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skyjack71

Apr 7, 2013, 10:50 PM
Post #42226 of 52703 (18645 views)
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Re: [georger] Hold Dem Horses.. [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:

Did Duane ever attempt to forge US currency and do
you have any of it?

We could compare his $20 with Ingram's and the FBI's money.

SlyLaughLaughLaugh
The only thing Duane ever forged was a name on a check or a charge card - evidently since he supposedly was ONLY a thief who robbed hotels, motels, military wives in Bars with their Gov cks! Bar Pick-ups is what I call them and they got what they deserved for running around on their military husbands.

I do NOT justify the actions of Weber and I have NEVER been told the extent of the crimes he committed. Wonder WHY?

Where are the records and did he have court trials or just appear infront of a judge because he was Bad Conduct discharge and Undesirable. IF Weber had NOT gotten a BAD deal to begin with - he might have been able to have made something out of himself early on. He actually had what it took - as he did prove to himself much later in life....I think he had a lot of good guys on his side at times. Such as our old friend.

What the hell could he have done had he received the breaks they give kids today?


georger

Apr 7, 2013, 10:58 PM
Post #42227 of 52703 (18638 views)
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Re: [RobertMBlevins] Hold Dem Horses.. [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Georger says in part:

Quote:
'If a plant, why not a forgery too! Blevins
expansion theory no. 464548464447456

Vicki's Dad!

The short dark stranger who knew KC and Geestman.
The Clydesdale trainer.

Yakety Yak and all that Jack.

This adds another FBI screwup Blevins can advertise.
FBI failed to examine the money for being a forgery!
Whoopteedoo! Here we go again....'

I see from your recent posts you've been hard at work contributing in a positive way to the discussion.

Well, sort of. Crazy

Well, you doth protest too much!

The theory is tailor made for you - even Jo thought so.
See Jo Weber reply. The theory is easily as good as
any theory you have ever come up with, on any subject
here.

Moreover, it's exactly the type of theory you would up
with.

Don't protest if your own theory making technique
comes up and greets you, unexpectedly, in print. Ten
days ago you would have been arguing the same
lines, except I came up with it first, modeling you.

Keep in mind Blevins, I am only one of your "wage
earner sheeple". I had a stroke of brilliance.

Don't be jealous! Yakety yak don't talk back. A year
from now you will be claiming the theory was yours.

How's your Titanic revisionist makeover going?

ShockedLaughLaugh


(This post was edited by georger on Apr 7, 2013, 11:04 PM)


georger

Apr 7, 2013, 11:01 PM
Post #42228 of 52703 (18635 views)
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Re: [skyjack71] Hold Dem Horses.. [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:

Did Duane ever attempt to forge US currency and do
you have any of it?

We could compare his $20 with Ingram's and the FBI's money.

SlyLaughLaughLaugh
The only thing Duane ever forged was a name on a check or a charge card - evidently since he supposedly was ONLY a thief who robbed hotels, motels, military wives in Bars with their Gov cks! Bar Pick-ups is what I call them and they got what they deserved for running around on their military husbands.

I do NOT justify the actions of Weber and I have NEVER been told the extent of the crimes he committed. Wonder WHY?

Where are the records and did he have court trials or just appear infront of a judge because he was Bad Conduct discharge and Undesirable. IF Weber had NOT gotten a BAD deal to begin with - he might have been able to have made something out of himself early on. He actually had what it took - as he did prove to himself much later in life....I think he had a lot of good guys on his side at times. Such as our old friend.

What the hell could he have done had he received the breaks they give kids today?

Of course Duane never thought about or tried to forge
money.

Blevins would have said it first if he had thought of it!
I'll bet he's thinking about it now. He knows a
plant when he sees one CrazyLaughLaugh


(This post was edited by georger on Apr 7, 2013, 11:07 PM)


RobertMBlevins

Apr 7, 2013, 11:27 PM
Post #42229 of 52703 (18618 views)
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Re: [georger] Hold Dem Horses.. [In reply to] Can't Post

Georger says in part:

Quote:
'Some people including myself take voluntary time
outs here, sometimes of several weeks or more,
just to get away from the monotony here, and collect
our senses and thoughts...'

