Forums: Skydiving: Gear and Rigging:
UPT Delivery Time; Anyone want to give up their slot?

 

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Premier billvon  (D 16479)
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Feb 2, 2012, 3:10 PM
Post #26 of 39 (1036 views)
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Re: [jojames] UPT Delivery Time; Anyone want to give up their slot? [In reply to] Can't Post

>If they halved their production time they would surely double the business.

?? I don't think that's true at all. There is a small market for skydiving gear, and very few people are going to think "well, I was going to get a Mirage in 6 weeks, but now that I can get a Vector in 12 weeks I'm going for that!" You might get a few more orders but you certainly wouldn't double sales.

Companies do best when their pipelines are full and they can project out six months to a year; that way they can make better hiring, firing and materials decisions. And skydivers are obviously willing to wait. And for skydivers who aren't, there are plenty of manufacturers with shorter delays.


jojames

Feb 2, 2012, 4:16 PM
Post #27 of 39 (1021 views)
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Re: [billvon] UPT Delivery Time; Anyone want to give up their slot? [In reply to] Can't Post

Your comments are interesting and valid. The facts are in marketing and advertising the easiest customers to get is a repeat customer. Now when someone says vector etc are good containers but will take more than half a year to build then most people move on to another faster company. And probably half of those people will buy from that company again and again. The other fact is there are people who wait and people who don't. It just depends on your level of patience and trust. Also its a bit risky sending your money to another country and not have anything to see for 6+ months. Take karnage krew in Australia for instance. They took everyone's money and went broke and all the poor bastards over here lost thousands of dollars. This not a whinge... Just statement of facts.


Krip  (Student)

Feb 2, 2012, 5:42 PM
Post #28 of 39 (1005 views)
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Re: [jojames] UPT Delivery Time; Anyone want to give up their slot? [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi u all

Think about it. Would you rather have Mr Booth use experienced people on the production line and give them a reason to stay around, like steady employement.

Or would you like Mr Booth to ramp up production to meet the demand by going to Labor ready and hire anyone that "says" they know how to sew a straight line.Unsure

Mr booth has been in business along with other quality gear manufactors long time. He wouldn't still be in business if he didn't know how to market his product. Bill came up with the latest and greatest invention since sliced bread the skyhook.Sly

So the demand for vectors has increased even more than before. 75% of all jumping fatalities occur after the jumper has a perfectly good canopy over their head. The skyhook can't save them.Frown

Now there's AAD,s. higher opening altitudes, "gentle opening mains" aka Snivel . Or Micro canopies that when they open with line twists the jumper has to eject aka cutaway before they pass out from the G forces.

I'm not jumping anymore so I suggest that everyone take a deep breath and think about where the Industry of jumping is going and whats the value of all the latest bells and whistles, when your jumping gear that due to the latest fads is the problem.

Riser covers have been a problem for a very long time velcroFrown tuck tabs, magnets , afaik they all have issues.

If a skyhook is what people want, and they know the wait time is going to be longer than Ideal. They can't have it both ways. Unless they start a bidding war in on gently used vectors, never packed outside etc etc, Angelic

If I was jumping and owned a vector with a skyhook if the "price was right" especially during the off season I'd sell it in a heart beat.

Want a vector with the hookeer option? Run a ad offering 20%, 30%, 40% over the sticker price and see what happensSly

R


wildcard451  (D License)

Feb 2, 2012, 8:43 PM
Post #29 of 39 (981 views)
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Re: [jojames] UPT Delivery Time; Anyone want to give up their slot? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Your comments are interesting and valid. The facts are in marketing and advertising the easiest customers to get is a repeat customer. Now when someone says vector etc are good containers but will take more than half a year to build then most people move on to another faster company. And probably half of those people will buy from that company again and again. The other fact is there are people who wait and people who don't. It just depends on your level of patience and trust. Also its a bit risky sending your money to another country and not have anything to see for 6+ months. Take karnage krew in Australia for instance. They took everyone's money and went broke and all the poor bastards over here lost thousands of dollars. This not a whinge... Just statement of facts.

I do think that trying to equate KK to UPT is retarded. One is a well known company and one was a house of cards.

