Mar 20, 2011, 4:23 AM
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Neos / JFX comparison?
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Hi all. I would be interested in opinion of people that both jumped Neos and JFX. Opening/flying comparative characteristics... Which one would be better step up from Crossfire? Thanks.
I'm in exactly the same situation, looking for a successor for my Crossfire. I had the chance to demo a Neos 99 for a week but stopped early. Of 7 jumps, 2 openings were ok, the other 5 were incredibly hard. On the last jump, I heard my neck crack and couldn't move my head without pain for the following 2 days. But I have also heard of people with softer openings, so I guess it all depends. From my point of view, I can certainly not recommend the Neos. Actually a pity because I'm an Icarus fan and liked the flights a lot. From the few jumps I did, I'd say a mix between a Katana and a Velo.
I haven't jumped a JFX yet. I'm looking for a demo but it seems like they will be very rare in Europe for a while. Daedalus will post the dates and locations on their website.
Two reasons: 1. Velo is way too aggressive for me. I`m looking for step up from the xfire and would probably go with the Neos, but random rogue openings are a big issue. JFX is advertised as no-hassle everyday xbraced "for camera work and even for wingsuiting". So I`m interested in opinions of people that jumped both. How much of a step up is JFX over NEOS and/or Xfire...
All - I can offer some limited insight to the Neos. I have about 32 jumps on a demo 99 Neos. Every jump was spectacular and that in-turn prompted me to order a new Neos. Well, after trying to resolve extremely hard openings, let’s just say I no long have the Neos… It’s back in Cisma’s hands. Personally, FAR too many reports of hard openings on the Neos to make it a viable upgrade from XF2
Subsequently, I called “MEL” (skyworks Rigging) and had a lengthy discussion about the JFX. MEL has been jumping (testing) the JFX for more than two years and he told me, and posted here as well, that the JFX was the best all around canopy he’s EVER jumped. He also stated that the JFX was the best opening canopy he’s ever jumped. Now, those statements coming from anyone else wouldn’t necessarily carry weight, but MEL is one of the most respected master riggers/jumpers in the industry. Some of the things relayed to me were; great transition canopy from XF2 (providing you possess the skills to move to a fully x-braced canopy); it’s 7-cell (21) fully cross braced (all the way to the tail) canopy; not built to be the swoop machine a JVX is; deigned to be used as an all-around, every day, every jump canopy. In fact, Tony (from Tony Suits) uses the JFX on his wingsuit jumps and I believe he too has been flying the wing for almost two years. L. Cani has also made some really positive remarks regarding the JFX as well.
If you do a search you can find some decent info on the JFX. Or, email Attila at NZ Aerosports and he’ll give you a good run down. Believe demos will be very scarce.
Two reasons: 1. Velo is way too aggressive for me. I`m looking for step up from the xfire and would probably go with the Neos, but random rogue openings are a big issue. JFX is advertised as no-hassle everyday xbraced "for camera work and even for wingsuiting". So I`m interested in opinions of people that jumped both. How much of a step up is JFX over NEOS and/or Xfire...
2. I`m an Icarus fanboy
Thanks! I didn't really understand where these two canopies fit in relation to the Velo as nobody I know jumps them. That's helps me put a better picture together.
I hope you enjoy whatever you end up with.
Edited to add: Have you considered a Katana? IMO it is a step up from the Crossfire2. Doesn't help you being an Icarus fan though!
(This post was edited by DocPop on Mar 23, 2011, 12:22 PM)
[replyIf you do a search you can find some decent info on the JFX. Or, email Attila at NZ Aerosports and he’ll give you a good run down. Believe demos will be very scarce. There was a discussion here about JFX, but it was more about the "next new Icarus canopy". Still just one video of an opening (that 10k feet snivel), no in-air videos, and more so not so much testimonials except test jumpers. I thought more people jump it by now (and people like you that switched from NEOS).
And we already contacted Attila and we got the price quote
There was a time when I was looking for a smaller canopy for swooping. I was wondering to have a Neos, but I've bought a used Competition Cobalt. By watching you packing video that seems like a good choice. CC opens nice, soft and slow without any kind of packing magic.
