Forums: Skydiving: Skydiving History & Trivia:
Ever jump one of these??

 


steve1  (D 23640)

Jan 23, 2005, 2:36 PM
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Ever jump one of these?? Can't Post

This picture shows an old Travel Air that we jumped out of in Missoula about 75. I doubt if any of these are still flying. They were once used by Johnson's Flying Service for dropping smoke jumpers.....Steve1


(This post was edited by steve1 on Jan 23, 2005, 2:37 PM)
Attachments: travel air.jpg (99.8 KB)


mjosparky  (D 5476)

Jan 23, 2005, 7:51 PM
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Re: [steve1] Ever jump one of these?? [In reply to] Can't Post

No, but I did jump one of these a couple of times.Tongue

Sparky
Attachments: B-25.jpg (120 KB)


packing_jarrett  (D License)

Jan 23, 2005, 9:15 PM
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how many people did it hold and where did you jump out of. Surely not the bomb bay because military versions bomb bay was completey exclusive for people getting into in flight.


slug  (B License)

Jan 23, 2005, 11:41 PM
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In reply to:
No, but I did jump one of these a couple of times.Tongue

Sparky

Thanks for the pic sparky.

Wing wars was definately going on, Mostly pigs with a lot of blast handles. Maybe mid to later 70's? One of my dorment periodsFrown

BTW nice looking birdTongue

R.I.P.


mjosparky  (D 5476)

Jan 24, 2005, 1:06 AM
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In reply to:
how many people did it hold and where did you jump out of. Surely not the bomb bay because military versions bomb bay was completey exclusive for people getting into in flight.


We took 22. On this one you could get to the bomb bay from the back compartment by climbing over a bulkhead about 5 feet high. The bomb bay door were locked open. Some people exited through the crew hatch just behind the nose gear, three rode up in the bomb bay and the rest came over the back bulkhead. On my first jump I was part of the group in the back compartment and on the second one I was in the bomb bay. You had to straddle it, one foot one each side and hang onto the bombracks. On take off it was scary as hell. Out of 22 we got six people together on the first jump and only 3 on the second. It was a ZOO. But fun.

Slug,

Without digging out old logbooks I would say late 1978 or early 1979.

Sparky


Premier SkymonkeyONE  (D 12501)

Jan 24, 2005, 7:52 AM
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Re: [mjosparky] Ever jump one of these?? [In reply to] Can't Post

Did you put the requisite "Z" in your logbook? New skydivers have absolutely no idea what that letter or any of the other commonly used acronyms stand for.


Dougiefresh  (Student)

Jan 24, 2005, 7:56 AM
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Quote:
You had to straddle it, one foot one each side and hang onto the bombracks. On take off it was scary as hell.

ShockedShockedShocked
Holy crap, you guys were hard core!

...now I wanna try... Laugh


lawrocket  (Student)

Jan 24, 2005, 8:54 AM
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Quote:
Did you put the requisite "Z" in your logbook? New skydivers have absolutely no idea what that letter or any of the other commonly used acronyms stand for.

I'll bite. I'm new. What does the "Z" stand for?


mjosparky  (D 5476)

Jan 24, 2005, 9:59 AM
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In reply to:
Did you put the requisite "Z" in your logbook? New skydivers have absolutely no idea what that letter or any of the other commonly used acronyms stand for.

No, I wrote out the wrote out the word. From my logbook. "Turned to shit right of the bat, was a Zoo. I caught the base and Rich in third."

Sparky


steve1  (D 23640)

Jan 24, 2005, 11:53 AM
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Hell, I still go Z at times. Not a good thing!....Steve1


steve1  (D 23640)

Jan 24, 2005, 1:10 PM
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I'll bite. I'm new. What does the "Z" stand for?
It's an old Spanish term....It originated with a man named Zorro in Mexico. He used his sword to carve it into people and things to let them know Zorrow had been there.....I think that's it!.....Steve1


steve1  (D 23640)

Jan 24, 2005, 2:31 PM
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In reply to:
No, but I did jump one of these a couple of times.Tongue

Sparky....which one is you?


Premier wmw999  (D 6296)

Jan 24, 2005, 2:39 PM
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I believe Sparky would be dead center, front row. Light-colored hair, right under the letters.

Wendy W.


dqpacker  (D 32043)

Jan 24, 2005, 3:36 PM
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Re: [lawrocket] Ever jump one of these?? [In reply to] Can't Post

 

I'll bite. I'm new. What does the "Z" stand for?





ZOO


usedtajump  (D 6813)

Jan 24, 2005, 5:13 PM
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Re: [mjosparky] Ever jump one of these?? [In reply to] Can't Post

Hey Mojo, where was that B-25 pitcure taken and when? A couple of those people look somewhat familiar and the location and time frame would help place the names with the face.


Godamn mojosparky, you still jump a Sharpchuter?? My compliments. WinkWink


mjosparky  (D 5476)

Jan 24, 2005, 6:17 PM
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In reply to:
I believe Sparky would be dead center, front row. Light-colored hair, right under the letters.

Wendy W.

No more calls, we have a winner. Wendy is right on the money. And the hair was actually light-colored back then.Tongue

The picture was taken late 78 or early 79 and it was taken at Taft airport. Also got to jump an AT-6 that day. Which one or ones are you looking at, maybe I can help.

Sparky


Premier wmw999  (D 6296)

Jan 25, 2005, 5:41 AM
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And if you Z'd (or Z'd out) then you were your own individual little zoo load, all by yourself.

Not that I'd know about that first-hand or anything Tongue

Wendy W.


usedtajump  (D 6813)

Jan 25, 2005, 4:12 PM
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Standing, second from left and kneeling second from right.


mjosparky  (D 5476)

Jan 25, 2005, 6:20 PM
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In reply to:
Standing, second from left and kneeling second from right.

