Forums: Skydiving: Safety and Training:
landing in water - which direction

 


wilcox

Mar 10, 2006, 12:21 AM
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landing in water - which direction Can't Post

What is your plan for water landings when it comes to which direction to land?

Which factors have you considered? Wind? Moving water? Other things?
Which landing directions give the smallest risk of entanglement with the main in different scenarios that you have thought of?


dzjohn  (A 817)

Mar 10, 2006, 1:06 AM
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Re: [wilcox] landing in water - which direction [In reply to] Can't Post

 
I was taught by my instructor to always fly towards land


phoenixlpr  (D 3049)

Mar 10, 2006, 1:10 AM
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Ive landed into a lake. My direction was into the wind and I have not cut my main away.


fcajump  (D 15598)

Mar 10, 2006, 3:19 AM
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Re: [phoenixlpr] landing in water - which direction [In reply to] Can't Post

Just as with other out-landings, consider the following:

- obstacle avoidance / open area
on land - don't hit the tractor / power line crossing the field
on water - don't hit the bridge / power line crossing the river

- wind line
on land - into the wind slows your ground speed and helps collapse your canopy behind you
on water - into the wind slows your ground... er... water speed and helps collapse your canopy behind you

- near (but not ON) avenues or individuals of assistance (not forgetting obstacle avoidance)
on land - near a road or house (phone)
on water - near shore or a boat

- REMEMBER TO be ready to PLF (I've boated on some very large lakes/rivers that were only 1-2 feet deep in places.) / REMEMBER TO do all the other things learned in your live water jump training.

- fast moving water... here you might open a lively debate as to whether during your landing you would be dragged back under the canopy, and how the you and the canopy could be entangled in the currents... but the specific examples get very involved and I doubt that a single solution provided here could address all possible situations. Maybe a good general guess would be land across the flow.

Just my thoughts...

Jim


Premier SkymonkeyONE  (D 12501)

Mar 10, 2006, 6:35 AM
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Re: [wilcox] landing in water - which direction [In reply to] Can't Post

Fly as close to land as you possibly can and then land INTO THE WIND.


riggerrob  (D 14840)

Mar 10, 2006, 7:18 AM
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Re: [SkymonkeyONE] landing in water - which direction [In reply to] Can't Post

If you land into the wind, the wind will blow the canopy behind you, minimizing chances of entanglement.


wmw999  (D 6296)

Mar 10, 2006, 7:21 AM
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Re: [riggerrob] landing in water - which direction [In reply to] Can't Post

Quote:
minimizing chances of entanglement
It also means you're more likely to be face up in the water rather than face down. I breathe better that way.

Wendy W.


AFFI  (D 25538)

Mar 10, 2006, 10:16 AM
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Re: [wilcox] landing in water - which direction [In reply to] Can't Post

Most answers to such questions can be found in the SIM...

Per 2006 SIM section four page 28

Water

1. Refer to the USPA BSRs for equipment requirements on jumps near water, but many drop zones have waivers on file.
2. Procedure for an unintentional water landing:
a. Inflate the flotation device (if available).
b. Disconnect the chest strap (this may require taking your hands out of the steering toggles first).
c. Steer into the wind.
d. Enter the water with lungs full of air.
e. Prepare for a PLF; since the depth is unknown.
f. Flare the parachute to half brakes at ten feet above the water (may be difficult to judge)
g. Dive deep and swim out from under the collapsed canopy.
h. Take a deep, full breath at every opportunity.
i. Release or slide off the leg straps and swim carefully away to avoid entangling in the suspension lines.


Many skydivers have amendments and modifications to this protocol or have an alternate method incorporated in their personal procedures for varying situations contradictory the information contained in the SIM. Keep in mind that the SIM has been developed for many years and the knowledge contained therein is derived from decades of experience and millions of skydives but may still contain some information that may be considered by some authority apocryphal in nature.

That being said I may not utilize every piece of information in the SIM but for the most part the vast majority of its information forms much of the basis for the foundation of safe skydiving practices that I choose to make my own.


Make it a great day...


diablopilot  (D License)

Mar 11, 2006, 12:30 AM
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Re: [wmw999] landing in water - which direction [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Quote:
minimizing chances of entanglement
It also means you're more likely to be face up in the water rather than face down. I breathe better that way.


Freak.


Why don't you just absorb oxygen through your pores like the rest of us skydivers?


Laugh


ernokaikkonen  (D 12)

Mar 11, 2006, 3:08 AM
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Re: [diablopilot] landing in water - which direction [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Why don't you just absorb oxygen through your pores like the rest of us skydivers?

