reason for buying?


Edited cuz I'm typing to fast

I'd recommend the Katana. But it also depends on what flying style you prefer. If you're aiming for the top tier of canopies someday, do you want an insanely fast, low front riser pressure/high rear riser pressure canopy (Velocity), or do you want a turf surfer (VX, Xaos 27)?

The step you take next generally determines what you end up flying, as manufacturers tend to build canopies to be flown with a certain style. Want a Velocity someday? Get the Katana. Want a VX someday? Get a Crossfire 2.


marks  (D 22296)

Oct 16, 2005, 5:02 PM
Post #18 of 32 (4895 views)
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Re: [tetra316] Crossfire 2 or Katana? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
I've been reading as many posts as I can find comparing the two and they are pretty much evenly divided. My take from reading these is that the canopies are very similar but the Katana dives more aggressively and the crossfire has a better glide. Or at least that's what most people are saying, correct me if I'm misinterpeting this. I've put about 8 jumps on a Katana but haven't yet jumped the crossfire 2, planning on getting a demo if I can't find one to borrow. So what canopy would you recommend with the goal of swooping being the main reason for buying?


Edited cuz I'm typing to fast

they are both good. although im not sure if p.d. is putting vectran lines on the katana yet, they may be. i wouldnt buy a katana with the spectra (sp?) lines on it.


chayes12  (D 23772)

Oct 17, 2005, 5:38 AM
Post #19 of 32 (4789 views)
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Re: [marks] Crossfire 2 or Katana? [In reply to] Can't Post

Check this link for some differences between Vectran and Microline.

http://www.performancedesigns.com/pmd_faq.asp#6


(This post was edited by chayes12 on Oct 17, 2005, 5:40 AM)


mr2mk1g  (C 103449)

Oct 17, 2005, 5:50 AM
Post #20 of 32 (4781 views)
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Re: [tetra316] Crossfire 2 or Katana? [In reply to] Can't Post

Quote:
Keep in mind my wl now is about 1.1

Let me get this straight; you want to go from a 1:1 loading to a 1:4 loading in one go AND go elliptical at the same time?


tetra316  (D 26945)

Oct 17, 2005, 7:41 AM
Post #21 of 32 (4732 views)
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Re: [mr2mk1g] Crossfire 2 or Katana? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Let me get this straight; you want to go from a 1:1 loading to a 1:4 loading in one go AND go elliptical at the same time?

Yep.

(I do have around 50 or so jumps on various ellipticals with a 1.4 loading from borrowing and demoing.)


tetra316  (D 26945)

Oct 17, 2005, 7:46 AM
Post #22 of 32 (4729 views)
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Re: [dploi] Crossfire 2 or Katana? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
I'd recommend the Katana. But it also depends on what flying style you prefer. If you're aiming for the top tier of canopies someday, do you want an insanely fast, low front riser pressure/high rear riser pressure canopy (Velocity), or do you want a turf surfer (VX, Xaos 27)?

The step you take next generally determines what you end up flying, as manufacturers tend to build canopies to be flown with a certain style. Want a Velocity someday? Get the Katana. Want a VX someday? Get a Crossfire 2.

Thanks. That's the kind of insight/comments I'm looking for.


mr2mk1g  (C 103449)

Oct 17, 2005, 7:52 AM
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Re: [tetra316] Crossfire 2 or Katana? [In reply to] Can't Post

Just playing devils advocate here... but... would it not be a better idea to do one or the other?

You're already skipping two canopy sizes at once by going straight to a 1.4 loading... why not make that jump then go elliptical later? Or step down by less than 3 canopy sizes in one go and go elliptical?

You've obviously not rushed your canopy progression to date - why start now?


tetra316  (D 26945)

Oct 17, 2005, 8:03 AM
Post #24 of 32 (4716 views)
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Re: [mr2mk1g] Crossfire 2 or Katana? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Just playing devils advocate here... but... would it not be a better idea to do one or the other?

You're already skipping two canopy sizes at once by going straight to a 1.4 loading... why not make that jump then go elliptical later? Or step down by less than 3 canopy sizes in one go and go elliptical?

You've obviously not rushed your canopy progression to date - why start now?

I'm not sure where you're getting that I'm going down by 3 canopy sizes. I'm going from a 135 to a 120.


Premier ianmdrennan  (D 25821)
Moderator
Oct 17, 2005, 8:07 AM
Post #25 of 32 (4708 views)
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Re: [tetra316] Crossfire 2 or Katana? [In reply to] Can't Post

Quote:
I'm not sure where you're getting that I'm going down by 3 canopy sizes. I'm going from a 135 to a 120.

A perfectly reasonable progression for someone with 900 jumps at a 1.4 loading IMO (assuming you've been diligent in your learning).

I think you'll really enjoy the KA. I'd still like to try out the Aerodyne Mamba too.

Blues,
Ian


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