It would be better if you just got it together enough to contribute to the discussion positively in the present.

Lately it's been mostly THIS.


MeyerLouie

Apr 7, 2013, 11:30 PM
Post #42230 of 52703 (18616 views)
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Re: [RobertMBlevins] Hold Dem Horses.. [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Meyer Louie says in part:

Quote:
'The money fell out of the sky to that location: it must have been some fierce wind on the jump then, to cause all those bills to get so tattered and worn. Maybe the actual impact of the money bag caused that blackened, oval-shape, tattered-look on all of them thar bills...'

Hold on thar, pardner. I didn't say the money fell out of the sky. I said it can't be proven HOW the money arrived at Tena Bar.

__________________________________________________

Bullshit, Blevins. Read your own words! You said it was possible the money fell out of the sky or it was a plant.

You said: "The money does NOT, because it cannot be established for certain that this money fell out of the sky to that location. You cannot say that without being able to prove that's how it arrived there. It could have been a plant. Either is possible."

How does that jive with "I didn't say the money fell out of the sky. I said it can't be proven HOW the money arrived at Tena Bar."


Here comes some more of your double talk, Blevins:


If you discount dredging and washdown, I pointed out this leaves only two possibilities:

1) Fell from the sky on the way down.

2) Planted by human hands.

You are way off-base here and obviously didn't see some of my previous posts on this.

_________________________________________________

You're way off base, thar pardner. You can't even keep consistent in your current posts! Unbelievable!

MeyerLouie
_________________________________________________


Concerning number one possibility, (fell from sky) I think you can discount the idea of loose bill packets. This is because at least three bundles of the cash were found in the same spot. So this would mean the entire bag had to land somewhere in the vicinity, and the only thing remaining by 1980, somehow or other, were the loose packets found. But this also begs the question on WHY nothing else was found. Again...no parachutes, briefcase, body, other money, money bag, clothing scraps, paracord pieces, NOTHING. Why is that? I speculated that maybe Cooper went into the river separated from the bag and the bag ended up on land, while he did the Big Splash.

On the second possibility, Planting: We know Cooper offered a portion of the money to Mucklow, so that negates the idea he might be unwilling to part with some of the money to throw off the cops.

Maybe it's a plant. But there is no proof of that, either. How could you prove it was a plant beyond a reasonable doubt? Well...I gave one scenario, and that was if someone finds a piece of evidence AWAY from the where the money was found. Like the parachute, or the briefcase, or anything that can be definitively, without question, linked to the hijacker. Say in the Ariel, Amboy, or Merwin Lake area. Or even further south, as some believe, as long as it wasn't west of the interstate. In this event, it would be absolutely impossible for the Tena Bar money to be attributed to a fall, or to have arrived at its location by accident. In other words, it would certainly be a plant.

The real trouble with all of this is the lack of additional evidence, both at Tena Bar, and anywhere else Cooper might have landed. You have the placard falling off a plane along the flight path. You have the Tena Bar money found a full FIVE MILES to the west of Interstate 5, and most sources agree that the flight path of the jet was NOT west of Interstate 5?

So how do you reconcile these things? Well, some have suggested the official report of the flight path is wrong. Fine. I say prove it. Tom Kaye and his team seem to believe the flight path is correct. The truth is, you can't reconcile it unless new evidence emerges, and that evidence would probably take one of two forms:

A) Flight path is proven INCORRECT, and 305 was actually WEST of Interstate 5 at the time of Cooper's jump.

B) An additional piece of evidence is found that can be linked to Cooper, either near Tena Bar, or close to the 'official' flight path. It would actually be better, in my opinion, to find something along the flight path, because this would answer two questions at the same time, i.e. whether Cooper survived, and whether the money was a plant.

Example: Someone discovers the briefcase in the woods in the Ariel/Amboy area. Extrapolation you can obtain from this evidence:

1) The money on Tena Bar was a plant.
2) Cooper survived the jump, since you need a live person to do a plant.

Without any additional evidence, the Tena Bar money remains a mystery. That's my opinion on it, anyway. One more key is needed to open the information vault, as it were. That key has not yet been discovered. One bright spot: Robert99 and MrShutter are researching the flight path, and I am interested to see what their results turn out to be.

