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What size canopy to get the GF

 

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MADPROPS  (B License)

Sep 8, 2013, 2:46 PM
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What size canopy to get the GF Can't Post

Hey my Girlfriend is just about to start jumping and I have a chance to pick up some good gear for a great price. I was just wondering what would be safe. The rig I'm looking at is a Sabre 1 150. She weighs 140 lbs and is 5'8 1/2. She has picked up a lot of sports I do like kayaking, Free diving and some others plus she used to play fast pitch (like softball but crazy fast pitching) at a really high level. I would just like to get your thoughts on that wing loading (1/1.03) with that canopy. I will have her out on a small hill doing some ground handling and what not with one of my bigger speed wings so she could do 50 landings and 3 or 4 hours

Any advise would be really great. I down sized really fast so I want to get a scope of how you guys started out and what worked


Premier billvon  (D 16479)
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Sep 8, 2013, 3:01 PM
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Re: [MADPROPS] What size canopy to get the GF [In reply to] Can't Post

Whatever you do, do NOT buy her gear until she is off student status! There's nothing worse than buying a new student gear to put all kinds of pressure on them. Pressure to stay in the sport if they don't like it. Pressure to jump the gear even if they're not ready for it. Pressure to avoid their home DZ with all those busybodies who say they are not ready for the gear. Pressure to not disappoint you.

Save the money and buy her gear when she's ready for it and knows what she wants.


MADPROPS  (B License)

Sep 8, 2013, 3:12 PM
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Re: [billvon] What size canopy to get the GF [In reply to] Can't Post

We are going to be taking a skydive trip and by the end of it she will have around 25 jumps. I do not plan on giving her the gear or letting her know that I have it until she is ready to shop for gear. she has been to the DZ lots and is used to the jumping world kind of. I will not let anyone put any pressure on her to do anything. If at the end of the trip she hates it I will say nothing about the gear and just resell it for the same cost I got it for.
Seem fare?


wolfriverjoe  (A 50013)

Sep 8, 2013, 3:23 PM
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Re: [MADPROPS] What size canopy to get the GF [In reply to] Can't Post

Is her quoted weight of 140 her exit weight? Or just her "driver's license" weight?

If she goes 140 in street clothes, then she will probably push 165 or more with full gear on. That puts here at 1.1:1 or higher. And a 150 is considered "high performance" no matter what the wingloading. Take a look at Brian's downsizing chart and see how much experience she should have for it. I'm guessing it's going to be a bit more than 25 jumps.


MADPROPS  (B License)

Sep 8, 2013, 3:33 PM
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Re: [wolfriverjoe] What size canopy to get the GF [In reply to] Can't Post

140 in street clothes if it had just rained haha.
in this rig her exit weight would be around 155. I was under a 190 for my first rig and I'm 185 naked and I didn't think it was all to fast. I know a smaller canopy with the same wing loading is not the same but its not like we are talking about a 150 velo here.

do you think ground handle helps at all? I felt way better after spending all the time I did on the ground with my canopy above me


Premier Remster  (C License)

Sep 8, 2013, 3:42 PM
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Re: [MADPROPS] What size canopy to get the GF [In reply to] Can't Post

Quote:
140 in street clothes if it had just rained haha.
in this rig her exit weight would be around 155.

What are you getting? A 99 in a base rig????

Count AT LEAST 25 lbs for a rig. Not 15.

Plus, at 5'8, 140, she may end up wearing lead. My wife, at 5'5 120, often wears 15-20lbs of lead.


Premier Remster  (C License)

Sep 8, 2013, 3:43 PM
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Re: [Remster] What size canopy to get the GF [In reply to] Can't Post

PS: what's a worse idea than asking for gear advice on an online forum before you're off student status? Asking for gear advice for a GF/BF before they are off student status... Pirate


gowlerk  (C 3196)

Sep 8, 2013, 4:05 PM
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Re: [MADPROPS] What size canopy to get the GF [In reply to] Can't Post

What? Why are you asking here? Why isn't she asking herself?
Try asking her. Are you a skydive instructor? If you are you don't need us. But I don't think you are since you are talking about ground launching her.


MADPROPS  (B License)

Sep 8, 2013, 4:06 PM
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Re: [Remster] What size canopy to get the GF [In reply to] Can't Post

No need for faces.....

Ok new question what's your experience trying to fit a 170 f1-11 canopy into a rig that says its a 150 max. The pilot 150 I jump now is 1 size over max but I can still jam it in there. my thoughts are that it would be a bit easier do to it being F1-11.


grue  (D License)

Sep 8, 2013, 4:10 PM
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Re: [MADPROPS] What size canopy to get the GF [In reply to] Can't Post

MADPROPS wrote:
No need for faces.....