I've flown jvx, jfx, and old fx. If you ask me there is nothing tame about fx vs jvx. Fx may open more on heading, but jvx opens just as nice. They fly about the same besides jfx sinks out lots more than the jvx, even at lower wing load, 2.2 jvx vs 2,1 jfx
Can't speak for neos, never flown one, but what i heard was that, neos flys more like katana or velo with steep flight, with very weak rear riser power.
Whats with this hard opening Neos? Just quater the slider and pull front part of it an inch forward, voila no hard openings for probably 400 jumps and I`m a sloppy packer.....I love my Neos openings ;)
Emailed with Tony and he loves his JFX opens better than his Sabre 2. In fact he said its a smashing canopy. All he does is Wingsuit now. I have wondered who would be first to come out with a working mans xbrace. They are a more stable wing in my opinion and if it flys and opens like Tony says my velo will be going away.
Just got my new JFX 87 on Tuesday. Will probably do the first jumps tomorrow. Maybe I can do a video of the opening so we have a better reference than the one that allready exists on Youtube
Price was 2400 USD with black 400 HMA lineset incl. shipping.
(This post was edited by Isenring on May 27, 2011, 8:19 AM)
Just got my new JFX 87 on Tuesday. Will probably do the first jumps tomorrow. Maybe I can do a video from the opening so we have a better reference than the one that allready exists on Youtube
Get that video please. Looking forward to hear your first impressions.
They fly diffrent for sure. Jvx feels like super stilleto and jvx flys like super specter if that makes sense.
Jfx improved alot from a fx, similar flight chracteristics but deeper range on rear riser and way softer openings. And front riser pressure is much manageable compared to a fx.
Flown same sized jvx 94 and jfx 94 and jfx seems like it dives little more with slightly faster turn rate, feels whippier.
I like jvx over jfx, opening isn't so much worse but yet feeling of gliding thru the sky is much more enjoyable then feeling like im sitting on escalator. They fly at same speed, if you are ready for jfx then you are ready fly jvx. They will both kill you if you turn low.
1 Jump: Jumped from 3900, pulled on 2500m (no camera) Perfect onheading opening not too slow and not too fast. Found it twitchier than my Velocity 90 for harness, backrisder and toggle imput. Frontriser pression was less than my Velo 90. I love this quick response on harness input.
First swoop of course much too high
2nd Jump: More or less jump and pull from 1500m. GoPro mounted to foot. I sticked my leg with the camera to the front to video the opening (usually a stupid idea), but the canopy still opened nearly extactly on heading. I was really surprised.
2nd swoop of too high again (of course).
Had to leave for other appointments and left my rig at the dropzone for some others to test. They were all amazed about it. Think Attila will soon get some new orders ;-). My canopy seems to have became a demo canopy
Well this opening was for sure quicker than the other one (on you tube) Still, a bit faster than my xfire. Thanks for the vid, and the info. Post some more when you get to it. Cheers
Here a small review about my impression on the first couple of jumps on a brand new JFX (unfortunately not my own). The size of the canopy was 87 with a wingload between 2.1 and 2.2.
Openings: All openings were smooth and completely on heading without any inputs on back risers. The openings are faster compared to a Velocity or Katana, but still soft. An the best, it’s not necessary to do something special by packing the parachute
Flight characteristics: At first I was surprised about the quick response on harness inputs (much faster than that of a Velocity on the same size). After a few jumps I started to love this feature. The front riser pressure is comfortable and not so high than that of a Velocity. Ok, I’m used to the pressure of a Katana, so for me it’s still high enough.
Summary: Awesome canopy with perfect openings, quick response, long recovery arc and great landing performance. It’s exactly what I’m looking for (I already ordered my own one) Maybe it’s not the ultimate swooping machine like a JVX or competition Velo, but it’s still possible to do some nice and long swoops. In my opinion the best all-round canopy that is available.
I’m looking forward to posts from other people flying a JFX which are willing to share their experience...