_________________________________________________

Like I said earlier, not having a whole to say doesn't usually keep you from talking. Would've, could've, may have if new evidence is found. New evidence has not been found, and I'm sure when new evidence is found, there will others more qualified than you to analyze it.

MeyerLouie



MeyerLouie

Apr 7, 2013, 11:33 PM
Post #42231 of 52703 (18609 views)
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Re: [mrshutter45] Hold Dem Horses.. [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:
I'm attaching some completely unscientific maps showing a rough demo on what the problem is with the Tena Bar money.

Basically, the placard and the available data shows the plane was headed probably SSE as it passed over the Merwin Lake area. For the flight to end up west of Interstate 5 by more than four miles, the flight would have to take a pretty good turn to the west...and then later back to SSE to continue on to Reno.

As I said...totally unscientific. But it does give a general picture of what I mean.

MrShutter: Bill Rataczak has stated several times that they know WHEN Cooper jumped, they just don't know where he landed.

"SSE as it passed over the Merwin Lake area"

you need to look at the flight path again!
Rataczak stated he knows when Cooper jumped. we have a time frame and a questionable path.
they base it on the time frames of the path and when the pilot reported the pressure bump. they
think they have the area where he jumped, only if the path is correct. if the path is incorrect, then
when he jumped doesn't matter does it?

your map is a very bad example....sorry.

__________________________________________________

That map is about as unscientific and bad as it gets. Maybe Blevins, just maybe, it might be better to try to be a bit more rigorous in you analysis and conclusions. Geeez!

MeyerLouie



airtwardo  (D License)

Apr 7, 2013, 11:43 PM
Post #42232 of 52703 (18604 views)
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Re: [georger] Hold Dem Horses.. [In reply to] Can't Post

 
You obsession is creepy and disturbing - seek help, seriously...something unhealthy going on there. Crazy


georger

Apr 7, 2013, 11:46 PM
Post #42233 of 52703 (18604 views)
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Re: [MeyerLouie] Hold Dem Horses.. [In reply to] Can't Post

 


Here comes some more of your double talk, Blevins:

MeyerLouie
That pretty much covers it. Add the arrogance +
hostility + venom and ..... well, what he wants is a
free ride and about 10 people leaving Dropzone to
have it all to himself as another Newsvine. It
probably will never work out that way.. at some point
even Airtwardo would get ancy and growl ..

Two other aspects drive me nuts!

#1: he literally cannot stand other good options being
offered. He immediately goes on the attack. This
indicates both a lack of intelligence AND some kind of
"I'm running this forum" mentality.

He poo-hooed "ppd" last night. Then he is told the
owner and Moderator control that (collection of stats).
He went stone silent! He compared "ppd" to "catshit"
but when told the owner and mods of this site collect
that "catshit", he went stone silent. He has no
hesitation about offending-attacking posters, but he
won;t knowingly offend-attack a Mod or the owner.
I thought all of that was pretty funny! Laugh

#2. It doesn't seem to be "in" the poster to be
creative at all. Moreover he clearly envies and has a
dislike of other who are creative, or can be. The
poster does not trust them, he has said!

#3 His repetitions of the same material over and
over have become his archetype and flag.

He then attacks me for not posting NEW material.

Send me a nice check Blevins and I will give you some NEW factual material. LaughLaughLaugh


(This post was edited by georger on Apr 7, 2013, 11:50 PM)


georger

Apr 7, 2013, 11:48 PM
Post #42234 of 52703 (18602 views)
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Re: [airtwardo] Hold Dem Horses.. [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
You obsession is creepy and disturbing - seek help, seriously...something unhealthy going on there. Crazy

OK my good man.

I think in English it should be: "Your" obsession, not
"You obsession", unless you are calling me a name ?


(This post was edited by georger on Apr 7, 2013, 11:57 PM)


RobertMBlevins

Apr 7, 2013, 11:54 PM
Post #42235 of 52703 (18597 views)
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Re: [MeyerLouie] Hold Dem Horses.. [In reply to] Can't Post

Nice cherry-picking on my post there. I said that the placard DID help establish the flight path of the jet, but that the money found at Tena Bar does not necessarily do the same.