Sorry Steve, I don't know either on of them. After looking at the picture for a few minutes, I dawned on me, I don't know the names of some of the people I do know.Tongue

Its hell getting old.

Sparky


Premier Tonto  (D 515)
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Jan 26, 2005, 5:32 AM
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In reply to:
ShockedShockedShocked
Holy crap, you guys were hard core!

Were?

Are you implying some sort of backstepping has occured?Tongue

t


Premier SkymonkeyONE  (D 12501)

Jan 26, 2005, 6:18 AM
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Re: [lawrocket] Ever jump one of these?? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Quote:
Did you put the requisite "Z" in your logbook? New skydivers have absolutely no idea what that letter or any of the other commonly used acronyms stand for.

I'll bite. I'm new. What does the "Z" stand for?

Z is the letter you put in your logbook when you were out of control. Back in the day of little blue logbooks with 10 jumps per page, you just wrote down a series of letters and symbols to show what you did. For example, stylies would often have "RT, LT, BL, LT, RT, BL" and a 45 second delay student might have "RT, LT, BL, FL, and a little triangle "delta" symbol" If you got out of control at any point of your skydive you would insert a "Z" where it occured.

Chuck


Premier Tonto  (D 515)
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Jan 26, 2005, 7:18 AM
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Re: [SkymonkeyONE] Ever jump one of these?? [In reply to] Can't Post

So what's the bet a new newbie will ask "What does RT, LT, BL, LT, RT, BL stand for?"

Do people still know what a full series was?

t


mjosparky  (D 5476)

Jan 26, 2005, 8:20 AM
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In reply to:
In reply to:
Quote:
Did you put the requisite "Z" in your logbook? New skydivers have absolutely no idea what that letter or any of the other commonly used acronyms stand for.

I'll bite. I'm new. What does the "Z" stand for?

Z is the letter you put in your logbook when you were out of control. Back in the day of little blue logbooks with 10 jumps per page, you just wrote down a series of letters and symbols to show what you did. For example, stylies would often have "RT, LT, BL, LT, RT, BL" and a 45 second delay student might have "RT, LT, BL, FL, and a little triangle "delta" symbol" If you got out of control at any point of your skydive you would insert a "Z" where it occured.

Chuck

What do you mean, back in the days of the little blue logbooks? I still use them. They have change a little, remember when the pages were yellow paper, and you can get them through Para-Gear.Cool

Remember when you had to do a complete series in less then 15 seconds to get you "D" lic.

Sparky
Attachments: Logbook10009.JPG (79.3 KB)
  Logbook20007.JPG (98.9 KB)


IanHarrop  (C 1152)

Jan 26, 2005, 10:14 AM
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In reply to:
They have change a little, remember when the pages were yellow paper, and you can get them through Para-Gear.

My first book has green pages.

I don't know what the colour of the paper is now but CSPA still sells something similarSmile.

http://www.cspa.ca/...rchandise/Index.html

---
edited cause my computer still hasn't figured out how to translate what I am thinking into proper English when my fingers type on the keyboard.


(This post was edited by IanHarrop on Jan 26, 2005, 11:26 AM)


slug  (B License)

Jan 26, 2005, 10:31 AM
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In reply to:
So what's the bet a new newbie will ask "What does RT, LT, BL, LT, RT, BL stand for?"

Do people still know what a full series was?

t

Can't a newbie do all that stuff in a tunnel.Angelic

I've never seen a tunnel from in/out sideShocked

R.I.P.


steve1  (D 23640)

Jan 26, 2005, 11:14 AM
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Anybody remember the little red jump logs. They each held a hundred jumps and most everyone had them in the early 70's......Steve1


usedtajump  (D 6813)

Jan 26, 2005, 4:25 PM
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In reply to:
In reply to:
Standing, second from left and kneeling second from right.

Sorry Steve, I don't know either on of them. After looking at the picture for a few minutes, I dawned on me, I don't know the names of some of the people I do know.Tongue

Its hell getting old.

Sparky

Yep, I sure know what you mean.UnsureUnsure


sprtdth  (D 4730)

Jan 26, 2005, 5:30 PM
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Yea, I remember jumping "The Shady Lady" I was in the load that took off from Shafter (where the plane was from) to Taft. There were 6 of us stuffed in the radioman's compartment, right behind the pilot and co-pilot. Everybody else is in the back or the bomb bay. The pilot tries to start No. 1, it caughs, sputters, caughs, sputters and stops. The co-pilot turns around and looks at us and says "We've been having a little trouble with No.1" We look at each other, shrug, and figure so what, it has 2 engines.
Get No.1 started, damn it's hot in this little compartment. Try and start No.2, same as No.1, caugh, sputter...... The co-pilot again turns around and says "Yea, we've been having a little trouble with No.2 too". We did a quick count and came up with, you guessed it, we only have 2 engines and they've been having a "little" trouble with both!!! About that time some of us were wishing we would have stuck with jumping his BT-13. That only has one engine, but at least it runs. Dwight (the pilot) got things squared away and off we went. The backfire on take rotation really got our attention tho


mjosparky  (D 5476)

Jan 26, 2005, 10:51 PM
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In reply to:
Yea, I remember jumping "The Shady Lady" I was in the load that took off from Shafter (where the plane was from) to Taft. There were 6 of us stuffed in the radioman's compartment, right behind the pilot and co-pilot. Everybody else is in the back or the bomb bay. The pilot tries to start No. 1, it caughs, sputters, caughs, sputters and stops. The co-pilot turns around and looks at us and says "We've been having a little trouble with No.1" We look at each other, shrug, and figure so what, it has 2 engines.
Get No.1 started, damn it's hot in this little compartment. Try and start No.2, same as No.1, caugh, sputter...... The co-pilot again turns around and says "Yea, we've been having a little trouble with No.2 too". We did a quick count and came up with, you guessed it, we only have 2 engines and they've been having a "little" trouble with both!!! About that time some of us were wishing we would have stuck with jumping his BT-13. That only has one engine, but at least it runs. Dwight (the pilot) got things squared away and off we went. The backfire on take rotation really got our attention tho

Frank, are you in the picture, if so which one is you?