Thanks for the info dude Still, anybody knows how it compares to Neos? Just to know what could be expected? I did half a dozen jumps last weekend on friend`s Neos 104 (at WL2.2), which had much steeper glide than my Xfire, but on rears or brakes would still cover lots of ground. Much more responsive on harness input, much more speed and it had ton of flare. I could not bring smile of my face for the rest of the day. But also, IMO, it had funky openings from terminal which is a bit of a turn off.
You must have been kidding. A Pilot or Sabre2 can be an all around canopy, but not a cross braced small pocket rocket like JFX.
However..we are talking about high performance canopies. That's obviously not for everybody like a Pilot or Sabre2. If we just compare high performance canopies, a JFX is in my opinion a great all-round canopy.
...although from the video, it looks as if there isn't much bottom end and the wing loses lift quicky in the plane out - or is that not a fair assessment?
...although from the video, it looks as if there isn't much bottom end and the wing loses lift quicky in the plane out - or is that not a fair assessment?
From the video, yea. But I'm guessing that it's the pilot, not the canopy. He's snapping his whole turn pretty fast and letting off the controls equally as fast. And you can't tell if there's any harness input either.
V hard for me to assess from a POV let alone critique. Turns/approach looked varied. The video didn't demonstrate the canopies flight range purely because it was pieced together from a combination of openings, snappy toggle turns and of course landings. Maybe some braked flight in proximity with another canopy like a larger sabre2 would be nice way to show case slow flight capability etc. To the original poster of the video thanks again looking forward to seeing more.
During my work as an instructor I`m jumping my JFX 87 since 2 months. Do not compare the JFX with canopies like a Sabre! The JFX has the performance of a Velocity with openings of a Crossfire, always on heading. But it is very responsive to harness inputs, so it is really a high performance canopy. In my opinion the JFX is a revolution in the cross braced canopy class.
(This post was edited by verticalhispeed on Aug 29, 2011, 1:24 PM)
sinking out more??? thru the flight and the turn?? compare to jvx.
how else am i gonna explain???
ie, katana sinks out more than crossfire.
by the way I'm hoping that you have more than 400 jumps to be jumping jfx.
jfx feels like to me most worthless canopy out there. Jvx cost the same and flight is much better, if you prefer sinking 7 cell Comp Velo is way superior canopy. and if one worrys about the opening so much they shouldn't be jumping cross brace.
The only reason that Im worried about the poenings is that I have quite a few ruptured discs. Xfire openings are fine I just dont want a caqnopy that will snap open and the JFX seems fine in the poenind dept as far as I have read. I dont have the skill level to be jumping a VX or JVX and velos can open hard if you dont wash all you speed from a track as I understand. Thanks stay high
That being said ... when you have a few more jumps, try a Xaos21. No, it isn't a new design and it won't win any swoop comps these days. But it is still a great canopy.
Are you getting everything you can out of the xfire?
(This post was edited by craigbey on Oct 12, 2011, 7:05 AM)
That being said ... try a Xaos21. No, it isn't a new design and it won't win any swoop comps these days. But it is still a great canopy.
Interesting, anybody know how the JFX compares to the Xaos 21? I have about 500 jumps on a sweet old FX. It opens a little too hard for me at terminal but I like everything else about it. I don't have a need for the better glide of the 27 cells yet.
What do you mean when you say the JFX sinks out? Im thinking about getting a JFX WL 1.8 to upgrade from my xfire 139 WL 1.6
I think he just means the canopy descends more quickly. TBH, you shouldn't even be jumping that Crossfire / WL combo if you only have <400 jumps, much less a JFX. You really shouldn't even think about that class of canopy until you are an expert and extremely current canopy pilot.
(This post was edited by LetsGoOutside on Oct 12, 2011, 12:17 PM)
The only reason that Im worried about the poenings is that I have quite a few ruptured discs.
Have you considered what would happen to your back if you were to impact the ground hard from, say, flying a fast, high performance canopy at a WL waaaay beyond the recommendations for your jump numbers?
I'd venture to say that the effects would be worse than all but the most horrendous of openings. Something to think about, huh?
Just curious, what do you mean by sinks out? I have a few more hundred jumps to do on my xfire but will concider a JFX when I have the skillsdaleskydive@yahoo.com.au Cheers Shakey