Ok new question what's your experience trying to fit a 170 f1-11 canopy into a rig that says its a 150 max. The pilot 150 I jump now is 1 size over max but I can still jam it in there. my thoughts are that it would be a bit easier do to it being F1-11.

Overstuffing a rig is a great way to burn in. Several people's friends and family can attest to this.


MADPROPS  (B License)

Sep 8, 2013, 4:11 PM
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Re: [gowlerk] What size canopy to get the GF [In reply to] Can't Post

not ground lunching just ground handling. and not before she has around 25 jumps. I should have been more clear... for ground handling she can use my larger speed wing if we were going to do any launching then it would be under my paraglider and most people with 25 landings can handle a paraglider on a hill that only drops about 10 feet on a 75 foot run Sly


drewcarp

Sep 8, 2013, 4:20 PM
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Re: [MADPROPS] What size canopy to get the GF [In reply to] Can't Post

If she's good at softball then a 150 ought to be good.


Premier Remster  (C License)

Sep 8, 2013, 4:25 PM
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Re: [drewcarp] What size canopy to get the GF [In reply to] Can't Post

drewcarp wrote:
If she's good at softball then a 150 ought to be good.

Awesome.


MADPROPS  (B License)

Sep 8, 2013, 4:30 PM
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Re: [drewcarp] What size canopy to get the GF [In reply to] Can't Post

just tying to get it across that she is athletic. no need to start being a Deployment Bag Laugh


Di0  (C 42151)

Sep 8, 2013, 5:10 PM
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Re: [MADPROPS] What size canopy to get the GF [In reply to] Can't Post

MADPROPS wrote:
No need for faces.....

Ok new question what's your experience trying to fit a 170 f1-11 canopy into a rig that says its a 150 max. The pilot 150 I jump now is 1 size over max but I can still jam it in there. my thoughts are that it would be a bit easier do to it being F1-11.

I am the same weight of your GF (well, 5 lbs more, really, but whatever). I am also 4 or 5 jumps away from my license.

I have done a canopy class, I have had stand up landings for quite a few jumps now (but really, pretty much since the beginning) and both my instructor and the instructor of the canopy class said they would have no problem at all seeing me on a 170, if I respect the canopy.

A 150 seems on the smaller side to me, from my little to none experience. Reading around, I thought I could buy this:
http://www.performancedesigns.com/pulse.asp
which is supposed to pack a 170 in a 150 bag, so that way I could potentially buy a container that fits 135 and 150, jump a 170 for a couple hundreds jumps, get the 150 and eventually even go to a 135, which means I'll have a container that will last me for, literally, thousands of jumps.
But I really haven't given it much more thought that that, I don't even know if the Pulse, size aside, is a good beginner canopy from the point of view of its flight characteristics. That is something I promised to myself to investigate over the winter break.
but just my 2c.


(This post was edited by Di0 on Sep 8, 2013, 5:14 PM)


DocPop  (C License)

Sep 8, 2013, 5:27 PM
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Re: [MADPROPS] What size canopy to get the GF [In reply to] Can't Post

MADPROPS wrote:
hours
I down sized really fast ...

Really?

But according to your profile you're still jumping a 150 at 150 jumps. Surely an x-brace at around 2.5 WL would be where you should be for a "really fast" downsizer?

Seems to me you're slacking....

And don't girls usually jump 120s? Maybe you should get your GF one of those.


yoink

Sep 8, 2013, 5:37 PM
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Re: [MADPROPS] What size canopy to get the GF [In reply to] Can't Post

MADPROPS wrote:
not ground lunching just ground handling. and not before she has around 25 jumps. I should have been more clear... for ground handling she can use my larger speed wing if we were going to do any launching then it would be under my paraglider and most people with 25 landings can handle a paraglider on a hill that only drops about 10 feet on a 75 foot run Sly


So many red flags with your thought process, mate... Seriously - these posts are setting off all my alarm bells.

Let her learn ONE thing at once. A normal skydiving canopy handles nothing like a paraglider, let alone a student one. And ground launching is an advanced skill and again very, very different on a speedwing. 25 jumps is nothing.

You say 'just for groundhandling' - I call bullshit. Even if you have the best intentions in the world that 'just groundhandling' will end up with 'just a small flight' that will turn into 'just a simple 2-way'...

Seriously, it's great you want your girlfriend to be into all the stuff you like, but the BEST thing you can do for her is to let her go at her own pace, and let professionals teach her.