Sparky


Premier SkymonkeyONE  (D 12501)

Jan 27, 2005, 7:43 AM
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For my D-license I had to have an intentional water jump, two night jumps, and turn that style series in time. I had the "optional" two-point 8-way as well, but that's besides the point. Likewise, my original D license (which I of course still have) says "Master." That doesn't seem long ago at all to me, but some people look at you like you have a dick growing out of your forehead when you tell them that stuff.

Chuck Blue
D-12501


Premier wmw999  (D 6296)

Jan 27, 2005, 9:54 AM
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(Wendy checks original D license picture -- nope, no dick Tongue)

Wendy W.


sprtdth  (D 4730)

Jan 27, 2005, 6:59 PM
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No Sparky I'm not. Some of the people in the photo are: kneeling right Mike Tulysuski, kneeling left Jimmy Tyler(?). Standing 5th from right Jim Stinson, 8th from right Mike McFarlin(?). Some of the other faces I know, the names are WAY too many brain cells ago


mjosparky  (D 5476)

Jan 28, 2005, 12:07 PM
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In reply to:
No Sparky I'm not. Some of the people in the photo are: kneeling right Mike Tulysuski, kneeling left Jimmy Tyler(?). Standing 5th from right Jim Stinson, 8th from right Mike McFarlin(?). Some of the other faces I know, the names are WAY too many brain cells ago

Frank,

Here are the ones I can remember:

Kneeling from the left, Jimmy Tyler, died jumping Half Dome, next Bill Parsons, Dick Pedley, died on a base jump in L.A., Me, Richard Brooks.
Standing, tall guy in the center, Chuck Dodson, on his left, John Miller.
The guy kneeling on the far right, don't remember his name, drown in the canal under at Taft under a reserve.

Sparky


usedtajump  (D 6813)

Jan 28, 2005, 4:31 PM
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Bill Parsons? The video Bill Parsons i knew in theas in the 80s? Man, if it is the same Bill Parsons he sure changed after he got here. Shocked


mjosparky  (D 5476)

Jan 31, 2005, 2:35 AM
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Bill Parsons? The video Bill Parsons i knew in theas in the 80s? Man, if it is the same Bill Parsons he sure changed after he got here. Shocked

Yes, the same Bill Parsons. I saw him at Old Farts this year and he has changed, but I guess most of us have.

Sparky


mjosparky  (D 5476)

Jan 31, 2005, 2:40 AM
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In reply to:
Yea, I remember jumping "The Shady Lady" I was in the load that took off from Shafter (where the plane was from) to Taft. There were 6 of us stuffed in the radioman's compartment, right behind the pilot and co-pilot. Everybody else is in the back or the bomb bay. The pilot tries to start No. 1, it caughs, sputters, caughs, sputters and stops. The co-pilot turns around and looks at us and says "We've been having a little trouble with No.1" We look at each other, shrug, and figure so what, it has 2 engines.
Get No.1 started, damn it's hot in this little compartment. Try and start No.2, same as No.1, caugh, sputter...... The co-pilot again turns around and says "Yea, we've been having a little trouble with No.2 too". We did a quick count and came up with, you guessed it, we only have 2 engines and they've been having a "little" trouble with both!!! About that time some of us were wishing we would have stuck with jumping his BT-13. That only has one engine, but at least it runs. Dwight (the pilot) got things squared away and off we went. The backfire on take rotation really got our attention tho

Hey Frank,

Small world, I jumped with another of the jumpers the were the load from Shafter to Taft. He told the same story about the engines.
Remember Norm Van Pelt. Well he just got married to Phil Christman's daughter, Patti and some of Air Trash went up to make a jump with him and celebrate.

Sparky


sprtdth  (D 4730)

Feb 14, 2005, 8:05 PM
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Hey Sparky,
The date of the B-25 jump was 13 May '78. I've got another picture I'll get scanned one of these days.
So Norm and Patty got married, and my "Evil Big Brother" (Norm) didn't let me know! I'll have to call and congratulate him.
I started jumping when I was 16. Norm and Richard Armstrong took me under their wing to teach me RW. My Mom used to bake Norm cookies just so he wouldn't bounce me! Guess it worked in spite of myself!


mjosparky  (D 5476)

Feb 15, 2005, 12:02 AM
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In reply to:
Hey Sparky,
The date of the B-25 jump was 13 May '78. I've got another picture I'll get scanned one of these days.
So Norm and Patty got married, and my "Evil Big Brother" (Norm) didn't let me know! I'll have to call and congratulate him.
I started jumping when I was 16. Norm and Richard Armstrong took me under their wing to teach me RW. My Mom used to bake Norm cookies just so he wouldn't bounce me! Guess it worked in spite of myself!

Norm took you under his wing. Now that is a scary thought.Tongue
The 13th. was Sat. and the 14th. was Sunday. That weekend I jumped a B-25, AT-6, Grumman Tiger and Spikes D-18. I had less then 200 jumps and was jumping a Piglet. Good weekend.

Sparky


NSEMN8R  (D 26397)

Feb 16, 2005, 5:58 AM
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I assume you were all belly flyers back then, right? I mean you couldn't freefly in those rigs could you?

It's funny cuz it looks like they're all wearing FF suits.


Premier wmw999  (D 6296)

Feb 16, 2005, 6:02 AM
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Quote:
It's funny cuz it looks like they're all wearing FF suits.

