Forums: Skydiving Disciplines: Photography and Video:
GoPro Mounted on the side of helmet safe?

 


jonorato

Feb 11, 2013, 2:10 PM
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GoPro Mounted on the side of helmet safe? Can't Post

Hello. I have a Z1 helmet and want to mount a GroPro snug on the side of it. Right about where your ear would sit in the helmet. Too dangerous with the risers? Has anyone tried it?

Thanks!


Premier DSE  (D 29060)

Feb 11, 2013, 2:38 PM
Post #2 of 33 (6208 views)
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Re: [jonorato] GoPro Mounted on the side of helmet safe? [In reply to] Can't Post

How would you mount it? Which side?
Full faces already extend, so it's not advisable.


jonorato

Feb 11, 2013, 2:50 PM
Post #3 of 33 (6203 views)
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Re: [DSE] GoPro Mounted on the side of helmet safe? [In reply to] Can't Post

thanks for the reply. I would mount it on whichever side works better. I would mount it with the basic adhesive clip mount and make an L out of the pieces made by GoPro. The GoPro is tight to the side of the helmet. So much so that when it is mounted, the GoPro itself is still barely touching the side of the helmet. There is no space between the GoPro and the helmet.

Similar to the picture attached. But my gopro still touches the side of my helmet


jonorato

Feb 11, 2013, 2:51 PM
Post #4 of 33 (6199 views)
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Re: [jonorato] GoPro Mounted on the side of helmet safe? [In reply to] Can't Post

 
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uberchris  (A License)

Feb 11, 2013, 4:10 PM
Post #5 of 33 (6179 views)
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Re: [jonorato] GoPro Mounted on the side of helmet safe? [In reply to] Can't Post

why not just mount on top?


Premier DSE  (D 29060)

Feb 11, 2013, 4:25 PM
Post #6 of 33 (6171 views)
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Re: [jonorato] GoPro Mounted on the side of helmet safe? [In reply to] Can't Post

I'd strongly recommend you not jump that.


Squeak  (E 1313)

Feb 11, 2013, 4:29 PM
Post #7 of 33 (6170 views)
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Re: [DSE] GoPro Mounted on the side of helmet safe? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
I'd strongly recommend you not jump that.
He'll be fine, once the riser slaps the camera offWink


Premier DSE  (D 29060)

Feb 11, 2013, 5:19 PM
Post #8 of 33 (6153 views)
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Re: [Squeak] GoPro Mounted on the side of helmet safe? [In reply to] Can't Post

Assuming the riser slaps it off vs catching and holding it, and in a full-face, not being able to deal with it.
I'll venture out on a limb and guess the OP is a very new skydiver, based on registration date and language in the question.

to Jornato: Please read this sticky before mounting and jumping that camera?
This thread is a recent reason if the others aren't enough for you.

Cutaways are critical for helmets with cameras on them. Fullface helmets require modifications for cutaways; no manufacturer provides them.

Full face helmets usually have the camera on top, or on the chin piece. There are some that have special mounts for Replay, Contour cameras, but not the GoPro.

Please adhere to the safety recommendations; they're not there because "the man wants to keep you down" but rather because many others have gone before you and some are just plain "gone" as a result of not adhering to the rules.


(This post was edited by DSE on Feb 12, 2013, 12:48 AM)


Divalent  (C 40494)

Feb 11, 2013, 6:32 PM
Post #9 of 33 (6134 views)
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Re: [jonorato] GoPro Mounted on the side of helmet safe? [In reply to] Can't Post




(This post was edited by sangiro on Feb 12, 2013, 11:45 AM)
Attachments: helmeta.jpg (42.7 KB)


dragon2  (D 101989)

Feb 11, 2013, 11:47 PM
Post #10 of 33 (6073 views)
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Re: [jonorato] GoPro Mounted on the side of helmet safe? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Hello. I have a Z1 helmet and want to mount a GroPro snug on the side of it. Right about where your ear would sit in the helmet. Too dangerous with the risers? Has anyone tried it?

Thanks!