Are you serious??Shocked

Everybody knows that you can only do that at freefall speeds. Many people have drowned going through clouds, what do you think will happen if you try to pore-breathe while immersed in water?


Kelly  (C License)

Mar 26, 2006, 11:23 AM
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Re: [wilcox] landing in water - which direction [In reply to] Can't Post

Where is Shark? He just did a wonderful water training class for a bunch of us at Elsinore last week.

~Kel


shermanator  (B License)

Mar 27, 2006, 4:00 AM
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Re: [Kelly] landing in water - which direction [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Where is Shark? He just did a wonderful water training class for a bunch of us at Elsinore last week.

~Kel

oh why must you rub that in? darn work!!


councilman24  (D 8631)

Mar 28, 2006, 11:07 AM
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Re: [AFFI] landing in water - which direction [In reply to] Can't Post

Hmmm,

Inflate flotation

Then dive deep.Wink

Not sure who came up with this but I see the dive deep as unnecessary. A dry parachute will not saturate very quickly in a lake. Even then it won't necessarily do much. If it blows behind you are you now pulling it over (you under, your not going to pull it very far) you and coming up under when other wise you wouldn't?
I advocate calmly lifting it off and moving to the side.

When doing water training in a pool the first guy has it easy. The jumpsuit and parachute are dry. A wet parachute landing on you is a lot different from a dry one. I always have the person I like most go first.Wink Actually I have the one that needs the training the least (most aware) go first. I also have people get out of a jumpsuit. This may or may not be necessary but I have them do it for a reason. Almost invariably the first guy gets out of the rig, then unzips the jumpsuit and starts to peel it off, without undoing the ankle velcro. The jumpsuit turns inside out and then it's very, very difficult to get to the velcro to get it off. The only person I almost had to rescue was in this situation. It's a lesson that has to be seen to be learned. Then everybody else knows not to do this.Tongue

All bets are off on a river landing. First you ought to be able to miss it. But the current scares me a lot. I'd land what ever direction gets the canopy down stream of me. If your going fast and stop in the water suddenly that might be down river with the canopy going ahead of you. It might be up river if you have a bigger canopy and will be able to stop your airspeed.

We were asked to do a demo once into a river. Not a fast river but certainly flowing well. I didn't even want to consider it. Not worth the risk.


ZigZagMarquis

Mar 29, 2006, 1:15 PM
Post #14 of 16 (2563 views)
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Re: [wilcox] landing in water - which direction [In reply to] Can't Post

Up-post... AFFI and CMan pertty much said it.

I'm glad I got into the sport after you had to do an actual water jump. Now a-days its just wet-training with some old rig in a swimming pool.

Some of the old grey hairs around the DZ still tell stoies about doing their "water jumps" under old T10s into the big pond at the Caliofornia City Colf Course... even so, I think the procedure there post landing was pretty much "Stand Up"... as the stories go, most of the water was only waist to chest deep.

Anyway, I suppose one day the USPA will even drop the actual night jumps requirement for getting a D-License and all the newbies will have to do is go into a dark room with their rig on and still be able to find their handles... CrazyTongue


(This post was edited by ZigZagMarquis on Mar 29, 2006, 1:16 PM)


Schoenauer  (D License)

Mar 30, 2006, 1:46 PM
Post #15 of 16 (2524 views)
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Re: [wilcox] landing in water - which direction [In reply to] Can't Post

Landing in water has a few variations from what I have been reading on this thread. So I will commence with my two cents about unintentional water landings.

The idea of while in the water, diving deep, is kind of a misnomer, because the objective is to swim out of and away from your gear. One way to do this is to swimming down, enough to get out of the harness, swim over to get clear from the gear and up to the surface.

A question I have people should think about is, which would be easier and faster to do. Swim out of the harness while keeping your head above water, or swimming down and out of the harness?

One area I am surprised about the SIM does not address is a weights water landing. If a skydiver is jumping with weights on at a DZ that is within one mile of a body of water, doesnt it make sense that the weights should be worn outside of the jump suit? This is so the weights can be dumped easily before landing in the water.


Schoenauer  (D License)

Mar 31, 2006, 8:55 AM
Post #16 of 16 (2491 views)
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Re: [Schoenauer] landing in water - which direction [In reply to] Can't Post

One area I am surprised about the SIM does not address is a weights water landing".
Quote:

It should read "one area I am surprised about the SIM that does not address is wearing weights and water landings."



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