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Cypress Fires New Rule- Perris

 

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Premier billvon  (D 16479)
Moderator
Nov 21, 2004, 10:05 PM
Post #226 of 239 (1249 views)
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Re: [mjosparky] Cypress Fires New Rule- Perris [In reply to] Can't Post

>Do you have any wide based study to back up this statement or are
> you going by just the ones you have seen. 5-10% sounds like a
> guess on your part.

Well, per a discussion a while back, I seem to recall that SSK sells about 100-150 cutters a year. Per SSK's website, there have been 293 saves through Aug 03. Of those, about half were students, and about 1 in 10 were 'jumper pulled just as cypres fired.' So per the numbers about 20 per year, 10 of which are students. That gives you 13% for everyone, 7% for experienced jumpers.

My experience is lower than that. I've seen (or talked to people about) 12 cypres fires this year, and none were due to no-pulls.


mjosparky  (D 5476)

Nov 21, 2004, 11:41 PM
Post #227 of 239 (1239 views)
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Re: [billvon] Cypress Fires New Rule- Perris [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
>Do you have any wide based study to back up this statement or are
> you going by just the ones you have seen. 5-10% sounds like a
> guess on your part.

Well, per a discussion a while back, I seem to recall that SSK sells about 100-150 cutters a year. Per SSK's website, there have been 293 saves through Aug 03. Of those, about half were students, and about 1 in 10 were 'jumper pulled just as cypres fired.' So per the numbers about 20 per year, 10 of which are students. That gives you 13% for everyone, 7% for experienced jumpers.

My experience is lower than that. I've seen (or talked to people about) 12 cypres fires this year, and none were due to no-pulls.

From 1991 to 2003 Cypres claims 293 saves. If "1 in ten" were "jumper pulled just as cypres fired", that leaves 260+ or 18% using 125 for cutters sold each year. I don't see a difference between students and experienced on this, the ground doesn't care.

In any case, it is 260 or so more people who would have quit jumping on that day without a cypres.


Squeak  (E 1313)

Nov 22, 2004, 3:34 AM
Post #228 of 239 (1226 views)
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Re: [mjosparky] Cypress Fires New Rule- Perris [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:
>Do you have any wide based study to back up this statement or are
> you going by just the ones you have seen. 5-10% sounds like a
> guess on your part.

Well, per a discussion a while back, I seem to recall that SSK sells about 100-150 cutters a year. Per SSK's website, there have been 293 saves through Aug 03. Of those, about half were students, and about 1 in 10 were 'jumper pulled just as cypres fired.' So per the numbers about 20 per year, 10 of which are students. That gives you 13% for everyone, 7% for experienced jumpers.

My experience is lower than that. I've seen (or talked to people about) 12 cypres fires this year, and none were due to no-pulls.

From 1991 to 2003 Cypres claims 293 saves. If "1 in ten" were "jumper pulled just as cypres fired", that leaves 260+ or 18% using 125 for cutters sold each year. I don't see a difference between students and experienced on this, the ground doesn't care.

In any case, it is 260 or so more people who would have quit jumping on that day without a cypres.

I'm a tad confused if there has been 293 save all up, why are they selling 100-150 cutters per year over 12 years that's a shit load more cutters than saves?


meatbomb  (D 100967)

Nov 22, 2004, 5:27 AM
Post #229 of 239 (1210 views)
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Re: [Squeak] Cypress Fires New Rule- Perris [In reply to] Can't Post

Quote:
I'm a tad confused if there has been 293 save all up, why are they selling 100-150 cutters per year over 12 years that's a shit load more cutters than saves?

I make that about 1000+ misfires Tongue


kallend  (D 23151)

Nov 22, 2004, 6:51 AM
Post #230 of 239 (1196 views)
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Re: [mjosparky] Cypress Fires New Rule- Perris [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:
>

Kallend,

Have you ever had to remove someone from one of your classes for disruptive behavior? Or maybe I should put it this way. Has there ever been a student in one of your classes who's behavior affected the other students in a negative way and should have been removed?

Agreed is spelled with an "r".

Sparky

No. And I've been teaching since 1968.

There's always an opportunity for a learning experience.


(This post was edited by kallend on Nov 22, 2004, 7:02 AM)


Premier billvon  (D 16479)
Moderator
Nov 22, 2004, 9:10 AM
Post #231 of 239 (1174 views)
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Re: [Squeak] Cypress Fires New Rule- Perris [In reply to] Can't Post

>I'm a tad confused if there has been 293 save all up, why are they
>selling 100-150 cutters per year over 12 years that's a shit load more
>cutters than saves?