From where I am, it looks like freeflyers are wearing old, but post wing war, RW suits Laugh

Wendy W.


steve1  (D 23640)

Feb 16, 2005, 11:27 AM
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I quit in the mid 70's, but even then jump suits were getting baggier and baggier. Most everyone I knew during that time frame had bells on both arms and legs. Grippers weren't invented yet, so most people would grab a handful of material when they took grips....Steve1


NSEMN8R  (D 26397)

Feb 16, 2005, 2:13 PM
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I searched this forum and this is the only time it's come up so I gotta ask..

What's wing war?


Premier wmw999  (D 6296)

Feb 16, 2005, 2:25 PM
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Quote:
What's wing war?

In the late 70's, people realized that more drag meant longer freefalls. Since you tend to run out of time when building formations, the thought was that more freefall was better.

So wings got bigger and bigger (i.e. the bells on arms and legs, and the fabric between the wrists and the waist). Then there were the inflatable jumpsuits (Krueger Balloon suit and its ilk). Just as now the lightest jumpers have to wear weights, then the heaviest jumpers had to get more and more fabric, because even light jumpers had big suits.

I was 5'4", weighed about 125 lbs, and had a "medium" jumpsuit. Which meant swoop cords, fabric all the way from my wrist to my waist, and very baggy bottoms that were closed in. The large would have had extremely baggy bottoms, and more fabric overall. The fabric was stiffer, too, so that it had more body. The attempt to make them as big as possible were the wing wars.

Eventually folks realized that
a. this CAN go too far -- lighter people can go faster, but there's a limit to how much slower the anvils can go
b. slower doesn't necessarily mean cleaner flying.

So now we have the skintight suits with spandex, and the light people wear weight so they can fall with the anvils. And if the anvil is the leader, well, the light people just have to wear even more weight.

Wendy W.


mjosparky  (D 5476)

Feb 16, 2005, 5:09 PM
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In reply to:
I assume you were all belly flyers back then, right? I mean you couldn't freefly in those rigs could you?

It's funny cuz it looks like they're all wearing FF suits.

Like Wendy said, we are not wearing FF suits, all of you are wearing "wing war" RW suits. If you stay in the sport long enough you will see everything come full circle.Smile

Sparky


mjosparky  (D 5476)

Feb 16, 2005, 5:22 PM
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When I was jumping a "Silly Suit" it had more material in the wings then my Hobbi Cat had in the sails.Crazy And back then I only weighed 155 lbs.

Sparky


steve1  (D 23640)

Feb 16, 2005, 6:33 PM
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Here's a couple pictures showing the jump gear and suits worn in the mid 70's.....Steve1
Attachments: 1974.jpg (37.9 KB)
  1975.jpg (98.7 KB)


slug  (B License)

Feb 16, 2005, 9:06 PM
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Hi steve

We still got our "Bunny" helmet.

I recognize the pop top reserve in the first pic, Butt whats the reserve called in the second pic? was that one of the Jerry Bird reserve's we heard about?.

R.I.P.


mjosparky  (D 5476)

Feb 16, 2005, 9:34 PM
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In reply to:
Here's a couple pictures showing the jump gear and suits worn in the mid 70's.....Steve1


Here is one from the 1978 Nationals at Richmond.

4 are dead, and only 3 are still jumping.Tongue

Sparky


(This post was edited by mjosparky on Feb 16, 2005, 9:36 PM)
Attachments: Perris load.jpg (89.1 KB)


darkwing  (D 4164)

Feb 17, 2005, 4:56 AM
Post #49 of 102 (1119 views)
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Re: [mjosparky] Ever jump one of these?? [In reply to] Can't Post

Here's one that won 4-way at the Nationals in 1978 and 79... Wanna do some 4-way in that?
Attachments: jumpsuit_1978.jpg (20.2 KB)


Premier wmw999  (D 6296)

Feb 17, 2005, 5:24 AM
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Re: [slug] Ever jump one of these?? [In reply to] Can't Post

Yep, a Jerry Bird rip-off reserve (well, at least we called it that -- the velcro has a distinctive sound...).

The teardrop shape is supposed to make it easier to get close on exit.

Wendy W.


NSEMN8R  (D 26397)

Feb 17, 2005, 5:30 AM
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Wow! It's amazing how much things have changed. Just the other day I was talking to a couple of "newer" guys and I was feeling like 8 yrs in the sport was a long time. This really puts things in perspective for me. I feel like a newby again. I guess compared to you guys I am.

I was going to ask what average fall rates were in those huge suits, but I'm guessing there weren't protracks back then eitherWink


NSEMN8R  (D 26397)

Feb 17, 2005, 5:37 AM
Post #52 of 102 (1566 views)
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Re: [steve1] Ever jump one of these?? [In reply to] Can't Post

With the reserve on your front, were you supposed to flip over onto your back to dump it?


Premier wmw999  (D 6296)

Feb 17, 2005, 5:51 AM
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Re: [NSEMN8R] Ever jump one of these?? [In reply to] Can't Post

Yep. Bring your feet and knees together, butt into a sitting position. Cover your capewells with one arm to prevent snagging, and pull and punch your reserve with the other.

And nope, no protracks. The Paralert (predecessor to the Dytter) came out about 1983 or so I think. We had to use slide rules to calculate our speed TongueWink

Wendy W.


airtwardo  (D License)

Feb 17, 2005, 9:18 AM
Post #54 of 102 (1552 views)
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In reply to:
Yep. Bring your feet and knees together, butt into a sitting position. Cover your capewells with one arm to prevent snagging, and pull and punch your reserve with the other.

Quote:

And...put your face into the arm covering the
Capewells...that springie thingie hitting
you in the nose makes for icky stains on
the jumpsuit! Unsure


steve1  (D 23640)

Feb 17, 2005, 9:18 AM
Post #55 of 102 (1552 views)
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Re: [NSEMN8R] Ever jump one of these?? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
With the reserve on your front, were you supposed to flip over onto your back to dump it?

We may not have been trained properly. Covering your cape-wells makes sense, but noone ever told us that at my drop zone.

