Forums: Skydiving Disciplines: Swooping and Canopy Control:
cross braced canopies

 

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skygod7777  (D 24081)

Jun 18, 2002, 5:49 PM
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cross braced canopies Can't Post

what's up

i have a 84 fx, and am looking to down size. i was wondering some peoples opinions on the other x-braced canopies out there, velocity, vx, xaos 21 and 27. i'm going to demo them all probably, but am just wondering what people think of them. and find out a little what it will be like before i demo it.

thanks

blue sky's and long swoops
kelly
D-24081




watcher  (D 24876)

Jun 18, 2002, 5:57 PM
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The Velocity i love, Been under a 120, 111, and a 103 its very ground hungy which i like with alot of power in the surf. The Xoas21 - 98 i flew was very fast, long snivelly openings, and a much flatter glide, great flare also. Most of the ppl i have talked to like the Xoas over both the FX and VX, while the Velocity tends to be a different animal, I love them but thats me.Just a reminder the Velocity holds the Number 1 and #2 distance records, a VE-103 at 418 feet.

Jonathan
D-24876



Kirils  (D License)

Jun 18, 2002, 8:43 PM
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My vote is for a Chaos 21. Toggle pressure is higher than the
Velocity and rear riser pressure is lower. I know people complain about the Chaos toggle pressure, but it really adds a safety and control factor in swoops. You gotta demo one!

Skydiving is not a static excercise with discrete predictability...


freeflydave  (D 20894)

Jun 18, 2002, 9:41 PM
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Performance Designs Velocity,

Dave




skygod7777  (D 24081)

Jun 18, 2002, 10:05 PM
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why?????????? i'm looking for some reasons to jump one!!!!!!!!!!!!!! and why i shouldn't just buy another fx.
thanks

blue sky's and long swoops
kelly



rapper4mpi  (D 21553)

Jun 19, 2002, 5:26 AM
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How soon are you looking to downsize? If you wait a little bit, Big Air Sportz is in the testing stage of a cross-braced airlocked canopy that is amazing. Mike Swanson has two of them currently.
-Rap



jdhill  (D License)

Jun 19, 2002, 5:55 AM
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I don't know if these are Dave's reasons, but here are a few... IMO, the Velocity has better openings and more bottom end than the FX. I say this after having jumped both of them. The Velocity can also go just as fast and just as long (if not faster and longer with the right pilot) as the VX. I own 2 of them, 96 @ 2.25 and a 103 @ 2.1.

I have not jumped a VX yet, but right now it is the only other x-braced I would consider trying (until BAS comes out with theirs). I'm not sold on anything w/ HMA (lines that break w/ no sign of wear?) and won't jump one until the lines are proven.

Peace.

Josh


http://www.aerialfusion.com


ramon  (D 26115)

Jun 19, 2002, 6:16 AM
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I think pilot skill and luck have a lot to do with the results at a swoop meet so I don't think you can say this canopy versus that canopy. Demo everything and keep what is comfortable for your style.

known items.
Xaos..claims of good openings (ignore broken HMA thread that 135 had some problems Laugh) light riser pressure flatter glide. I have seen and or heard about these canopies colapsing quite a bit but most occurences can be explained away by this or that..but worth noting.

velocity...claims of good openings high riser pressure steep glide. notable claim...friend at DZ is loaded on his velocity more than I am on my FX (I flare all the way), he can shut his velocity down in no wind better than I can my FX (regardless of his superior skill he has always claimed it stalls at a lower speed than an FX)

VX...claims of crazy to hard openings (I know two people that have tamed theirs) high riser pressure, probably highest aspect ratio cross brace out there, probably thinest airfoil. I know a guy that jumps one at 3.1 and he seems to shut it down pretty well for that high wingloading. Apparently this canopy is capable of much more radical maneuvers close to that ground than an FX (hard 90 to 180 turns in the swoop)

FX...claims of random slams (I have tamed mine just with packing technique..but let that slider get away from you..and..) well all are probably capable of a little more than an FX..but...remember pilot skill and luck mean more than what canopy you got.


ramon

"wee girls on a skydive road trip on big bikes...... yikes, dykes and bikes kinda thing...... ", David McKelvie


Kirils  (D License)

Jun 19, 2002, 8:37 AM
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Well said!

Skydiving is not a static excercise with discrete predictability...


skygod7777  (D 24081)

Jun 19, 2002, 9:56 AM
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well, as it is right now, the velocity is sounding really good. but i have never had any problems with my fx. i can get it to shut down, and open with a great snivil. we have a 111 velocity at my dz, and i can get just as good of landing out my fx as he can his velocity. but i will have to try a velocity to see if i get better landings than i can on my fx. and any one know about pd building a 75 velocity?????????? i would buy a 79 if i really liked it, but would like to try a 75 also. but i'm not sure if they really build them. i've only heard of them building them.

thanks

blue sky's and long swoops
kelly



eames  (D 23844)

Jun 19, 2002, 10:10 AM
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In reply to:
and any one know about pd building a 75 velocity?
Yes, by special request, I believe. Give them a call.

Jason



eames  (D 23844)

Jun 19, 2002, 10:13 AM
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I'll let you know how my Xaos-27 is once it comes in... should be a week or two.