Why: Because it's reasonable to assume the placard flew off after the stairs were opened, but you can't say the same for the Tena Bar money. So...you can't establish for certain how the money ended up there, especially with the official flight path, which is five miles or so EAST of Interstate 5 in the Tena Bar area.

That little map I made with the arrows doesn't matter. The point is that the flight path currently goes east of the Interstate. (Tena Bar, of course, is WEST of the freeway) Unless the radar plots are inaccurate, and that has not been proven.

There is nothing wrong with saying that a third piece of evidence would help a lot. Anything solid that can be linked definitively to the hijacker might reveal much, especially if it were found EAST of the freeway and north of the Columbia River. See previous posts on why.

Robert99 and Shutter are working on this, but until then I go with the official version of the radar map. No one has disproven it to date. This means that unless Cooper went into the Columbia at Portland, there is no way to say that the money ended up on Tena Bar because Cooper jumped over or near Tena Bar. It remains to be seen whether Robert99 and Shutter can shed some light on the flight path. But they have a tough job going up against all those people at NWA and elsewhere who were working long hours (I would think) to figure out where the hijacker was. Don't assume they were stupid, although they could have made mistakes. But the catch is...you have to PROVE they made mistakes.

In order to establish that, (possible mistakes) you need EVIDENCE of same.

Until then, if we discount washdown and dredging then my vote goes to Went Into the Columbia and Money Traveled Downstream, or It Was a Plant. Which one is it? I haven't a clue at this point.

I would call that a straightforward response, not 'double-talk'.


(This post was edited by RobertMBlevins on Apr 8, 2013, 12:02 AM)


georger

Apr 8, 2013, 12:02 AM
Post #42236 of 52703 (18589 views)
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Re: [RobertMBlevins] Hold Dem Horses.. [In reply to] Can't Post

 I go with the official version of the radar map. .
Then why do you accept the FBI's map, but do not accept
the FBI's word on the Amboy parachute?

Meyer said you cherry-pick. Isnt that an example of
cherry-picking?

You literally have no more proof of the map than you
do the parachute! And yet you accept the map for
some reason, but not the parachute.

How do you decide between the two?

You believe the FBI on the map, but not on the
parachute.

Pirate

And WHY do you keep making the same exact posts
about these matters over and over ad nauseum?
We aren't stupid with no memory!


(This post was edited by georger on Apr 8, 2013, 12:05 AM)


MeyerLouie

Apr 8, 2013, 12:03 AM
Post #42237 of 52703 (18585 views)
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Re: [RobertMBlevins] Hold Dem Horses.. [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:
Robert99 wrote
Quote:
Basically, the money find indicates that it was in the bag and tied to Cooper on ground contact (cratered would be a better word).

I prefer a more optimistic interpretation. No crater. DBC lands alive and escapes.

A cratered jumper would probably have been found by now. Georger made a convincing presentation about how unlikely a river landing would have been.

Unfortunately my Cooper twenty has no clues as to vertical speed at the time of landing. It just stares at me and says nothing. Maybe Bruce could conjur up its past but I can't.

377

Not a joke: Ever thought about letting a psychic take a look at the bill? I never believed in psychics until I met a lady named Mary down in Vancouver. She could find lost keys, anything I hid from her, she found right away. The bad part was when she would take hold of your hand. You couldn't keep any secrets from the old bi#*ch. No kidding. Smile

I asked her once how long I was going to live. This was back in 1982. She says: "You will live long enough to see people landing on Mars..." I never told her I wrote sci-fi, either. I got the idea that was going to be about it, too. Unimpressed Now I hope they don't go for a while yet. I'd give you her address, but she died some years ago.

__________________________________________________

Blevins, go ahead give us her address. Afterall, she's psychic, so she should still be able to communicate with us from where she currently is.

A psychic, Blevins? It's amazing you told us you consulted a psychic in the first place. Even more amazing, you told us, the whole world, the many revelations she imparted to you. I'd say Blevins...and I don't think I'm going out on a limb here.... simply put, that's TMI -- too much information.

Have you completely gone off your rocker? You're aware this is a professional forum, not one where you come to check your horoscope, get your palms read (vs. red), and consult a psychic.