I only had two malfunctions back then. Both times I was pretty unstable. I had my feet and knees together in an inverted position, and then pulled the loops on my capewells. I had my elbows in tight to my side when I pulled my reserve (similiar to a military inverted paratrooper position). Both times, I went over on my side when my reserve strung out. Both times the reserve openned okay, but again my body position was far from ideal.....The new gear is sure a whole lot better!....Steve1


steve1  (D 23640)

Feb 17, 2005, 9:24 AM
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In reply to:
Hi steve

We still got our "Bunny" helmet.

I recognize the pop top reserve in the first pic, Butt whats the reserve called in the second pic? was that one of the Jerry Bird reserve's we heard about?.

R.I.P.

Things were changing quickly during this time period. I never packed a Jerry Bird reserve, but I did pack a couple pop tops....They were a real pain to get closed up right (if I remember correctly). I never owned a bunny helmet. It seemed like some of the better jumpers were going to them. I stuck with my good ole motorcycle helmet.....Steve1


airtwardo  (D License)

Feb 17, 2005, 9:29 AM
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In reply to:
We may not have been trained properly.

Quote:

Doing a two way, my partner was supposed
to pull out of it...he had bent a pin on exit
and I got a real close up view of the proprer
proceedure for a total...

He rolled over, looked at me (10 feet away)
...shook his head and dumped.

24' Flat un-modified...
It looked like it bent him in half BACKWARD!

On the ground I asked him if he was shaking
his head beacuse he knew a reverse jack knife
was coming...

"No...I was more worried about a terminal
opening blowing up the reserve...after the back
of my head hit my heels...I kinda wish IT HAD!"
Tongue


steve1  (D 23640)

Feb 17, 2005, 9:30 AM
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Re: [darkwing] Ever jump one of these?? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Here's one that won 4-way at the Nationals in 1978 and 79... Wanna do some 4-way in that?

Now, that is a nice set of wings! No one dared go that big in 75. But 78....that was a whole different ball game.....Steve1


steve1  (D 23640)

Feb 17, 2005, 9:49 AM
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Airtwardo,
We had a girl in our club who was nick-named "Total". She was really weak and wasn't strong enough to pull her ripcord on her four pin B-12 container. Twice she openned her belly, 24 ft. reserve, going terminal. She started lifting weights and got an easier rig to open, but she didn't quit. She was made of tougher stuff than I was....Steve1


mjosparky  (D 5476)

Feb 17, 2005, 12:24 PM
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In reply to:
Here's one that won 4-way at the Nationals in 1978 and 79... Wanna do some 4-way in that?

I did and it was like driving a Diesel truck in a road race.TongueSmile In 1978 at the nationals, some computer geek figured out that a 99 way box formation would slow down enough to land. Right! Computers were kinda new back then.

Sparky


mjosparky  (D 5476)

Feb 17, 2005, 12:31 PM
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In reply to:
In reply to:
With the reserve on your front, were you supposed to flip over onto your back to dump it?

We may not have been trained properly. Covering your cape-wells makes sense, but noone ever told us that at my drop zone.

I only had two malfunctions back then. Both times I was pretty unstable. I had my feet and knees together in an inverted position, and then pulled the loops on my capewells. I had my elbows in tight to my side when I pulled my reserve (similiar to a military inverted paratrooper position). Both times, I went over on my side when my reserve strung out. Both times the reserve openned okay, but again my body position was far from ideal.....The new gear is sure a whole lot better!....Steve1

I was taught with a total to look, pull, punch. You kept you left arm out and this caused you to go to your back for deployment. And damn that hurts.

A 24' flat is biased constructed with continuous lines. I have seen them take 450 pounds at 135 knots. They are tough.

Sparky


mjosparky  (D 5476)

Feb 17, 2005, 12:34 PM
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In reply to:
The teardrop shape is supposed to make it easier to get close on exit

Did you ever put a piece of plywood on your rig and park your car on it overnight? That would allow you to get one more between the door and the fusalage in 10 way lineup.

Sparky


Premier wmw999  (D 6296)

Feb 17, 2005, 2:25 PM
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Quote:
In 1978 at the nationals, some computer geek figured out that a 99 way box formation would slow down enough to land.

Hmmm... My computer geek boyfriend said it would take a 220-way box, about that time.

He said it'd suck to be the guy who went low.

Wendy W.


usedtajump  (D 6813)

Feb 17, 2005, 4:11 PM
Post #64 of 102 (1512 views)
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Re: [mjosparky] Ever jump one of these?? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:
The teardrop shape is supposed to make it easier to get close on exit

Did you ever put a piece of plywood on your rig and park your car on it overnight? That would allow you to get one more between the door and the fusalage in 10 way lineup.

Sparky

HAHAHAHAHAHA!! Damn, I forgot about that one. I know folks that would cut the manufacturers tags out of underwear, t shirts, shoes, frap hats, etc. trying anything to make themselve lighter. Anything for an advantage.Crazy


mjosparky  (D 5476)

Feb 17, 2005, 7:22 PM
Post #65 of 102 (1492 views)
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Re: [usedtajump] Ever jump one of these?? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:
In reply to:
The teardrop shape is supposed to make it easier to get close on exit

Did you ever put a piece of plywood on your rig and park your car on it overnight? That would allow you to get one more between the door and the fusalage in 10 way lineup.

Sparky

HAHAHAHAHAHA!! Damn, I forgot about that one. I know folks that would cut the manufacturers tags out of underwear, t shirts, shoes, frap hats, etc. trying anything to make themselve lighter. Anything for an advantage.Crazy

First rule of "10 way", If you ain't cheat'n, you ain't try'n.

Sparky


Premier wmw999  (D 6296)

Feb 18, 2005, 5:25 AM
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Quote:
I know folks that would cut the manufacturers tags out of underwear, t shirts, shoes, frap hats, etc. trying anything to make themselve lighter.
I remember Larry Yohn telling me he'd put his Paradactyl on just two risers instead of 4 to save the weight of the other 2 risers.