Sure you can mount it that way, if all you are going to use the helmet for is skiing.
A camera on a fullface helmet is NOT safe for skydiving because you cannot cutaway a helmet like that.
IF you are going to mount a gopro on a fullface helmet you want to mount it on TOP of the helmet not the side, plus have a whole lot of jumps (500+). This is not for beginners.

A better beginner camera helmet is a open-face helmet with a cutaway installed. The go-pro goes up top or up front (never mount a go-pro on the side). You could jump a helmet like that at 200 jumps.


stratostar  (Student)

Feb 12, 2013, 9:47 AM
Post #11 of 33 (5977 views)
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Re: [jonorato] GoPro Mounted on the side of helmet safe? [In reply to] Can't Post

Glad that shit is on your head and not mine... I say go for it! Jump the shit out of it that way.. I mean it's not like there is tons of info about how to safely set up a camera helmet on here to get educated on the proper way to go about this, but seeing how you clearly spent no time at all researching this topic and learning from the many experts here on this topic....

Go for it bro and learn the hard way, you signed the waver, right? There are a lot fucked up DZ's that will be happy to allow you to jump that set up....

I would advise you to look left on deployment and until your canopy is open. And those cutways on helmets are way over rated and hardly get used anyway.


jonorato

Feb 12, 2013, 3:57 PM
Post #12 of 33 (5902 views)
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Re: [stratostar] GoPro Mounted on the side of helmet safe? [In reply to] Can't Post

Ok then. The answer is no. That is why I asked. I was pretty certain it wouldnt work which is the reason I brought it up for discussion and the picture posted is something I pulled off the internet, not my helmet. Thanks to DSE for being the only person who wasnt a dick. It's hard to ask questions when your new to the sport and you dont have any jump knowledgeable friends to ask.


Premier DSE  (D 29060)

Feb 12, 2013, 7:42 PM
Post #13 of 33 (5871 views)
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Re: [jonorato] GoPro Mounted on the side of helmet safe? [In reply to] Can't Post

No one really intends on being a dick, this question comes up in various forms so often, I wish there was a way to filter the answers to you before anyone responds.
Some questions get asked in various forms a lot of different ways, so the multitude of answers might not come up in a search.

Kudos to you for not already having answered your question and then looking for supportive responses. It's not always easy hearing that your ideas aren't good ones.

Welcome to photography. Wink


stratostar  (Student)

Feb 12, 2013, 8:41 PM
Post #14 of 33 (5859 views)
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Re: [jonorato] GoPro Mounted on the side of helmet safe? [In reply to] Can't Post

Quote:
Hello. I have a Z1 helmet and want to mount a GroPro snug on the side of it. Right about where your ear would sit in the helmet. Too dangerous with the risers? Has anyone tried it?

Thanks!

Do you see anything in that post that says you pulled that image off the internet and it's not your helmet?

If you need to ask questions ask them by all means... however if you leave out key info like... " I saw this set up and was thinking about trying this, anyone have an idea" you would get way less flack fired at you. When people post photos of stupid set ups and act like it is theirs to test... don't be surprised if some of us call it out for what it is, stupid!

As was said, no one wants to be a dick, but there is a few sticky's on the top of the forum that a great deal of noobs don't bother to read... nor do they do a search and then come here and ask the same questions that have been covered in great detail already.

Thank god that is not your helmet and you won't jumping it, smart idea.


BMFin

Feb 13, 2013, 12:09 AM
Post #15 of 33 (5829 views)
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Re: [stratostar] GoPro Mounted on the side of helmet safe? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:

Do you see anything in that post that says you pulled that image off the internet and it's not your helmet?

Yes, in the previous post before the pic he says: "Similar to the picture attached. But my gopro still touches the side of my helmet "

If you are able to count 1+1 you might pick up, that it is not his helmet.

Also, I have been jumping with a go pro on the side with no problems. (due to my still camra taking so much room on the top) A few years back people were jumping sidemounted cameras all the time. When did this suddenly became a problem?

