Forums: Skydiving Disciplines: Swooping and Canopy Control:
Stilletto flying!!!!

 


freeflir29  (D 10000000)

Mar 25, 2002, 7:34 AM
Post #1 of 14 (1900 views)
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     Stilletto flying!!!!  

Packed the Stilletto up on Friday night. Damn ZP is differen't to pack. I had packed a student ZP once helping someone out and didn't find it hard at all. The Stilletto was a differen't story. After the 5 or six packs I did this weekend I got the hang of stuffing it in the bag.

Jump#1- H&P from 14,000 feet. Learned first lesson of flying a Stilletto. DO NOT DEPLOY IN CRAPPY AIR. Dumped about 3 or 4 seconds out the door. Still very much on the hill and it opened 180 off but no big deal. My fingers almost froze off but I did all the standard stuff to put it through it's paces. Practice flares, flat turns, front riser 360,270, 180 with alti checks, eats up about 450 on a 180 hook. Noticed that it bucked if I used the dive loops. Bringing it in for the first time. Just like being a student again. Had to remember to fly a pattern other than down wind....HOOK IT!!!! surf.....Down wind, base, hard toggle to final, went about 100 feet long from the target....Smile Damn what a glide that thing has on it. Stood it up. Tim got video...don't know if he is gonna post it. Not much to see really....

Jump#2- H&P from about 7000. Wanted to see what a terminal deployment was like. Took a delay to about 5000 and dumped. Openeings are a bit squirrelly. I see exactly what people mean by "Fly the opening" If you don't stay with that canopy it will leave without you. Laugh Nice stand up landing. Went long again....what a glide....

Jump#3- Another H&P ....just flying the canopy and getting used to it on H&P so I don't have to dodge any traffic on an unfamiliar wing. Stood up the landing but I'm positive the brakes are too tight.

Jump#4- 3 way FF. Chased a 2 way out. Caught em and did some carving and a beautiful dock!! Tracked away....dumped about 3500. Opened soft but into line twists. My worst fear on this canopy. Hands on risers...kickin like crazy. Canopy spinning a little but not hard. Dammitt....I can't get em out! Shit I'm going to have to cut this away!!! Look back up to give it one more try before chopping it and realize I was kicking the wrong direction...Smile Yeah go ahead and laugh....I did. Twists came right out when I kicked the other way. Nice 90 degree riser turn and double fronts to landing. Still don't have quite the soft enough touch or feel of the canopy to make it surf too far yet. But still got 40-60 feet hardly even trying. Funny thing....when I used the risers I don't go long anymore. Hmmm...seeing a pattern that maybe these two canopies are not all that differen't. I did notice myself steering the openings with my legs unconciously for the first time on this jump.

Jump#5- Sunday morning....Did a 4 way head down in which I ended up doing lots of sitting...go figure. Got used to the openings. Feel comfortable with the canopy now. Riser pressure builds exponentially in a dive. Sure is nice that I don't have to bust my butt to try and stay away from people on big slow canopies that like to spiral. I can beat them down or hang out until they got out of the way. Did I mention the glide this thing has....

Jump#6- 2 way head down with Mikey (Mr AD license holder) Flower exit stay relative....do a 360. Did a sit fly dock track away....Nice 270 degree opening!! Stayed with it and all was well. Nice stand up. Still getting used to having to fly the pattern a little lower since I'm not digging on the risers so hard.

Jump#7....7 way cluster dive!!! The Georgia Tech 4 way team has been practicing a lot lately. (Watcher is on that) Well.....we got together 7 free flyers and chased them out the door. Funneled their formation and then took off on a nice sunset tracking dive. Laugh Everyone had a great time on that dive and the Tech students loved it!!! I don't think I have ever seen 12 people laughing so hard in free fall before. Made for great video too!!! Nice 90 to double front riser approach. 60 foot surf with really nice toggle technique this time. Flies 1000% better with 3 more inches on the brake lines.