Why not just pee before jumping?

Wendy W.


mjosparky  (D 5476)

Feb 18, 2005, 7:59 AM
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In reply to:
Quote:
I know folks that would cut the manufacturers tags out of underwear, t shirts, shoes, frap hats, etc. trying anything to make themselve lighter.
I remember Larry Yohn telling me he'd put his Paradactyl on just two risers instead of 4 to save the weight of the other 2 risers.

Why not just pee before jumping?

Wendy W.

Wendy,

Larry's rig had a Paradactyl as both main and reserve. And both canopies were on just 2 risers. If you broke one line on a dactyl it was a bad canopy.Tongue Go figure.

Sparky


Premier wmw999  (D 6296)

Feb 18, 2005, 8:28 AM
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I thought I remembered that, but wasn't sure. Of course, 2 risers on reserves was pretty common. He told me he felt he'd achieved the perfect weight personally, and therefore took what he could out of the rig instead.

Wendy W.


mjosparky  (D 5476)

Feb 18, 2005, 10:40 AM
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In reply to:
I thought I remembered that, but wasn't sure. Of course, 2 risers on reserves was pretty common. He told me he felt he'd achieved the perfect weight personally, and therefore took what he could out of the rig instead.

Wendy W.

Larry wasn't wrapped real tight on some things.Crazy He cut the other 2 reserve risers off of his rig.

Sparky


crewdog2  (D 5770)

Feb 18, 2005, 12:45 PM
Post #70 of 102 (1436 views)
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Re: [mjosparky] Ever jump one of these?? [In reply to] Can't Post

A 24' flat is biased constructed with continuous lines. I have seen them take 450 pounds at 135 knots. They are tough.

Sparky
Yeah, the 24' flat was pretty rugged. And cheap. I had a couple of rides on one (none terminal). Only paid $50 for it.

Reading Airtwardo's post about his partner's bent pin and subsequent reserve ride reminded me of a situation one of my friends got into back in 1978.

This guy was big boy who didn't own a rig. All he had was a Paracommander in a bag with a hotdog pilot chute attached to it. He had permanently borrowed a student B-12 container from our club to pack the PC in and would check out a chest-mounted 24' flat to use on the weekends.

One Saturday my buddy comes smoking in right over the packing area with what looked like a bag lock. The bag and a few line stows were out, and that's it. I thought for sure I was going to witness a fatality when at around 800 ft. he goes feet first and dumps that 24' flat. BLAMO! I've never seen anyone come to such a complete stop so fast in all my life. He just hung there in the harness for a few seconds and then drifted across the street and landed. We raced over to meet him in the club's ambulance (like the kind you see on the old *MASH* show). We found him standing there in the middle of the reserve with the main bag and a few line stow hanging down one side. When asked if he was alright, he replied: "Wow, that was pretty intense!"

After examining his gear, we discovered that one of the hooks on a pack opening band had dug all the way through the container and snagged lines on the bag preventing its deployment.

Russ
Attachments: ft. campbell photos 1.JPG (78.5 KB)


steve1  (D 23640)

Feb 18, 2005, 1:01 PM
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Re: [crewdog2] Ever jump one of these?? [In reply to] Can't Post

The hooks on the old pack opening bands (or bungies) were a definite hazard. I used to use a pair of pliers to tighten the hooks slightly, so they hopefully wouldn't come unhooked and snag something else on opening.

Another hazard on exit, with the old b-12 containers, was hitting the top of the door and bending the stiffener which held your rip cord housing to the container. This could result in a really hard pull.

Getting back to the old pack opening bands. I had a friend who, when he traveled, used to hook one of these (on his belly reserve) over his rip cord handle. When he got to where he was going to jump he'd remember to fasten it up right. He didn't want to accidently snag his handle on anything in his trunk. One day he forgot to hook it up right. That was the day he cut away and died. The bungie was over the top of his reserve handle, and he couldn't pull his reserve.

There's been five fatalities in Montana that I know of. Three burned in using the old gear and two died from turns too close to the ground on modern gear. There may be others. I was out of the sport for about 25 years.....Steve1


(This post was edited by steve1 on Feb 18, 2005, 1:29 PM)


steve1  (D 23640)

Feb 18, 2005, 1:40 PM
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In reply to:
Here's a couple pictures showing the jump gear and suits worn in the mid 70's.....Steve1

What I wouldn't give for a full head of hair like that again! (Picture #2) I'm kind of follickly challenged now....(Anyone know how to spell follickly? I couldn't find it in my dictionary) Another definition might be balder than a cucumber.....Steve1


RogerRamjet  (D License)

Feb 18, 2005, 2:20 PM
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In reply to:
Quote:
In 1978 at the nationals, some computer geek figured out that a 99 way box formation would slow down enough to land.

Hmmm... My computer geek boyfriend said it would take a 220-way box, about that time.

He said it'd suck to be the guy who went low.

Wendy W.

It would be a bummer to be everyone else if anyone chickened out at a few hundred feet and pulled out of it....


fergs  (F 383)

Feb 18, 2005, 4:39 PM
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Re: [wmw999] Ever jump one of these?? [In reply to] Can't Post

 

And nope, no protracks. The Paralert (predecessor to the Dytter) came out about 1983 or so I think. TongueWink

Wendy W.
Wendy,

from memory, my first paralert was 1980 or 81.

It was great!

fergs


airtwardo  (D License)

Feb 18, 2005, 11:49 PM
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In reply to:
Another definition might be balder than a cucumber.....Steve1

Quote:

We're not losing our hair ole buddy...

We're "Gettin' more head!"

Cool


(For me the glass is ALWAYS 1/2 full...Sly)


airtwardo  (D License)

Feb 19, 2005, 12:04 AM
Post #76 of 102 (1380 views)
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Re: [mjosparky] Ever jump one of these?? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
A 24' flat is biased constructed with continuous lines. I have seen them take 450 pounds at 135 knots. They are tough.