I have a suggestion: Google on 'psychics.' I'm sure there are plenty of chat rooms and web sites on the subject. Go to their forums, share your happy horseshit. Doing that here only makes you look more foolish and less credible than you already are.

MeyerLouie


georger

Apr 8, 2013, 12:07 AM
Post #42238 of 52703 (18581 views)
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Re: [MeyerLouie] Hold Dem Horses.. [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:
In reply to:
Robert99 wrote
Quote:
Basically, the money find indicates that it was in the bag and tied to Cooper on ground contact (cratered would be a better word).

I prefer a more optimistic interpretation. No crater. DBC lands alive and escapes.

A cratered jumper would probably have been found by now. Georger made a convincing presentation about how unlikely a river landing would have been.

Unfortunately my Cooper twenty has no clues as to vertical speed at the time of landing. It just stares at me and says nothing. Maybe Bruce could conjur up its past but I can't.

377

Not a joke: Ever thought about letting a psychic take a look at the bill? I never believed in psychics until I met a lady named Mary down in Vancouver. She could find lost keys, anything I hid from her, she found right away. The bad part was when she would take hold of your hand. You couldn't keep any secrets from the old bi#*ch. No kidding. Smile

I asked her once how long I was going to live. This was back in 1982. She says: "You will live long enough to see people landing on Mars..." I never told her I wrote sci-fi, either. I got the idea that was going to be about it, too. Unimpressed Now I hope they don't go for a while yet. I'd give you her address, but she died some years ago.

__________________________________________________

Blevins, go ahead give us her address. Afterall, she's psychic, so she should still be able to communicate with us from where she currently is.

A psychic, Blevins? It's amazing you told us you consulted a psychic in the first place. Even more amazing, you told us, the whole world, the many revelations she imparted to you. I'd say Blevins...and I don't think I'm going out on a limb here.... simply put, that's TMI -- too much information.

Have you completely gone off your rocker? You're aware this is a professional forum, not one where you come to check your horoscope, get your palms read (vs. red), and consult a psychic.

I have a suggestion: Google on 'psychics.' I'm sure there are plenty of chat rooms and web sites on the subject. Go to their forums, share your happy horseshit. Doing that here only makes you look more foolish and less credible than you already are.

MeyerLouie

I wonder what this means?
CrazyLaughLaughLaugh


(This post was edited by georger on Apr 8, 2013, 12:38 AM)


airtwardo  (D License)

Apr 8, 2013, 12:08 AM
Post #42239 of 52703 (18572 views)
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Re: [georger] Hold Dem Horses.. [In reply to] Can't Post

Laugh


RobertMBlevins

Apr 8, 2013, 12:47 AM
Post #42240 of 52703 (18556 views)
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Re: [airtwardo] Hold Dem Horses.. [In reply to] Can't Post

Oh, I trust science to a certain degree. Especially on the good things. Like Pasteur or Fleming.

Inventing the atom bomb, that's another story.

As far as Mary, my very good friend the psychic, she was the mother of my then-girlfriend in Vancouver. And my girlfriend and I rented a big house there back in the early 80's. Mom dropped by sometimes and then it got interesting. I would play games and test her. She always won. My girlfriend was a former model and we had a lot of fun during our time together. I don't regret a moment of it.

Never apologize for your past unless there's a reason.

Just go with it as long as it isn't evil. Smile


(This post was edited by RobertMBlevins on Apr 8, 2013, 12:48 AM)


MeyerLouie

Apr 8, 2013, 3:21 AM
Post #42241 of 52703 (18548 views)
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Re: [RobertMBlevins] Hold Dem Horses.. [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Oh, I trust science to a certain degree. Especially on the good things. Like Pasteur or Fleming.

Inventing the atom bomb, that's another story.

As far as Mary, my very good friend the psychic, she was the mother of my then-girlfriend in Vancouver. And my girlfriend and I rented a big house there back in the early 80's. Mom dropped by sometimes and then it got interesting. I would play games and test her. She always won. My girlfriend was a former model and we had a lot of fun during our time together. I don't regret a moment of it.

Never apologize for your past unless there's a reason.