Final thoughts on going from square to elliptical. Turns a little faster. Has a hell of a lot more glide. Dives a little longer but recovers just as hard. Wish it didn't! Toggle control range is much more sensitive and shorter than the square. Riser pressure is immense after just a short dive. Pretty light starting out. Openings are ALWAYS soft but kind of squirrelly and you have to pay attention and stay with the canopy. All in all.....I guess I like it. It will be a swoop monster when I work up to hooking it hard. That will take a little while though. All those people out there that say there is some huge difference in F-111 landings and ZP. I really don't know why. If anything ZP is easier because you have a much more efficient wing to work with. Now, the Stilletto control range is really short if the brakes are too short. If you set it up loose it flies much better. Once I added about 3 inches to the toggle line it was all good. Smile

"I only have a C license, so I don't know shit..right?"-Clay


weid14  (D 20292)

Mar 25, 2002, 7:50 AM
Post #2 of 14 (1879 views)
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     Re: Stilletto flying!!!! [In reply to]  

new or used canopy?



Premier PhreeZone  (D License)
Moderator
Mar 25, 2002, 7:52 AM
Post #3 of 14 (1879 views)
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     Re: Stilletto flying!!!! [In reply to]  

The control range on all PD products is very similar. If you jump a canopy from Icarus or Atair you will find the mid-flare point on PD is the planeing out part on the other canopies. There is a difference in the flare point on the different makers canopies. PD's tends to be lower chest while Atair for sure and I'm thinking Icarus is more like waist level. People jumping from one canopy maker to the other often have problems getting used to the new control and flare range.

And you only noticed a LITTLE turn difference between a Stiletto and PD190? Um... somethings not right there... There should have been a HUGE difference.

I wish you would step back from that ledge my friend... ~3EB


AndyMan  (D 25698)

Mar 25, 2002, 7:56 AM
Post #4 of 14 (1872 views)
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     Re: Stilletto flying!!!! [In reply to]  

Dude, congrats. Have lots of fun, but play safe. That Stiletto is a great canopy, but you gotta treat it with respect. It will bite you.

Front riser preasure is going to be hight when you're recovering from a dive. You've got so much airspeed that the canopy is generating a whole lot more lift... This is gonna happen on any high performance canopy.

Have fun, and go sell AggieDave your PD190.

_Am

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freeflir29  (D 10000000)

Mar 25, 2002, 7:59 AM
Post #5 of 14 (1870 views)
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     Re: Stilletto flying!!!! [In reply to]  

In reply to:
new or used canopy?

Used but less than 200 jumps on it. Lines are still nice and crispy and the canopy is very clean and slippery.
Phree- Yeah....There is a pretty good difference in the two but it's not crazy. The biggest difference I think is the glide angle. Much Much flatter on the Stilletto. Thats why I went about 100 long on the first 2 jumps....Laugh



"I only have a C license, so I don't know shit..right?"-Clay


prost  (D 24959)

Mar 25, 2002, 8:01 AM
Post #6 of 14 (1869 views)
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     Re: Stilletto flying!!!! [In reply to]  

<Front riser preasure is going to be hight when you're recovering from a dive. You've got so much airspeed that the canopy is generating a whole lot more lift... This is gonna happen on any high performance canopy.>


To a degree, yes, but some canopies build up more than others. The stilletto seems to buid up a lot. This is due to the desing of the canopy.


William



eames  (D 23844)

Mar 25, 2002, 8:05 AM
Post #7 of 14 (1867 views)
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     Re: Stilletto flying!!!! [In reply to]  

In reply to:
Final thoughts on going from square to elliptical.
You've jumped it 7 times and you're having final thoughts? Takes me more like a hundred, but maybe I'm a little slow.... Also, the characteristics of a Stiletto (whichever size you tried), are not necessarily even close the characteristics of other elliptical canopies. What about, "Initial thoughts on going from a PD 190 to Stiletto ###." Or whatever you jumped before....