Quote:

My first rig was a Stylemaster...
Pap main and a 23' Tri-Con with the lateral bands
and Taffeta material.

It was supposed to be the strongest reserve around
at the time...I was a large economy size skydiver.
Blush

It had an inverted mesh "T", red steering lines that
I saw a few too many times...and those nifty metal
4-line release rings...for when ya REALLY needed
that extra drive!
Cool

They didn't seem to give much extra forward drive,
but sure increase your VERTICAL speed!
Shocked


mjosparky  (D 5476)

Feb 19, 2005, 10:21 AM
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Re: [airtwardo] Ever jump one of these?? [In reply to] Can't Post

How I long for the "Good old days".Tongue

Just got a call and in about 2 months I will be test jumping a 24' con., the GQ 6000. It is going to be used in the seat for the JSF. Should be fun.Crazy Yea, right.

Sparky


steve1  (D 23640)

Feb 19, 2005, 11:20 AM
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Quote:

We're not losing our hair ole buddy...

We're "Gettin' more head!"

Cool


(For me the glass is ALWAYS 1/2 full...Sly)

Oh, that's a funny one Airtwardo. I'll have to remember that one.

That reminds me of a good joke.....There was once a guy who went into a bar for a drink. It took his eyes a while to adjust to the dim lights. Then he noticed this guy at the bar sitting next to him who had a head about the size of a softball. He couldn't help but stare at this strange sight.

The guy with the tiny head noticed the guy staring at him and said, "I know you're wondering what in the world happened to my head, aren't you?"

Well it's a long story. For years I saved my money, and then one day I bought this big sail boat, quit my job, and went sailing far out into the ocean. Things were going great until one day, I was caught in this big storm and was ship wrecked on a desert island.

One day I was walking along the beach hoping to be rescued when I spotted this bottle on the beach. There was some dust on it so I rubbed some of it off and suddenly out of the bottle appeared this beautiful genie. The genie said, "I have three magic wishes for you Master."

Well I couldn't believe my good fortune! For my first wish I asked for a new sail boat, and "shazam" there was a new sail boat.

Then I asked for a million dollars and "shazam" there was a million dollars.

About then I started noticing what a good looking babe this genie was. So I asked her, "Genie, how about a little head." And "Shazam" you know the rest of the story!.....Steve1


airtwardo  (D License)

Feb 19, 2005, 1:38 PM
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Re: [mjosparky] Ever jump one of these?? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Just got a call and in about 2 months I will be test jumping a 24' con...

Quote:

By "Test Jump" I'm guessing that it will
be your FIRST jump on it ?!?!?!?!?
TongueSly


mjosparky  (D 5476)

Feb 19, 2005, 6:10 PM
Post #80 of 102 (1345 views)
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Re: [airtwardo] Ever jump one of these?? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:
Just got a call and in about 2 months I will be test jumping a 24' con...

Quote:

By "Test Jump" I'm guessing that it will
be your FIRST jump on it ?!?!?!?!?
TongueSly

No, it will be the first live jumps on it, not just my first.

Sparky


airtwardo  (D License)

Feb 19, 2005, 6:48 PM
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In reply to:
No, it will be the first live jumps on it, not just my first.

Quote:

So....TWO case of beer?!
TongueCool


mjosparky  (D 5476)

Feb 19, 2005, 11:00 PM
Post #82 of 102 (1355 views)
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In reply to:
In reply to:
No, it will be the first live jumps on it, not just my first.

Quote:

So....TWO case of beer?!
TongueCool

They won't let me drink beer while test jumping. You how some people are.Angelic

Sparky


bozo  (D 10154)

Feb 20, 2005, 7:16 AM
Post #83 of 102 (1345 views)
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Re: [mjosparky] Ever jump one of these?? [In reply to] Can't Post

So....TWO case of beer?!
TongueCool

They won't let me drink beer while test jumping. You how some people are.Angelic

Sparky--------------------------------------------------------

You old guys dont drink that much anyway.

bozo


mjosparky  (D 5476)

Feb 20, 2005, 8:15 AM
Post #84 of 102 (1341 views)
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In reply to:
So....TWO case of beer?!
TongueCool

They won't let me drink beer while test jumping. You how some people are.Angelic

Sparky--------------------------------------------------------

You old guys dont drink that much anyway.

bozo
I resemble that remark!TongueSmile

How you doing Jimbo?

Sparky


sundevil777  (D License)

Feb 20, 2005, 1:11 PM
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Re: [mjosparky] Ever jump one of these?? [In reply to] Can't Post

You actually have to land it? Can you choose to land in water or deep snow?


mjosparky  (D 5476)

Feb 20, 2005, 4:34 PM
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In reply to:
You actually have to land it? Can you choose to land in water or deep snow?

Most of the time you have to land them, and it is not your decision where to land. I guess thats why they call it testing.Shocked I prefer land on land over water. On land, once I touch down it over. On a water landing, once you touch down things can start to get busy in a hurry.
A couple of years ago I was involved in testing a water activated canopy release made by Koch & Sons for ejection seats. I spent 2 days being towed around Big Bear lake behind a boat. That gets old in a hurry. The land portion of the testing was a cake walk. Towed behind an ATV, dry, warm and I could stand up and have a donut between setups.Cool
It is amazing what a PLF will do for an old man landing a nylon hammer.CrazySmile

Sparky


bozo  (D 10154)

Feb 20, 2005, 5:58 PM
Post #87 of 102 (1303 views)
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Re: [mjosparky] Ever jump one of these?? [In reply to] Can't Post

ou old guys dont drink that much anyway.

bozo
I resemble that remark!TongueSmile

How you doing Jimbo?