Someone said you cannot cutaway this type of fullface and therefore the sidemount is not recommended. Well, if you mount the camera on the top, is the cutaway is no longer needed? IMO mounting to the side and not having a cutaway are two totally different questions, plus I think people are sometimes exaggerating the need for a cutaway.

About the "riser slap". Technically its not the risers that are hitting your camera. It is the camera that might be hitting the risers. We all know how after you throw your PC, your d-bag comes out and your lines start to unstow. At this point you are normally still flying flat, but your risers are already pointing upwards. It is after your canopy catches air that you shift into vertical orientation and it is at this point when your camera might touch the riser. This is why the "so called riser slap" isnt really that violent. My L-bracket is rather broad to the side, and I still havent had any problems with it. However, it is advisable to have the mount rigid enough to cope with your head hitting the risers so you wont loose your camera.

Personally I wouldnt mount the go pro to the side if I had enough room on the top. I just dont see the benefit in the sidemount. However, I dont see it as a real risk.


Premier DSE  (D 29060)

Feb 13, 2013, 1:23 AM
Post #16 of 33 (5820 views)
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Re: [BMFin] GoPro Mounted on the side of helmet safe? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:

Do you see anything in that post that says you pulled that image off the internet and it's not your helmet?

Yes, in the previous post before the pic he says: "Similar to the picture attached. But my gopro still touches the side of my helmet "

If you are able to count 1+1 you might pick up, that it is not his helmet.

Also, I have been jumping with a go pro on the side with no problems. (due to my still camra taking so much room on the top) A few years back people were jumping sidemounted cameras all the time. When did this suddenly became a problem?

Someone said you cannot cutaway this type of fullface and therefore the sidemount is not recommended. Well, if you mount the camera on the top, is the cutaway is no longer needed? IMO mounting to the side and not having a cutaway are two totally different questions, plus I think people are sometimes exaggerating the need for a cutaway.

About the "riser slap". Technically its not the risers that are hitting your camera. It is the camera that might be hitting the risers. We all know how after you throw your PC, your d-bag comes out and your lines start to unstow. At this point you are normally still flying flat, but your risers are already pointing upwards. It is after your canopy catches air that you shift into vertical orientation and it is at this point when your camera might touch the riser. This is why the "so called riser slap" isnt really that violent. My L-bracket is rather broad to the side, and I still havent had any problems with it. However, it is advisable to have the mount rigid enough to cope with your head hitting the risers so you wont loose your camera.

Personally I wouldnt mount the go pro to the side if I had enough room on the top. I just dont see the benefit in the sidemount. However, I dont see it as a real risk.

"Need for cutaways exaggerated?"
"Not a real risk to have it side mounted" (particularly on the right side)?
"Isn't that violent?"
??

For the OP; in the event that the three posts separately mentioning cutaway, and full-face helmets not being ideal for cameras didn't sink in/weren't clear (or anyone else reading this thread), full face helmets are not idea as camera mounting platforms, in great part because there are no manufactured cutaway systems.
If you are going to do a sidemount, improve your odds by putting the camera on the left side, away from the hand that throws the PC.

I submit that anyone who jumps a camera without a cutaway system is a fool. Call that an exaggeration if you will; I've personally seen one save the life of someone with more than 15,000 jumps, and there is video where a friend might not have been OK had he not cutaway his helmet during an entanglement.

Between the three relatively recent fatalities from camera/bridle/line entanglements, the German video showing the strength of two-sided tape, our own weight/pull tests, the proliferation of newer jumpers wearing cameras before they have much experience dealing with malfunctioning gear (it's a long list of more) we do know that cutaways have saved lives. We do know that small format cameras don't easily break off without leverage, and none of us can be sure we'll always have/ever have the leverage needed to break one off during a malfunction.


BMFin

Feb 13, 2013, 1:51 AM
Post #17 of 33 (5814 views)
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Re: [DSE] GoPro Mounted on the side of helmet safe? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
I submit that anyone who jumps a camera without a cutaway system is a fool.