(This post was edited by yoink on Sep 8, 2013, 5:39 PM)


councilman24  (D 8631)

Sep 8, 2013, 5:51 PM
Post #18 of 40 (4112 views)
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Re: [MADPROPS] What size canopy to get the GF [In reply to] Can't Post

Simply

A 150 is too small, a F-111 170 is too small and too different if she's jumping a ZP student canopy. (before ZP 170-180 was the smallest standard canopy available!). Maybe if you hear it enough you'll believe it. Athletic has nothing to do with it. Please don't take one answer that says 'sure go for it', ignore all the good advice and ruin your girl friends skydiving trip.

If a rig says 150 max (150 what?) is depends on the rig whether a 170 might fit. And a 170 what? A seven cell, zp 170 may fit but you need to TRY the specific canopy in the specific rig. Rigs and canopies of identical model may vary in size 10%. To some extent in depend on the make/model of rig. Some can taking varying size canopies better than others.

BTW strange dropzone's and airplanes are not the best place for a novice to be learning a new rig/canopy. A lot of overload. And make sure she gets to say no to you and the other guys that say "Sure, you can do that 20 way, we'll build it around you."


MADPROPS  (B License)

Sep 8, 2013, 6:42 PM
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Re: [DocPop] What size canopy to get the GF [In reply to] Can't Post

naw mate up sizing is the new down sizing Tongue


MADPROPS  (B License)

Sep 8, 2013, 6:46 PM
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Re: [yoink] What size canopy to get the GF [In reply to] Can't Post

yoink wrote:
MADPROPS wrote:
not ground lunching just ground handling. and not before she has around 25 jumps. I should have been more clear... for ground handling she can use my larger speed wing if we were going to do any launching then it would be under my paraglider and most people with 25 landings can handle a paraglider on a hill that only drops about 10 feet on a 75 foot run Sly


So many red flags with your thought process, mate... Seriously - these posts are setting off all my alarm bells.

Let her learn ONE thing at once. A normal skydiving canopy handles nothing like a paraglider, let alone a student one. And ground launching is an advanced skill and again very, very different on a speedwing. 25 jumps is nothing.

You say 'just for groundhandling' - I call bullshit. Even if you have the best intentions in the world that 'just groundhandling' will end up with 'just a small flight' that will turn into 'just a simple 2-way'...

Seriously, it's great you want your girlfriend to be into all the stuff you like, but the BEST thing you can do for her is to let her go at her own pace, and let professionals teach her.

you can call BS all you want but no mater how fast you run you can't take off on the hill we are going to go on. and I am well aware of the fact that all 3 wings are much different but it still helps out.

ok 150 is out of the question... nuff said.


MADPROPS  (B License)

Sep 8, 2013, 6:49 PM
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Re: [councilman24] What size canopy to get the GF [In reply to] Can't Post

councilman24 wrote:
Simply

A 150 is too small, a F-111 170 is too small and too different if she's jumping a ZP student canopy. (before ZP 170-180 was the smallest standard canopy available!). Maybe if you hear it enough you'll believe it. Athletic has nothing to do with it. Please don't take one answer that says 'sure go for it', ignore all the good advice and ruin your girl friends skydiving trip.

quote]

she is not even going to know about this until after the trip. why would you say a 170 f1-11 is to small?


davelepka  (D 21448)

Sep 8, 2013, 8:00 PM
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Re: [MADPROPS] What size canopy to get the GF [In reply to] Can't Post

 
Bottom line on this issue -

If you want to do what's best for your GF, and save money in the process, wait until she is ready to buy a rig and then buy her what she is currently able to safely jump at that time.

Nobody has any way of knowing what she is going to need after 20 or 25 jumps, so anything you buy now is subject to either being a waste of money, or turning into a 'it's good enough and we already have it' situation.

Take a giant step back from the situation and give her a chance jump, and learn, and see what she thinks. If she likes it and wants to buy gear, let her and her instructors make the choice as to what would be a smart choice for her at that time.

Let's face it, with 150 jumps and a few years in the sport, you're no expert and no instructor with years of experience training new jumpers. The best thing you can do is realize that and let the best people for the job do what they do best.

I'm not a TI. I brought a close friend to the DZ to do a tandem a few weeks back, and while I answered some questions for her and went along to shoot a video and be a part of the jump, when it came to jump-specific questions and how to conduct the jump, it was all on the TI. He's way better at that shit than I am, and I wanted my friend to have the best experience possible so I made sure there were 'experts' working on all facets of her jump. I didn't tell the pilot how to fly the plane, or the TI how to do a safe tandem.