Sparky--------------------------------------------------------
Jimbos doing ok.....weather sucks here just like where you are. Looking at Elsinore in the very near future if the rain ever quits.

bozo


mjosparky  (D 5476)

Feb 20, 2005, 7:03 PM
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In reply to:
ou old guys dont drink that much anyway.

bozo

I resemble that remark!TongueSmile

How you doing Jimbo?

Sparky--------------------------------------------------------
Jimbos doing ok.....weather sucks here just like where you are. Looking at Elsinore in the very near future if the rain ever quits.

bozo
Let me know when.

Sparky


diablopilot  (D License)

Feb 21, 2005, 11:08 PM
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Quote:
Just got a call and in about 2 months I will be test jumping a 24' con., the GQ 6000. It is going to be used in the seat for the JSF. Should be fun. Yea, right.

Do they give ya free samples?Tongue I could use a 24' LoPo for a "project"Laugh


mjosparky  (D 5476)

Feb 21, 2005, 11:15 PM
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Haven't even seen one yet. But I see what is available.Tongue

Sparky


airtwardo  (D License)

Feb 22, 2005, 7:09 AM
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In reply to:
Haven't even seen one yet. But I see what is available.

Quote:
And I could test a new Corvette....!
Sly


jbrasher  (D 5166)

Feb 24, 2005, 8:50 PM
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Re: [mjosparky] Ever jump one of these?? [In reply to] Can't Post

You buy the beer and I'll watch Wink


airtwardo  (D License)

Mar 10, 2005, 10:10 PM
Post #93 of 102 (1106 views)
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Re: [mjosparky] Ever jump one of these?? [In reply to] Can't Post

http://www.dropzone.com/...jpg&img=&tt=

Ever jump one of these?

Not only did I get to jump it...

I flew it to Altitude...!Cool

Quote:


mjosparky  (D 5476)

Mar 10, 2005, 11:14 PM
Post #94 of 102 (1100 views)
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Re: [airtwardo] Ever jump one of these?? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
http://www.dropzone.com/...jpg&img=&tt=

Ever jump one of these?

Not only did I get to jump it...

I flew it to Altitude...!Cool

Quote:

I hate you!Mad

Sparky


airtwardo  (D License)

Mar 11, 2005, 8:42 AM
Post #95 of 102 (1073 views)
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Re: [mjosparky] Ever jump one of these?? [In reply to] Can't Post

What do you mean, back in the days of the little blue logbooks? I still use them. They have change a little, remember when the pages were yellow paper, and you can get them through Para-Gear.

Quote:

Mine was red...

They were great!

VERY little room to elaborate on your screw-ups!
Angelic
Attachments: redlog.jpg (81.1 KB)


poppenhager  (D 47)

Mar 11, 2005, 3:54 PM
Post #96 of 102 (1037 views)
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Re: [airtwardo] Ever jump one of these?? [In reply to] Can't Post

The SSE Inc. (Steve Snyder) log book.I am still using one.Had a bunch of them left over when I retired from the DZO business in 84.
POP D47


airtwardo  (D License)

Mar 11, 2005, 4:08 PM
Post #97 of 102 (1036 views)
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Re: [poppenhager] Ever jump one of these?? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
The SSE Inc. (Steve Snyder) log book.I am still using one.Had a bunch of them left over when I retired from the DZO business in 84.
POP D47


Quote:

I think I bought one from you in the 70's!

Came to your place with some guys from
TRACKERS Inc.

D288...Al Beverly and company.Smile


jimp

Mar 13, 2005, 2:18 PM
Post #98 of 102 (988 views)
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Re: [poppenhager] Ever jump one of these?? [In reply to] Can't Post

I've always used the single-line entry log book, and make a column for aircraft number - you know, N9440C, N211WW, that kind of thing.


steve1  (D 23640)

Mar 14, 2005, 11:40 AM
Post #99 of 102 (948 views)
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Re: [airtwardo] Ever jump one of these?? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
[

I flew it to Altitude...!Cool

Quote:

My Dad used to fly co-pilot in the early day Tri-motors when he was a kid during the 40's. He came to Western Montana (from Idaho) when he was still in High School and lived with Bob Johnson, (the owner of Johnson's flying service). He helped work on Johnson's fleet of Tri-motors and Travel-airs in Missoula. When he first started working, a mechanic sent him on an errand to go get some propellor pitch.

Although the Tri-motors and Travel-airs dropped lot's of smoke jumpers, they seemed really underpowered and took forever to get to jump altitude...Steve1


airtwardo  (D License)

Mar 14, 2005, 12:10 PM
Post #100 of 102 (941 views)
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Re: [steve1] Ever jump one of these?? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
sent him on an errand to go get some propellor pitch.

Quote:

And 20 feet of flight line...a bucket of prop wash...
Tongue

That Tri-Motor was owned by the brother of a
friend I worked with in San Diego...

My friend found out I was going to Sun & Fun
(EAA Airshow in Lakeland Fla.)
and told me to stop by and say hi to his Bro.

Al Chaney says to me...
So I here you're a pilot...wanna fly it...
jump out of it ..........or BOTH!
SmileCool


Another one of those one jump~
Two case of beer deals!!
Sly


poppenhager  (D 47)

Mar 14, 2005, 4:44 PM
Post #101 of 102 (421 views)
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Re: [jimp] Ever jump one of these?? [In reply to] Can't Post

Jim, Those numbers ring a bell!! N9440C (C-180) and N211WW (Beaver) I beleive they used to belong to me...POP
In reply to:


wdy_bnckr  (D 624)

Mar 15, 2005, 2:04 AM
Post #102 of 102 (406 views)
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Re: [poppenhager] Ever jump one of these?? [In reply to] Can't Post

We use to jump a Tri-Motor Ford at Wings and Wheels, Santee S.C. Dolf Overton(Korean War Ace) own alot of late model aircraft and cars. The year was 1966. Anybody remember that..Woody B..D624



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