The majority of people jumping with go pros are mounting them on helmets that arent really ment for cameras. Hemce they lack cutaways. I dont see a big problem there. I wouldnt go as far as calling all of them fools. As I said, I dont see a real need for a cutaway with this type of helmet + go pro. Sure there is some room for debate. Same goes with some other issues like jumping with a hoodie. Some might think its plain stupid and others do it all the time.

Other than that, I definetly dont see why the cutaway would be any more necessary when sidemounted. Also I still dont undestand why sidemounts have suddenly became so dangerous.


stratostar  (Student)

Feb 13, 2013, 5:57 AM
Post #18 of 33 (5764 views)
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Re: [BMFin] GoPro Mounted on the side of helmet safe? [In reply to] Can't Post

Yes I missed the second post comment about the attached image. That said I stand behind the point I was making to the OP and to any others who read here... a little research before posting will provide a wealth of info.... most of us who been in this game a long time in fact do think there are a lot of fools now jumping small format cams. While the body count is very limited at this time, I contend that the use of these is still new and exploding at a huge rate and mounted in all kinds of fucked up ways full of snag hazards, such as the OP's attached image.

We don't have a large pile of dead camera flyers, but we have lost a number of them over the years, we learned lessons for those deaths. I strongly believe we sill see a rash of deaths involving these small format cams in the in the future, I believe the numbers will be larger then the current numbers of dead camera flyers. It is then a bunch of you will wise up and only then will you all get it!

Hope I'm proven wrong, but history of this sport says other wise. YMMV.


(This post was edited by stratostar on Feb 13, 2013, 5:58 AM)


dragon2  (D 101989)

Feb 13, 2013, 7:51 AM
Post #19 of 33 (5744 views)
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Re: [BMFin] GoPro Mounted on the side of helmet safe? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:
I submit that anyone who jumps a camera without a cutaway system is a fool.

The majority of people jumping with go pros are mounting them on helmets that arent really ment for cameras. Hemce they lack cutaways. I dont see a big problem there. I wouldnt go as far as calling all of them fools. As I said, I dont see a real need for a cutaway with this type of helmet + go pro. Sure there is some room for debate. Same goes with some other issues like jumping with a hoodie. Some might think its plain stupid and others do it all the time.

Other than that, I definetly dont see why the cutaway would be any more necessary when sidemounted. Also I still dont undestand why sidemounts have suddenly became so dangerous.

It's not sidemounting that is dangerous, it's sidemounting a camera as wide and as snatchy as a GOPRO that is dangerous. You won't hear me complain if you wanted to sidemount a sony actioncam, that formfactor is way better suited to sidemounting that the boxy gopro.

I DO see a major problem with no cutaway. Especially with newbie camera jumpers. And yes I'd call them fools, mostly so for not asking (or taking) advice from experienced cameraflyers first. How can you think not being able to cutaway your helmet say when your brakeline is attached to your camera a good/safe idea?!?


gowlerk  (C 3196)

Feb 13, 2013, 7:35 PM
Post #20 of 33 (5642 views)
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Re: [dragon2] GoPro Mounted on the side of helmet safe? [In reply to] Can't Post

Here's another dumb gopro setup. I asked him why he would take a relatively small and potentially safe camera and do his level best to make it as dangerous as he could. He's a good friend, but he refused to see anything wrong with it. No cutaway system either. It's worked so far, what could go wrong?

Ken


Attachments: 600_2544-001.JPG (37.5 KB)


stratostar  (Student)

Feb 13, 2013, 9:40 PM
Post #21 of 33 (5615 views)
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Re: [gowlerk] GoPro Mounted on the side of helmet safe? [In reply to] Can't Post

Yea that is pretty fucking stupid! Put that flush on the front or on one of those small half boxes on top. Oh well it's not on my head or yours, so no worries mate.

PS take the space out of the inline text.... it's on the end ] should look like this... end] then the pic will show in the post.


(This post was edited by stratostar on Feb 13, 2013, 9:43 PM)


gowlerk  (C 3196)

Feb 14, 2013, 5:49 AM
Post #22 of 33 (5554 views)
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Re: [stratostar] GoPro Mounted on the side of helmet safe? [In reply to] Can't Post

Quote:
PS take the space out of the inline text.... it's on the end ] should look like this... end] then the pic will show in the post.