Jason



axe96bam  (D 23380)

Mar 25, 2002, 8:24 AM
Post #8 of 14 (1855 views)
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     Re: Stilletto flying!!!! [In reply to]  

Going from a PD190 to a stiletto is a huge change. take your time with it. Take it slow. You have a lot to learn so just keep this in mind. You mess up on this one and it will not be as forgiving as your PD190. Like someone else here said "respect it"

Alex



freeflir29  (D 10000000)

Mar 25, 2002, 9:02 AM
Post #9 of 14 (1833 views)
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     Re: Stilletto flying!!!! [In reply to]  

In reply to:
whichever size you tried

It is a 170. I didn't want to downsize too much and go elliptical all at the same time. I think this was a great transition. For me anyway. As far as this canopy being dangerous......so far I have found it to be much safer. The glide is much flatter and the flare more powerful. Granted it's faster and eats more altitude in turns so if you do pound in it's gonna be ugly but all in all I have found it much more forgiving of sloppy landing technique.

"I only have a C license, so I don't know shit..right?"-Clay


weid14  (D 20292)

Mar 25, 2002, 9:12 AM
Post #10 of 14 (1828 views)
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     Re: Stilletto flying!!!! [In reply to]  

did someone re-set them (the brakes) shorter when they got it and deviate from factory specs? I noticed on my Velocity that the control range is longer and deeper - almost identical to my Crossfire, but the Stilleto range is much shorter and higher (jumped all three last weekend).



freeflir29  (D 10000000)

Mar 25, 2002, 9:54 AM
Post #11 of 14 (1805 views)
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     Re: Stilletto flying!!!! [In reply to]  

It looked like the lower control lines had been replaced at some point so I don't know where the factory setting was. I like my canopies "loose" and this one was far too tight for my taste. A flat glide was ear level...maybe higher. I like that to be closer to my shoulder and then be able to fly slow with my arms all the way down. I have it now where I never really shut it down but instead I can keep it flying until it almost comes to a stop on it's own. Take a couple steps on a no wind day or you can bring it to a hover if there is a little wind. I was quite suprised how similar it was to landing the 190. Glide...milk it...milk it...milk it......touch down. I was also pretty suprised at how much difference 3 inches in the lines made. I'm thinking that the brakes were set pretty close to factory specs. From what I have seen manufacturers like to set the brakes really short for some reason. I can't land like that. Oh...I almost forgot. A Stilletto is at least 100 times easier to land straight in than my square 190 ever was.

"I only have a C license, so I don't know shit..right?"-Clay


kwmontreal  (D 25906)

Mar 25, 2002, 9:58 AM
Post #12 of 14 (1805 views)
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     Re: Stilletto flying!!!! [In reply to]  

I am down sizing this season also. Going from a PD190 to a saber 170. I demoed a Stilletto 150. It was WAY out of my league!! I wanted to get a Stilletto170, but fell into a good deal on the saber. So I guess I jump this for a couple of hundred and learn to fly the snot out of it. I'll go epliticle (sp) next time around!! First jump on the Saber will be next weekend.

Jump safe!

KW



weid14  (D 20292)

Mar 25, 2002, 10:06 AM
Post #13 of 14 (1799 views)
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     Re: Stilletto flying!!!! [In reply to]  

it's probalby more the fact that you're on Zpo fabric, so you get a truer glide than on the regular un-coated fabric (techically F-111 fabric was a trade name and is not manufactured anymore). Even though your 190 was fairly new, it was still probably venting a lot more air than you think. My experience has been that people tend to shorten brake lines when they get a canopy, dont' know why, but maybe it's a comfort thing when they pull down just a little something happens. Of course, that makes using your risers not an integral part of flying the canopy then (as you found out).



HotLoad  (D 25849)

Mar 25, 2002, 11:29 AM
Post #14 of 14 (1772 views)
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     Re: Stilletto flying!!!! [In reply to]  

Congrats man. I just put the first four jumps on my "new" crossfire. I'm highly impressed by everything the canopy has shown me so far, opens great (had one funky subterminal opening), glides fast and flat, and love the landings. Whoever made the comment about toggle positions in various modes of flight hit it on the money. The inputs are noticeably different than on PD's stuff. Hope you enjoy your stilletto as much as I dig the new crossfire.




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