/I jump Mirage, but Vector makes good stuff.


Squeak  (E 1313)

Feb 2, 2012, 10:15 PM
Post #30 of 39 (974 views)
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Re: [jojames] UPT Delivery Time; Anyone want to give up their slot? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Your comments are interesting and valid. The facts are in marketing and advertising the easiest customers to get is a repeat customer. Now when someone says vector etc are good containers but will take more than half a year to build then most people move on to another faster company. And probably half of those people will buy from that company again and again. The other fact is there are people who wait and people who don't. It just depends on your level of patience and trust. Also its a bit risky sending your money to another country and not have anything to see for 6+ months. Take karnage krew in Australia for instance. They took everyone's money and went broke and all the poor bastards over here lost thousands of dollars. This not a whinge... Just statement of facts.

See this is where you are wrong, if that were the case UPT would go out of the sport rig industry. MOST People who want a Vector are prepared to wait. Sometimes it's 6 months sometimes it's shorter. MANY people actually PLAN their rig purchase, so it's not a spur of the moment thing. Those who do plan often take into account production times.


(This post was edited by Squeak on Feb 3, 2012, 12:24 AM)


DrewEckhardt  (D 28461)

Feb 2, 2012, 10:22 PM
Post #31 of 39 (971 views)
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Re: [tdog] UPT Delivery Time; Anyone want to give up their slot? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
That is kind of illustrates the point... Not enough resources to be nimble enough to meet customer's expectations of reasonable delivery time.

They're doing a fine job meeting customer's expectations of delivery times.

If they weren't they wouldn't have an X month backlog inspite of prices that are substantially higher than competitors like Sunrise Rigging.

In reply to:
Either the workers are overworked, the factory is not big enough to hire more staff, or the assembly line process cycle takes too long for every station, or they don't want to risk "ramping up" more staff in case of an economic downturn.

Sport skydiving gear demand is seasonal. UPT can either hire workers, train them, keep them busy during high demand months, lay them off, and then repeat the process (greatly increasing costs for them) or note that customers still buy their products when production gets spread throughout the year.


(This post was edited by DrewEckhardt on Feb 2, 2012, 10:23 PM)


DrewEckhardt  (D 28461)

Feb 2, 2012, 10:30 PM
Post #32 of 39 (965 views)
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Re: [jojames] UPT Delivery Time; Anyone want to give up their slot? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Your comments are interesting and valid. The facts are in marketing and advertising the easiest customers to get is a repeat customer. Now when someone says vector etc are good containers but will take more than half a year to build then most people move on to another faster company.

Nope.

People have been religiously buying Vector and Javelin rigs for the last decade in spite of long delays, significantly lower prices from competitors, and construction that's at least as good.

MARD options make their buyers even less likely to go elsewhere.

In reply to:
Also its a bit risky sending your money to another country and not have anything to see for 6+ months.

UPT and Sunpath

1) Have been around for decades.

2) Probably get most of their money from the military market which is much larger than the sport skydiving market.

Their continued market presence a few decades from now is likely.


davelepka  (D 21448)

Feb 3, 2012, 4:58 AM
Post #33 of 39 (930 views)
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Re: [DrewEckhardt] UPT Delivery Time; Anyone want to give up their slot? [In reply to] Can't Post

Quote:
People have been religiously buying Vector and Javelin rigs for the last decade in spite of long delays, significantly lower prices from competitors, and construction that's at least as good.

Rigth. I love it when people try to equate the skydiving gear industry to the microwave industry, or a fast food.

When products are lower cost, mundane, and not all that 'personal', delivery time may play a role in people's purchasing decisions, but when it comes to rigs and canopies, not so much. Maybe one of out 100 rig purchases are time-driven, where the jumper 'has' to have a rig by a certain time, but even then, most manufacturers aren't willing to make a delivery time commitment, so those jumper are still left to take their chances or just buy used.