Thanks, but there is a 6 hour time limit for edits, so I can't. I wanted to try the inline attachment thing so I'm doing it again.

Still is not working, but both times it did work when I previewed the post. Something buggy going on here.

Ken




(This post was edited by gowlerk on Feb 14, 2013, 6:09 AM)
Attachments: gopro.JPG (37.5 KB)


stratostar  (Student)

Feb 14, 2013, 6:47 AM
Post #23 of 33 (5537 views)
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Re: [gowlerk] GoPro Mounted on the side of helmet safe? [In reply to] Can't Post

IDK... that space was the only thing I could see wrong. All the same nice pic to show people r Crazy


hookitt  (D License)

Feb 14, 2013, 11:32 AM
Post #24 of 33 (5492 views)
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Re: [DSE] GoPro Mounted on the side of helmet safe? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
I'd strongly recommend you not jump that.

He'd strongly not be allowed to jump that Wink

If there's a way to smooth out the back edge, then it's much less of an issue

but...

Given that it's so simple to put on the top, I see no common sense shown from a jumper who puts it on the side with all snag points available. It's clearly a bad design the way it's shown.


Premier DSE  (D 29060)

Feb 14, 2013, 12:32 PM
Post #25 of 33 (5479 views)
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Re: [gowlerk] GoPro Mounted on the side of helmet safe? [In reply to] Can't Post

Distraction factor aside, I wish there was a way to require helmet cutaways on all of these small-format cameras mounted on helmets.

With the bigger helmets, people *generally* put time, thought, and a sizeable investment in their gear. Doing so, *generally* people have researched the subject and have some reasonably (and sometimes very deeply) informed motivations for how they set up their systems.
With the small format cameras, it's peel n' stick. And the tether, and...whatever else they can do to convince themselves "nothing will happen to me, and I wanna be a hero."


dthames  (B 37674)

Feb 14, 2013, 3:54 PM
Post #26 of 33 (1909 views)
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Re: [DSE] GoPro Mounted on the side of helmet safe? [In reply to] Can't Post

Quote:
<snip>
Between the three relatively recent fatalities from camera/bridle/line entanglements, the German video showing the strength of two-sided tape, our own weight/pull tests, the proliferation of newer jumpers wearing cameras before they have much experience dealing with malfunctioning gear (it's a long list of more) we do know that cutaways have saved lives. We do know that small format cameras don't easily break off without leverage, and none of us can be sure we'll always have/ever have the leverage needed to break one off during a malfunction.
<snip>

DSE, I know how strong that mounting tape can be. I have been wondering about the plastic mounts and their strenght. I understand one might never know if they would break or not. But do you know of any specific testing that anyone has done on the plastic mounts?

Thanks,
Dan


Premier DSE  (D 29060)

Feb 14, 2013, 3:57 PM
Post #27 of 33 (1908 views)
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Re: [dthames] GoPro Mounted on the side of helmet safe? [In reply to] Can't Post

somewhere in this forum is a photo of me pulling on a 100lb archery scale with Spectra around a mount, and not breaking at 100lbs. Moving the line to the mount itself, it broke (IIRC) @ 60lbs.
I'm too lazy to search it out for you. See the small camera incidents thread, there is video of a guy hanging on a mount and PC. The mount did not break nor pull off.
FWIW, we also found that Fastex clips don't release under load.


skyjumpenfool  (Student)

Feb 14, 2013, 6:50 PM
Post #28 of 33 (1884 views)
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Re: [DSE] GoPro Mounted on the side of helmet safe? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
somewhere in this forum is a photo of me pulling on a 100lb archery scale with Spectra around a mount, and not breaking at 100lbs. Moving the line to the mount itself, it broke (IIRC) @ 60lbs.
I'm too lazy to search it out for you. See the small camera incidents thread, there is video of a guy hanging on a mount and PC. The mount did not break nor pull off.
FWIW, we also found that Fastex clips don't release under load.