Just go with it as long as it isn't evil. Smile

__________________________________________________

Blevins, the more you talk, the more you are making a total fool of yourself. It's too much information! Stop already! Who cares? You take up almost 25% of the air time on this forum, so much of it on irrelevant, ridiculous, non-DB Cooper, who-gives-a-shit kind of information like this post.

However, since you brought it up -- most secure guys don't talk about the models they used to date or dare mention to the world the psychics they used to consult (however, her daughter was a model, so I'm bettin' Mary was a looker too, maybe even moreso than Marla....I always hated when that happened -- I didn't who was hotter or who I was more attracted to -- the daughter or the mother).

Why don't you quit while you're way behind? You've reached a new low, Blevins. I thought it wasn't possible, but here you are.

MeyerLouie


mrshutter45

Apr 8, 2013, 3:59 AM
Post #42242 of 52703 (18539 views)
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Re: [MeyerLouie] Hold Dem Horses.. [In reply to] Can't Post

Amazing mind reader reveals his 'gift'

http://www.youtube.com/...ed&v=F7pYHN9iC9I


mrshutter45

Apr 8, 2013, 5:39 AM
Post #42243 of 52703 (18529 views)
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Re: [RobertMBlevins] Hold Dem Horses.. [In reply to] Can't Post

"Robert99 and Shutter are working on this,"

you are leaving a key person out of this. Hominid.

" Don't assume they were stupid, although they could have made mistakes."

do me a favor and look at the flight path time frames, now look at
the 20:03 position and then what time frame follows that? we have
known "mistakes" already on the map.

nobody is claiming that anyone is stupid. this project is not designed to make
anyone look stupid.

****************READ CAREFULLY****************

I have a flight simulator that has been tested in the following manor.

#1 I ran tests on the altitude and it passed.
#2 I ran tests on distances and it passed.
#3 Hominid put me thru a series of speed tests. it passed.
#4 I ran tests on how the plane reacts to different flap settings. gear up/gear down.


I have been able to take the 727-100 up to 7,000 at a speed of 160 KIAS
with flaps at 30 degree's & gear down having a fuel flow of 4500 to 4800

10,000 at a speed of about 175 KIAS flaps at 15, head wind of 24 knots &
fuel flow of about 4300.

after reading information Robert99 gave me, I ran another test to the maylay
intersection, it read 63 NM (doesn't show 63.5)

I have the best known weather system which will input winds aloft,
interpolation, direction, temps, barometrics, wind shear,turbulence etc. etc.

it appears to me that I have a system well enough to fly the path with the
known information I have. the project is designed to see if the path can be
flown the way they present it. if it can not be flown this way, we have the
first step in resolving the problems. it's designed to try and verify, not to
make someone look stupid!

"don't assume they were stupid" is certainly a factor several posters need
to understand about the FBI.........Cool


JerryThomas

Apr 8, 2013, 5:45 AM
Post #42244 of 52703 (18527 views)
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Re: MeyerLouie [In reply to] Can't Post

MeyerLouie. The money found at Tinas bar was not a plant it is a well known fact that it floated there. Clarity Time: Sorry its taken so long to get back to dropzone. The search area that I wish to consentrate on is the Washougal water shed.Remember the Army Corps of Engineers had determined that the money path to tinas bar was by floating down one of the washougal tributaries to the columbia river.I was contacted last night by a producer from london that wishes to do a documentary this summer during a search, all of you that wish to join are welcome.What the actual search will be for is the chute.Those of you that have experience in the woods will be a valuable asset. Especially those with search and rescue experience.Georger I will also need your assistance.ML you Bruce, Georger and Blevins please try and contact me today and I'll fill you in. Jo as it apears that the only reason you are on dropzone is for the attention Im mentioning you in this post so you won't feel left out. Jo please stop telling the lie that I mis led you or lied to you in any way you no I haven't. Jerry PS Amazon my prayers are with you.


georger

Apr 8, 2013, 8:13 AM
Post #42245 of 52703 (18491 views)
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Re: [RobertMBlevins] Hold Dem Horses.. [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Oh, I trust science to a certain degree. Especially on the good things. Like Pasteur or Fleming.

Inventing the atom bomb, that's another story.