It's not like this backlog or delivery times are a new thing. It's been going on for years, and even a 'good' delivery time for a rig is 2 or 3 months. The way I see it Bill Booth (and the others) are right on the money. They hire and retain good, skilled workers, and keep them busy 5 days a week, all year long.


propilot  (C License)

Feb 3, 2012, 8:36 AM
Post #34 of 39 (894 views)
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Re: [davelepka] UPT Delivery Time; Anyone want to give up their slot? [In reply to] Can't Post

Yea, I don't expect anything different from UPT, I agree that they probably don't have any good options to increase production without incuring other negative issues. I'm just in a unique time crunch position and was wondering if anyone wanted to sell their slot.

Anyway, I ended up buying a Wings (loved my previous Wings). If I end up jumping as much as I plan, I may order a UPT rig and have two by next summer.

Thanks for the suggetions via PM guys/gals.

Cant wait to get back in the air!


lvintw

Feb 3, 2012, 9:36 AM
Post #35 of 39 (870 views)
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Re: [Krip] UPT Delivery Time; Anyone want to give up their slot? [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Mr. Krip!

Quote:
So the demand for vectors has increased even more than before. 75% of all jumping fatalities occur after the jumper has a perfectly good canopy over their head. The skyhook can't save them.

Now there's AAD,s. higher opening altitudes, "gentle opening mains" aka Snivel . Or Micro canopies that when they open with line twists the jumper has to eject aka cutaway before they pass out from the G forces.

I'm not jumping anymore so I suggest that everyone take a deep breath and think about where the Industry of jumping is going and whats the value of all the latest bells and whistles, when your jumping gear that due to the latest fads is the problem.

You said it, mate! Today's generation of jumpers is so spoiled, they don't understand how to do the basics without killing themselves or others.Frown

It's really sad that so many people have died for no reason other than fasion and a stupid addiction to speed.Crazy

We knew better and survived.


AndyMan  (D 25698)

Feb 3, 2012, 11:05 AM
Post #36 of 39 (840 views)
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Re: [propilot] UPT Delivery Time; Anyone want to give up their slot? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
I agree that they probably don't have any good options to increase production without incuring other negative issues. I'm just in a unique time crunch position and was wondering if anyone wanted to sell their slot.

Actuallyt, UPT has just (in the last month or so) completed construction on the expansion of their factory. In the press release, the claim the expansion should allow them to reduce wait times.

http://www.beacononlinenews.com/news/daily/4396

Not sure how quickly they'll be able to ramp up their production, but they are expanding.

_Am


theonlyski  (D License)

Feb 3, 2012, 12:32 PM
Post #37 of 39 (814 views)
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Re: [AndyMan] UPT Delivery Time; Anyone want to give up their slot? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:
I agree that they probably don't have any good options to increase production without incuring other negative issues. I'm just in a unique time crunch position and was wondering if anyone wanted to sell their slot.

Actuallyt, UPT has just (in the last month or so) completed construction on the expansion of their factory. In the press release, the claim the expansion should allow them to reduce wait times.

http://www.beacononlinenews.com/news/daily/4396

Not sure how quickly they'll be able to ramp up their production, but they are expanding.

_Am

It's UNDER construction, walls are up, I think they're putting in the framing for the roof at the moment. Not gonna be cranking any rigs out of there for a little while longer.


shattenjager  (C 41561)

Nov 11, 2012, 6:43 PM
Post #38 of 39 (591 views)
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Re: [propilot] UPT Delivery Time; Anyone want to give up their slot? [In reply to] Can't Post

I ordered my Mirage back in June, I got it outside my door in 12 days, and it was held for 3 days waiting for my file to do the custom embroidery!
I loved their customer service and I really like the way my rig fits on me.
I have to say that I tried Mirage G4, Vector 3, Talon Fx, Infinity, Javelin Odissey and Wings while I was renting, I didn't have a particular preference but the G4 was for me the best fit and overall quality, number one choice.
Try before buy, that's my advice. Good luck.


airtwardo  (D License)

Nov 11, 2012, 9:49 PM
Post #39 of 39 (554 views)
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Re: [Krip] UPT Delivery Time; Anyone want to give up their slot? [In reply to] Can't Post

http://www.dropzone.com/...nt;postatt_id=80350;


3 weeks...custom design. Smile

Works great ~ lasts a long time. Cool


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