Because most cypres fires happen when a jumper deploys too low and the cypres fires. That's not considered a save.


docjohn  (D 13182)

Nov 30, 2004, 5:26 PM
Post #232 of 239 (1077 views)
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Re: [bbarnhouse] Cypress Fires New Rule- Perris [In reply to] Can't Post

If my Cypress ever saves me (other than from being knocked unconcious), I'm quitting skydiving. It would just prove that I'm not cut out for this sport but I've been given a second chance on life.


Premier billvon  (D 16479)
Moderator
Nov 30, 2004, 5:43 PM
Post #233 of 239 (1071 views)
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Re: [docjohn] Cypress Fires New Rule- Perris [In reply to] Can't Post

>I'm quitting skydiving.

I know a great many people who have said that; only two have actually quit. I've had it (almost) happen to me 2-3 times, and I wouldn't have quit skydiving any of those times.

Here's a thought experiment - would you quit skydiving if your cypres fired because someone was holding on to your right hand as you passed 1500 feet?


Deuce  (D 25597)

Nov 30, 2004, 5:52 PM
Post #234 of 239 (1070 views)
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Re: [billvon] Cypress Fires New Rule- Perris [In reply to] Can't Post

Quote:
would you quit skydiving if your cypres fired because someone was holding on to your right hand as you passed 1500 feet?

I would have to if it was a malevolent hold. They don't let you skydive in jail, and that's where I'd be once we landed. I don't think that sort of thing is funny.

If I had exposed my hands to a tandem student and they grabbed them and I wasn't able to get (either) hand back by the hard deck, after biting the crap out of their neck, I would probably quit tandem skydiving. I do get the willies about folks who think a tandem skydive is just an expensive roller coaster ride.

Skydiving is dangerous. It tends to kill the easily distracted and careless.


Squeak  (E 1313)

Nov 30, 2004, 10:59 PM
Post #235 of 239 (1043 views)
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Re: [billvon] Cypress Fires New Rule- Perris [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
>I'm quitting skydiving.

I know a great many people who have said that; only two have actually quit. I've had it (almost) happen to me 2-3 times, and I wouldn't have quit skydiving any of those times.

Here's a thought experiment - would you quit skydiving if your cypres fired because someone was holding on to your right hand as you passed 1500 feet?

Why would you not have deployed earlier than 1500 anyways, I'm reasonably sure that their grip would not hold after deployment.


(This post was edited by Squeak on Nov 30, 2004, 11:01 PM)


Premier billvon  (D 16479)
Moderator
Dec 1, 2004, 9:24 AM
Post #236 of 239 (967 views)
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Re: [Squeak] Cypress Fires New Rule- Perris [In reply to] Can't Post

>Why would you not have deployed earlier than 1500 anyways, I'm
>reasonably sure that their grip would not hold after deployment.

Cause when someone is holding onto your right hand and trying to force it on to the dummy ripcord, you can't deploy your main. I was reaching for my reserve when he realized what I was doing and let go of my right hand. Even though I had my hand on my reserve, and even though I knew my cypres (which I had gotten a few days previous) would probably fire, I opened my main anyway; I couldn't stop myself.

I was open by about 1100 feet, and fortunately my cypres didn't fire.


Casurf1978  (A License)

Dec 1, 2004, 11:24 AM
Post #237 of 239 (931 views)
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Re: [billvon] Cypress Fires New Rule- Perris [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
I opened my main anyway; I couldn't stop myself.

Just curious, so basically instinct or what you've done naturally for 13+ years took over: go for the main. Still a very damn scary story.


Ron

Dec 1, 2004, 11:47 AM
Post #238 of 239 (920 views)
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Re: [Deuce] Cypress Fires New Rule- Perris [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Skydiving is dangerous. It tends to kill the easily distracted and careless.

Not to get picky....But I have seen it kill normally heads up folks that just got distracted or careless once....It only takes once.


opitrack

Dec 2, 2004, 3:12 AM
Post #239 of 239 (838 views)
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Re: [jerm] Cypress Fires New Rule- Perris [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi, I'm interest in the reserve that you have to sale, is it aviable or you've already sold it??? Could you tell me the year of manufacture??? And please, replay to opitrack@dropzone.com, ok??? Thakns a lot, blue skies and lots of jumps!!!!!


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