As far as Mary, my very good friend the psychic, she was the mother of my then-girlfriend in Vancouver. And my girlfriend and I rented a big house there back in the early 80's. Mom dropped by sometimes and then it got interesting. I would play games and test her. She always won. My girlfriend was a former model and we had a lot of fun during our time together. I don't regret a moment of it.

Never apologize for your past unless there's a reason.

Just go with it as long as it isn't evil. Smile

Oh really! ? The Great Blevini ! Unsure

Mm. Mmmm mm. Mmmm mmmmmmmb, mm.

What am I saying ?

Are you on a Magician-Psychik Watch List?

My girlfriend was a former model too! 1934 Ford.


(This post was edited by georger on Apr 8, 2013, 8:46 AM)


Robert99

Apr 8, 2013, 10:36 AM
Post #42246 of 52703 (18461 views)
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Re: [RobertMBlevins] BLEVINS, CHECK YOUR LOGIC [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
I said that the placard DID help establish the flight path of the jet, but that the money found at Tena Bar does not necessarily do the same.

Why: Because it's reasonable to assume the placard flew off after the stairs were opened, but you can't say the same for the Tena Bar money.

Blevins, If the money didn't separate from the aircraft AFTER the stairs were opened, then please explain to the rest of us bozos how it separated from the aircraft BEFORE the stairs were opened. Or did it separate from the aircraft at all?

Also, glad that you got a laugh out of the take off time question, but that time would be very useful in determining the flight path.

Robert99


377  (F 666)

Apr 8, 2013, 11:04 AM
Post #42247 of 52703 (18456 views)
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Re: [mrshutter45] Hold Dem Horses.. [In reply to] Can't Post

Quote:
I have a flight simulator that has been tested in the following manor.

#1 I ran tests on the altitude and it passed.
#2 I ran tests on distances and it passed.
#3 Hominid put me thru a series of speed tests. it passed.
#4 I ran tests on how the plane reacts to different flap settings. gear up/gear down.


I have been able to take the 727-100 up to 7,000 at a speed of 160 KIAS
with flaps at 30 degree's & gear down having a fuel flow of 4500 to 4800

10,000 at a speed of about 175 KIAS flaps at 15, head wind of 24 knots &
fuel flow of about 4300.

after reading information Robert99 gave me, I ran another test to the maylay
intersection, it read 63 NM (doesn't show 63.5)

I have the best known weather system which will input winds aloft,
interpolation, direction, temps, barometrics, wind shear,turbulence etc. etc.

it appears to me that I have a system well enough to fly the path with the
known information I have. the project is designed to see if the path can be
flown the way they present it. if it can not be flown this way, we have the
first step in resolving the problems. it's designed to try and verify, not to
make someone look stupid!

Really appreciate your work on this Mr. Shutter. Static Line Intreractive has a pretty good canopy flight simulator. I wonder if you could incorporate a simple drift model for a canopy into your flight sim? Or run one separately using starting points on your flight path? You could try different opening altitudes, estimated rate of descent for a C9 or similar round canopy with no steering vents. To the extent you have good winds aloft data, you could get a range of landing areas. You could also estimate where a no pull DBC might have impacted.

Wouldnt it be a hoot if the Tena Bar money was counterfeit? I don't think it is but I had never even considered the possibility.

I hope it isnt counterfeit. Buying a Cooper twenty is foolish enough but paying big bucks for a fake would be embarassing. [;)

377


(This post was edited by 377 on Apr 8, 2013, 11:22 AM)


Robert99

Apr 8, 2013, 12:04 PM
Post #42248 of 52703 (18448 views)
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Re: [377] DBC NO PULL [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
You could also estimate where a no pull DBC might have impacted.

377

For a no pull situation from 10,000 ASL, and with the winds aloft that existed in the Portland area for the night of the hijacking, and assuming the airliner was in stable flight when he separated, DBC would travel not more than about 2500 feet down the airliner track and not more than about 1000 feet perpendicular to the airliner track.

He would be on the ground in about 40 seconds for a stable head down position for the fall. If tumbling, which is more likely, he would be on the ground in not more than 60 seconds.

From the above, and assuming he had the money bag tied to him all the way down, Cooper could have been over or on the west side of the Columbia River in the Tena Bar area when he separated from the airliner.