Jason



watcher  (D 24876)

Jun 19, 2002, 10:42 AM
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Eric Taylor (camera for PD Blue) used to have a 75 and a 70, but had to give those back when he came back to Atlanta, his consolation was 2 79's. He was doing video for us this last weekend, had not jumped in a year, and said he was going conservative on the first few, well instead he came in, laid out a sweet kick out carving swoop (i was at 600 feet and went from seeing his canopy, to seeing him laid on his side, with the canopy to the right of him on its side, to him back under it landing it, Everyone was like "DAMN" ). Yeah the PD team kicks ass, of course im biased as they were all GaTech Alumni)

Jonathan
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ramon  (D 26115)

Jun 19, 2002, 2:10 PM
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I want to jump one too.

Josh......

puhleeze........

"wee girls on a skydive road trip on big bikes...... yikes, dykes and bikes kinda thing...... ", David McKelvie


prost  (D 24959)

Jun 19, 2002, 8:38 PM
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<I'll let you know how my Xaos-27 is once it comes in... should be a week or two.>

So are you going to have three canopies now? What size are you getting?

William



freeflydave  (D 20894)

Jun 19, 2002, 9:42 PM
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Kelly,
I jump the Velocity because of many things,
-design/planform shape
-R&D that none rival
-construction methods that all hope to emulate
-performance envelope that begs to be mastered
-security in the fact that it is the best all around x-braced canopy flown by discriminating canopy pilots with thousands of jumps and years of experience
-diving capabilities
-lift capabilities and shut down ability
-carving ( close to ground ) stability
-opening characteristics ( soft and on heading just about 90% of the time, the other 10% is usually from packing and or pilot exaggerations of deployment handling )
-customer service if anything is needed regarding the canopy
-faith in a company that has been, and always be at the forefront of all of the above within this industry
-the only thing that can hold back this canopy is the pilot who is under it

these are all of my reasons to jump one and to own one, why shouldn't you buy another fx? That is a question for yourself to answer after you have compiled your research and jumped one as a demo. Check it out and see for yourself, pay close attention to your own experience and be open to always learning more about this part of our sport, once you think you have something mastered this is the point you stop learning and progressing. Enjoy.

Dave



skygod7777  (D 24081)

Jun 19, 2002, 11:23 PM
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"these are all of my reasons to jump one and to own one, why shouldn't you buy another fx?"

well i don't know if i want to yet. i'm going to demo all of these to find out.

and you jumping a velocity couldn't also have something to with you being sponsered could it???????

but have you jumped any other X-braced canopies(i'm sure you have) but is this the only thing that you have to compare it to????? i'm sure that your a great pilot, but if you don't put about 50 or 60 jumps on a demo canopy, you don't really know how it will perform for you. ya sure, you may do some hooks with it when you demo one for a couple of weeks, but that's only 2 weekends, maybe 15 jumps, and you don't know how it will really perform for the hole season. but that's just my opinion and opinions are like assholes.......... everyone has one, and they all stink

blue sky's and long swoops
kelly



eames  (D 23844)

Jun 20, 2002, 8:06 AM
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In reply to:
So are you going to have three canopies now? What size are you getting?
No, I've already sold my black and white 21. The 27 will be a 94. Should load it between 2.4 and 2.5. That's a little heavy, but I liked the way my 21s flew between 2.3 and 2.4. We'll see.

Jason



jdhill  (D License)

Jun 20, 2002, 8:18 AM
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maybe the 103, maybe.

http://www.aerialfusion.com


cobaltdan  (D License)

Jun 20, 2002, 9:28 AM
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you may want to demo a comp. cobalt before you decide on a tri cell canopy.

after a year of competitions a comp cobalt is ranked #2 on the para performance swoop circuit for distance against an almost exclusive field of tricells.

sincerely,

dan
atair
www.extremefly.com



skygod7777  (D 24081)

Jun 20, 2002, 9:43 AM
Post #21 of 44 (3784 views)
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i downloaded the comp cobalt demo form about 2 hours ago. will be faxing it soon

later

blue sky's and long swoops
kelly



rhino  (D 22500)

Jun 20, 2002, 9:46 AM
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Dan,

Have you had a chance to jump the crossfire2? If so how do you think it compares to the comp cobalt??

Rhino

Blue Skies ..... Wink



eames  (D 23844)

Jun 20, 2002, 9:57 AM
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Rhino,
Come on, enough with the rhetorical questions.... The Crossfire2 is clearly an inferior canopy to the [drum roll please] Competition Cobalt. Wink No other canopy can possibly compare [unless it is made by Atair Aerodynamics].

A person will almost believe it if it's shoved in his face enough.

Jason



rhino  (D 22500)

Jun 20, 2002, 10:18 AM
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LOL.. ummm......

Maybe at 2.4? But at 2.0 maybe not?? Who knows?? I'd like to know if he jumped the cfire2.. Personally with it's performance I don't believe it is possible for the crossfire2 to be inferior to anything??

Rhino

Blue Skies ..... Wink



ramon  (D 26115)

Jun 20, 2002, 10:28 AM
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Let us know about the openings. friend of mine demoed one and did not like it (disclaimer: he is not a very aggressive pilot) and it was too small for me to try.

r

"wee girls on a skydive road trip on big bikes...... yikes, dykes and bikes kinda thing...... ", David McKelvie


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