MADPROPS  (B License)

Sep 8, 2013, 8:13 PM
Post #23 of 40 (3972 views)
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Re: [davelepka] What size canopy to get the GF [In reply to] Can't Post

davelepka wrote:
Bottom line on this issue -

If you want to do what's best for your GF, and save money in the process, wait until she is ready to buy a rig and then buy her what she is currently able to safely jump at that time.

Nobody has any way of knowing what she is going to need after 20 or 25 jumps, so anything you buy now is subject to either being a waste of money, or turning into a 'it's good enough and we already have it' situation.

Take a giant step back from the situation and give her a chance jump, and learn, and see what she thinks. If she likes it and wants to buy gear, let her and her instructors make the choice as to what would be a smart choice for her at that time.

Let's face it, with 150 jumps and a few years in the sport, you're no expert and no instructor with years of experience training new jumpers. The best thing you can do is realize that and let the best people for the job do what they do best.

I'm not a TI. I brought a close friend to the DZ to do a tandem a few weeks back, and while I answered some questions for her and went along to shoot a video and be a part of the jump, when it came to jump-specific questions and how to conduct the jump, it was all on the TI. He's way better at that shit than I am, and I wanted my friend to have the best experience possible so I made sure there were 'experts' working on all facets of her jump. I didn't tell the pilot how to fly the plane, or the TI how to do a safe tandem.

good advise. I'm going to try and talk her into 3 or 4 extra days of jumping if she is having fun. I just wanted to have a gift for her B-day when we got back. I guess it is best to wait. in the time being ill keep my eyes open for a container and 170 reserve. maybe ill even update my profile Pirate


Premier billvon  (D 16479)
Moderator
Sep 8, 2013, 8:22 PM
Post #24 of 40 (3949 views)
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Re: [MADPROPS] What size canopy to get the GF [In reply to] Can't Post

>We are going to be taking a skydive trip and by the end of it she will have around 25 jumps.

Unless she hates skydiving, or doesn't want to jump that much, or doesn't want to jump with you. (Which would be wise; often newer jumpers, especially women, get a lot of pressure to do things right off student status they otherwise would not do.)

> I will not let anyone put any pressure on her to do anything.

"Here's a rig! I spent a few grand on it and got it just for you. We can jump together more - that will be AWESOME! - because you won't have to pay for rental gear. And it will fit you better and be way safer. But no pressure."

>If at the end of the trip she hates it I will say nothing about the gear and just resell it
>for the same cost I got it for.

It's not a bad idea because you will lose the money. It's a bad idea because it's dangerous and will put pressure on her to jump gear she otherwise wouldn't. You have no idea what gear will be appropriate for her once she gets off student status (if she does at all.)


(This post was edited by billvon on Sep 8, 2013, 8:22 PM)


MADPROPS  (B License)

Sep 8, 2013, 11:02 PM
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Re: [billvon] What size canopy to get the GF [In reply to] Can't Post

billvon wrote:
>We are going to be taking a skydive trip and by the end of it she will have around 25 jumps.

Unless she hates skydiving, or doesn't want to jump that much, or doesn't want to jump with you. (Which would be wise; often newer jumpers, especially women, get a lot of pressure to do things right off student status they otherwise would not do.)

> I will not let anyone put any pressure on her to do anything.

"Here's a rig! I spent a few grand on it and got it just for you. We can jump together more - that will be AWESOME! - because you won't have to pay for rental gear. And it will fit you better and be way safer. But no pressure."

>If at the end of the trip she hates it I will say nothing about the gear and just resell it
>for the same cost I got it for.

It's not a bad idea because you will lose the money. It's a bad idea because it's dangerous and will put pressure on her to jump gear she otherwise wouldn't. You have no idea what gear will be appropriate for her once she gets off student status (if she does at all.)

you may take my word if you want that I want no pressure to be put on her. nor will I try and get her to do things she should not be doing. when she started white water kayaking it took me about two months of running class one water with her before I would let her go to class two(class one can be paddled by a drunk guy on a tube safely). I don't want to be involved with coaching her cause 1: I'm not a coach and 2: If anything I would hold her back.

The whole point was to get a rig for her and hold it. when she was ready to start shopping I would give it to her. she was not going to know about it till then. I have resold ever bit of skydiving gear for the same cost that I have paid for it so I'm not to worried about losing money.

I was just asking if a 150 was ok for a first wing cause that would put her at the same wing loading I was at when I got gear. no harm no fowl, when she is ready for gear ill most likely pick up a reserve and a container and then go main shopping with her. I have a friend her size that jumps so she can help.

thanks for your timeSmile


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