Best advice I recieved when doing research for my camera helmets...
"It's really hard to cut away with a broken neck! Make it as snag free as you possibly can." ... Bergie

Food for thought.Smile


ChrisD  (No License)

Oct 18, 2013, 11:21 AM
Post #29 of 33 (1448 views)
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Re: [jonorato] GoPro Mounted on the side of helmet safe? [In reply to] Can't Post

I just wanted to give the viewing audience a little reminder that in 2012:

We lost two wonderful people due to (most likely) helmet snags on their risers.

And this is without attaching any fish hooks or boat anchors....

C

Just a reminder of what you guys are playing with here.....Crazy


To Answere Dan, 3M has done exhaustive testing on their "mounting" tape, tape. In fact one popular tape is used to apply the side panels to those tractor trailer bodies and much of the fairings that are so popular these days. The only advice I have regarding dealing with 3M is get on the phone and be persistant, their web site is insane. They have numerous product bullitains and application information. Many of these tapes are stronger than the surface material they are bonding toghther.... Here is a link to get you started: Tape

Design guide

If you wade thru these you can see that the plastic body of a Go Pro can support loads of up too almost 2000 lbs. in compression, and over 1000 lbs (cm/3) in tension, this far exceeds the capabilities of your neck....

Now for the real scarey part: The visoelastic properties of these tapes ensure their adhesion over time, along the bond line and shear points they absorbe energy to protect their bond. This means over a few milliseconds they could potentially transfer 10,000 lbs of energy per every square inch....


I was under the impression that we wore helmets to make things safer???? Not worse???


(This post was edited by ChrisD on Oct 18, 2013, 11:48 AM)


BMFin

Oct 20, 2013, 10:59 AM
Post #30 of 33 (1255 views)
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Re: [ChrisD] GoPro Mounted on the side of helmet safe? [In reply to] Can't Post

ChrisD wrote:
We lost two wonderful people due to (most likely) helmet snags on their risers.

And this is without attaching any fish hooks or boat anchors....

Did I understand you correct? There are two fatalities in the year 2012 due to riser strikes? Do tell please !


chemist  (A License)

Oct 20, 2013, 11:30 AM
Post #31 of 33 (1242 views)
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Re: [BMFin] GoPro Mounted on the side of helmet safe? [In reply to] Can't Post

BMFin wrote:
ChrisD wrote:
We lost two wonderful people due to (most likely) helmet snags on their risers.

And this is without attaching any fish hooks or boat anchors....

Did I understand you correct? There are two fatalities in the year 2012 due to riser strikes? Do tell please !

If the camera is snagged on the riser and you cutaway it could easily kill you, the 3M tape as said above can hold 2000 lbs of force before breaking that means your neck will snap as you release your main.

I don't think he meant a riser strike. And in a malfunction think how easy it would be for a riser to catch a go pro on the side? Especially the one like in the picture on the first page of this thread. Man I have to say that is damn foolish the way he has that camera.


martin245

Oct 21, 2013, 3:02 AM
Post #32 of 33 (1118 views)
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Re: [chemist] GoPro Mounted on the side of helmet safe? [In reply to] Can't Post

On my last Wingsuitbase I had brutal linetwists.

My lines were so twisted that I couldn't barely move in my suit allready and my fullface helmet was blocking any moves additionally.

Could luckily throw the fullface helmet off, untwist the lines and land safely.

With a sidemounted cam I wouldn't have had any chance to get out of this, a sidemounted cam would have made everything worst or even broke my neck...


sky490

Oct 22, 2013, 7:51 PM
Post #33 of 33 (872 views)
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Re: [DSE] GoPro Mounted on the side of helmet safe? [In reply to] Can't Post

I happen to have over 200 jumps on this G2 with a Hero 3 Mounted onto the Cookie Pivot Point using my own design Quick Lock that works like a PL mount lens. I have had riser strikes but mostly I control the openings by forcing the risers wide during opening. I also jump a 119 Crossfire 2 with a wing loading of about 1:9
I do use a cut away system and the Quick Lock uses plastic screws like my Articulating Bracket
Attachments: 1.jpg (682 KB)



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