Robert99


mrshutter45

Apr 8, 2013, 1:02 PM
Post #42249 of 52703 (18440 views)
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Re: [377] Hold Dem Horses.. [In reply to] Can't Post

Thanks 377, Microsoft has a jump simulator you can put into the system. I don't know how accurate it is though.....Cool

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x7Tsofl7bls


RobertMBlevins

Apr 8, 2013, 4:03 PM
Post #42250 of 52703 (18409 views)
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Re: [Robert99] BLEVINS, CHECK YOUR LOGIC [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:
I said that the placard DID help establish the flight path of the jet, but that the money found at Tena Bar does not necessarily do the same.

Why: Because it's reasonable to assume the placard flew off after the stairs were opened, but you can't say the same for the Tena Bar money.

Blevins, If the money didn't separate from the aircraft AFTER the stairs were opened, then please explain to the rest of us bozos how it separated from the aircraft BEFORE the stairs were opened. Or did it separate from the aircraft at all?

Also, glad that you got a laugh out of the take off time question, but that time would be very useful in determining the flight path.

Robert99

Hmm...the placard probably flew off the jet on its own accord I would imagine. Of course, there's a possibility that Cooper ripped it loose and tossed it out for some reason or another. On the money...since the 'official' flight map runs miles east of where the money was discovered, (feel like I keep explaining the same thing) there are just three ways it could have ended up at Tena Bar. (If you discount washdown or dredging)

1) Flight path is wrong and Cooper landed in Tena Bar area. In this case, it's either a plant, or the remains of the money bag with nothing else found.

2) Cooper went into Columbia at Portland, money bag ended up at Tena Bar somehow.

3) Money is a plant.

I think the possibility that the bundles somehow came loose on the way down and fell separately is unlikely. Reason being that if this happened, it's also unlikely so much of the money would have ended up in the same spot.

None of those scenarios can yet be proven. This is why I said a third piece of evidence being discovered would be a good thing. For example, if the parachute or some of its remains were found. (And this does NOT necessarily mean the Amboy chute) Or the briefcase maybe. If one of those items were discovered EAST of the Interstate 5 freeway, it could say a lot on what happened, depending on the location found. For example...if anything is found in the Ariel/Amboy area, or away from any rivers. This might point to a plant.

Too many questions...not enought evidence. Tena Bar is a great big headache with few frickin' answers. Good luck to you and Shutter on your research regarding the flight path. Due to the lack of this third piece of evidence, I think you guys have the best shot at discovering anything new. Smile

Robert99 says in part:

Quote:
'For a no pull situation from 10,000 ASL, and with the winds aloft that existed in the Portland area for the night of the hijacking, and assuming the airliner was in stable flight when he separated, DBC would travel not more than about 2500 feet down the airliner track and not more than about 1000 feet perpendicular to the airliner track.

He would be on the ground in about 40 seconds for a stable head down position for the fall. If tumbling, which is more likely, he would be on the ground in not more than 60 seconds.

From the above, and assuming he had the money bag tied to him all the way down, Cooper could have been over or on the west side of the Columbia River in the Tena Bar area when he separated from the airliner...'

This sounds doubtful unless the flight path map is way off, you know. Map shows that at 20:12, the airliner made its closest pre-Portland appraoch of the Columbia, and that is five nautical miles. After that point, it was actually moving AWAY from the river, until it crossed over the river near Portland...see attached map.

One thing that has occurred to me lately: I questioned the FBI's results on the Amboy chute not because I thought they were wrong about it...but because of the way it was handled. But let's assume they are right for a moment and it wasn't Cooper's. Maybe they were looking for Cooper in the wrong place all the time. Maybe it WAS a bit south and closer to Battleground/Orchards area. I think someone needs to speak to Bill Rataczak. For those who don't know, Rataczak has been researching the case over the years, too. He told Porteous something about this when Porteous interviewed him. So...you would figure by now he has his own map with a mark on it that says 'Cooper jumped HERE'.


(This post was edited by RobertMBlevins on Apr 8, 2013, 4:34 PM)
Attachments: flightpathoneblowup.jpg (438 KB)
  Moneyflightblowup.jpg (162 KB)


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